cahn | (no subject)

I have a lot of reading I need to write up, but right now I want to write up what I read this last week. My parents were here last week, and I spent a lot of time working (while they hung out with the kids) and hanging out with them, of course. But the main thing I was doing when I wasn't doing that (and the reason I haven't been around at all, if I owe you a comment) was betaing (and betaing and betaing and editing and proofing and typesetting -- basically making up for a year of doing some but not a whole lot on) my dad's memoirs. (The deal was that he would play with the kids while I was working on it.) His memoirs are actually really fascinating reading.

-It is a fricking miracle, actually multiple miracles, that my dad survived until adulthood, and even more miraculous that he turned out mostly functional. There are so many times when he should have just died (like, literally died: that time when his mother died when he was a couple of months old and his aunts fed him rice water because, hey, milk is white and rice water is kinda white too, and he was so malnutritioned his father poked him with his finger and the skin didn't bounce back -- or the time he would have drowned in the ocean as a kid in Korea except a boat of tourists happened to show up in the nick of time -- or that time when he was 8 and he and his friend were playing by taking turns pounding on a LIVE bazooka shell because it was just there on the ground after the Korean War (fortunately a military officer happened to be walking by and told them to stop before they triggered it; other little kids who came across live ammunition and decided to play with it were not so lucky) -- or that time as a teenager in NYC (this was after his parents kicked him out) when he was this close to dying from an infection and his home teaching companion happened to find him and also happened to be a doctor-in-training who could give him antibiotics), and even more times that he ought to have just given up or turned into something super nonfunctional.

-I complain about my parents sometimes. They're not perfect, but, like, my parents are actually really great in any number of ways, not least that I've never doubted that they really love me and want the best for me (even if we often disagree quite a lot on what "the best" is or how one gets there). My dad's father and stepmother (his mother died when he was a couple of months old) were... basically just completely and utterly awful. Well, my dad was never physically or sexually abused (even spanked, the lack of which was apparently not typical), but that's pretty much ALL you can say about them. (He was basically not given any parental warmth or support -- probably they didn't spank him because they could not have cared less -- he was farmed out to other relatives (in extremely poor living conditions) for years at a time (multiple times), and finally kicked out of the house at age 17. We are all pretty sure they didn't love him at all.) I mean, I knew this well, just, after reading it all in one place I know it more, and there are lots of little details I didn't know, like the farming out multiple times (I had sort of conflated them all into one time).

(Yes, Frederician fandom, this is another example of therapy-by-memoir. Dad has never been to therapy and never will, but I think writing this all out -- and, probably, equally, seeing his family read it -- has been therapeutic and validating for him.)

-His stepmother S. was a Piece of Work (again, something we have always known) and his memoir makes it clear how badly she treated him. But then we get passages like this, which happened when my dad was 6 (he had lived with his grandmother until then) [YS is my dad's older sister, my grandfather's oldest child]:

When we arrived at my father’s house, my father and my new stepmother came out of their house to greet us. I was intimidated and was afraid to go close to my father and his new wife. My father introduced his mother and YS to his new wife. “This is my mother and my daughter YS, as I told you.”
S curiously then asked her husband, “Who is that boy?”
My father hesitated and looked away from his wife.
Then S said, “You told me that you just had a daughter.”

...I mean, it's not exactly a secret in our family either (at least my nuclear family) that my dad's father was a piece of crap too. (My dad's memoir makes it clear that we owe him something for being the first in his family to have a sense of education being the key to success... but that's about the only thing.) But, yeah, if you read between the lines, S., while she absolutely does not get a pass for treating YS and my dad like utter crap (which she did her whole life, even after they came to the US and were reasonably secure), had a life that was... not great. Therapy for everyone, yeah.

-My sister edited some of this before she got sick and had to stop. It is kind of hilarious because the voice will sometimes change from my dad's voice to a voice which sounds to my ear much more like a 21st-century American. (Not always, to be fair -- I like a number of her edits. But sometimes...)

I got about halfway through; fortunately, I expect the second half to take less long because a) I have now done most of the wrestling with Microsoft Word (GAH) b) I've actually done an editing pass on the second half already (I hadn't even ever read the first half before). I don't know when I'll do the rest. I'd really like to do it soon if I can, because there is a LOT of redundancy (it is really clear where my inability to communicate things in a straight line came from) and I have to filter all that out, which is easier to do if I do it all at once.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

From:

sophia_sol

Wow, that sounds fascinating to be able to read through your dad's memoirs like that to get a better sense of what his life was like and what difficulties he went through! It sounds like a LOT.

