cahn | The Jewish War: First half of Book 6

Last week: Sieges are awful. Josephus tells us that Titus really totally felt bad about all the awfulness (even though he didn't stop them) and there is a theory that maybe by "us" he meant "Berenice." Titus had dancing boys?? (Josephus does not mention any, sadly.) Does Samuel the Lamanite in the Book of Mormon owe anything to Josephus speaking truth to the wicked? Unclear. Talmud on the Sages vs. the Zealots as an interesting correlated story to Josephus. Poppea's complexity including both an interest in (conversion to?) Judaism as well as being ruthless; comparison to Constantine's much better press.

This week: The temple is destroyed.

Next week: End of Book 6.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

From:

cenozoicsynapsid

J seems to emphasize in this section how close the Jews come to a successful defense... despite the obvious futility of their effort, as we have already discussed. The Romans (if they can do nothing else) can just starve them out. In fact, what he doesn't say is that Titus is pressing the assault--- with predictably high casualties for his men--- precisely because Vespasian needs to begin his reign as emperor with a triumph over the Judeans. This is what is setting the timetable. Ladders, storming the breach, the futile efforts to break in at night, are all the strategems that an impatient commander uses to trade bodies for time. I wonder if the soldiers' efforts to fire the temple are based to some extent on their understanding that Titus will continue to incur heavy casualties until the city is successfully taken.

I do think that, whatever the assumptions about the temple, Titus did not just decide to treat Jerusalem like Carthage. In fact, Carthage is a good comparison: Rome wins three Punic Wars before deciding to finally raze the place. And there will be three Roman-Jewish wars, culminating in Bar Kochva's revolt (about a hundred years from now) when the Romans will decide to raze Jerusalem, replace it with a pagan colony and exile most of the Jews. If they'd wanted to do that on this occasion, they probably would have?

It is interesting that (6.115) some of the upper-class citizens and priests leave Jerusalem and are sent by Vespasian to Gophna. Gophna (just north of Jerusalem) is not the same as Yavneh (Jamnia to the Greeks), but they sound extremely similar. I wonder if J has heard something about the escape of R' Yohanan and his disciples, but has mistakenly inferred that Vespasian sent them to