From:

cahn

It was a lot! Fortunately his life has been a lot less eventful for the past few decades! But yes, it is fascinating and I'm really glad he's written it down.

From:

thistleingrey

I'm glad he wrote, and glad you and your sister are reading.

My mother nearly died a bunch of times in childhood, too, starting in infancy. Some of it was time/place, I guess.

From:

cahn

Yeah, I'm glad he wrote and that we're reading too.

Yeah, the combination of ignorance/negligence/situational-danger I suppose was fairly common for that time/place. My mother is ten years younger than my dad and grew up in somewhat different (less reduced, less rural, more familial oversight) circumstances, and as far as I know she didn't have that kind of multiple near-escape. But I am not sure, because she doesn't talk about it and refuses to write anything down, although she told me it was because her life wasn't very interesting, so...

From:

thistleingrey

My nearest aunt said once, flatly, "Nothing interesting happened," and I was like !! but she'd forgotten that I already knew (when rather small) via my father that wars made childhood "interesting." I did know not to press her--it wouldn't have worked in her case; sometimes people really don't want to speak, and sometimes (my mother's case) they really, really want to speak, though sometimes there aren't ears to listen, thus part of my feeling glad that you and your sister are reading....

Edited (forgot a whole word :() Date: 2021-08-20 03:44 am (UTC)

From:

cahn

Mmmmph. Right, that reminds me that my parents' first child (four years before I was born) only lived a few weeks (congenital heart defect) which was as you can imagine just completely devastating. My mom doesn't avoid the subject (she was probably the one who told me about it?) but... yeah, besides the bare facts of it, she doesn't talk about it at all and doesn't want to (and doesn't want to think about it, which is her way of dealing with things). But you're right, my dad really has always wanted to talk about this stuff, and though a lot of it he's told us in bits and pieces, at least for me it was hard to understand until I saw it all in one place, if that makes any sense.

From:

thistleingrey

Ah, that's so hard. (My miscarriage before Reason had a presumed heart defect: heart stopped, anyway.) And yes, understood re: seeing it in one place. For me and my various family histories (three sets of displacements), the sense I'd made of some parts isn't the same as the sense that a lived-through-it participant has/had. It doesn't mean either is wrong, but having some access to the participant's version is a gift.

From:

cahn

Yes, absolutely, it's really a gift to be able to see how all this looked through his eyes and as a coherent whole looking back. It is making sense of a lot of things for me as to how he approached our family life, for example, that I never thought of before.

From:

skygiants

That sounds really fascinating! My grandfather wrote out his memoirs, and we eventually had them bound as a ninetieth birthday present, but none of us actively edited them; I'm glad he wrote and you're getting a chance to read.

From:

cahn

Your grandfather's English is probably better than my dad's :) (He's been in the country for... more than sixty years, now, but he came over at age 17 so he still has a lot of trouble with English grammar and editing is a bit in self-defense :) ) But yes, I'm really glad he wrote and that I get to read it!

From:

mildred_of_midgard

Wooow, that's...a lot less surprising than it would be if I hadn't read half a dozen or so memoirs by North Korean refugees in the last couple years. But I haven't read anything by anyone who grew up in South Korea, only people who escaped *to* it. Your father's memoirs sound super interesting. I'm glad you're getting to read them. Are they just for the family, or is he planning to publish? I will buy a copy!

-It is a fricking miracle, actually multiple miracles, that my dad survived until adulthood, and even more miraculous that he turned out mostly functional.

Seriously! That's crazy. I mean, I'm surprised *my* mother turned out as functional as she did, and hers wasn't anywhere near your father's!

(Yes, Frederician fandom, this is another example of therapy-by-memoir. Dad has never been to therapy and never will, but I think writing this all out -- and, probably, equally, seeing his family read it -- has been therapeutic and validating for him.)

I bet. My grandmother did therapy by talking to her daughter, who wasn't really old enough to be her mother's therapist. :/ (My grandmother is one of those "I'm surprised she turned out as *non*functional as she did" cases. Her and my sister.)

Therapy for everyone, yeah.

Therapy for everyone, the mantra of Frederician fandom!

Speaking of which...

(He was basically not given any parental warmth or support -- probably they didn't spank him because they could not have cared less -- he was farmed out to other relatives (in extremely poor living conditions) for years at a time (multiple times), and finally kicked out of the house at age 17. We are all pretty sure they didn't love him at all.)

“You told me that you just had a daughter.”

Frederick of Wales says hi.

From:

cahn

He was toying with the idea of publishing ~~and dreamed of becoming a best-selling author~~, but as a family we kind of... have been discouraging him from this path? Partially because publishing is such a roll of the dice, and although he has pretty good self-esteem I personally kind of feel like given that he's writing this as therapy, the publishing process might not be so therapeutic... But another reason is that he has a lot of things to say about his father and stepmother that their children (besides his full sister mentioned above (deceased), he has three half-siblings, two of whom are living, and all of whom have children who were reasonably close to their grandparents (we were, of course, not at all close)) might... not really like to hear. But now that I've read the whole thing, it really is interesting enough that I think it could be published.

But if I ever get finished with this editing process, and he decides definitively not to publish, I will send you an e-copy! I'm not sure his style is all that, but the content is sure interesting.

Therapy for everyone, the mantra of Frederician fandom!

I think this has got to be the mantra of any historical fandom! Not least including "a generation or two ago in Korea."

From:

mildred_of_midgard

given that he's writing this as therapy, the publishing process might not be so therapeutic... But another reason is that he has a lot of things to say about his father and stepmother

Yes, this all makes sense. Well, let me know if and when I can obtain a copy through one means or another!

I think this has got to be the mantra of any historical fandom! Not least including "a generation or two ago in Korea."

That actually depends. At least for me. For many historical periods, I can look at what was going on at a societal level, and think, "Wow, all these wars and famines and anarchy, I'm sure everyone needed therapy!" But having the historical documentation to actually see who needed therapy for what...is actually kinda rare. Like my Diocletian fandom, we know virtually nothing about him before he turned 40 and became emperor.

Look, here's Wikipedia on his first 40 years:

Diocletian was born near Salona in Dalmatia...some time around 244 into a Greek family, thus he could speak both Latin and Greek fluently. His parents gave him the Greek name Diocles, or possibly Diocles Valerius. The modern historian Timothy Barnes takes his official birthday, 22 December, as his actual birthdate. Other historians are not so certain. His parents were of low status; Eutropius records "that he is said by most writers to have been the son of a scribe, but by some to have been a freedman of a senator called Anulinus." The first forty years of his life are mostly obscure. The Byzantine chronicler Joannes Zonaras states that he was Dux Moesiae, a commander of forces on the lower Danube. The often-unreliable Historia Augusta states that he served in Gaul, but this account is not corroborated by other sources and is ignored by modern historians of the period. The first time Diocletian's whereabouts are accurately established, in 282 [i.e, when he was 38]...

And this is one of the big-name Roman emperors. Frederician fandom spoils us with historical documentation! This part-time Classicist spent the first few months of salon silently boggling at the amount of data we have. :) I remember I could not believe that I could open YouTube and listen to something and think, "My problematic fave composed this!"

So while some historical fandoms are like 18th century Europe, many are not. And thus this is my "therapy for everyone!" fandom.

No question about Korea in the second half of the 20th century, though. :/

From:

cenozoicsynapsid

That is crazy! I recently read my dad's memoirs, and they were... not nearly so hair-raising.

Therapy for everyone, yeah.
Yeah. Given my dad's experiences with his own father, I think that the survivors of such traumatic experiences will never go to therapy themselves, but their kids will need too! Even though they love them and want what's best for them.

From:

cahn

The terrible thing is that when we were kids we thought it was a joke about him being malnourished -- I grew up thinking it was a thing he joked about, not that he actually was so malnourished he might well have died. (Partially I didn't realize because as a result of this my dad is obsessed with health and exercise, and is quite possibly the healthiest and most fit person in our extended family despite being almost eighty, so you'd never guess he'd been malnourished at all.) I mean, I think he never corrected us because he actually liked that as kids we had no conception of what it must have been like (a lot of his purpose in raising us was that we would NEVER have to go through ANYTHING like what he went through). But... still.

And yeah, absolutely, it's rather disconcerting how love and wanting the best for someone.... might well not be enough.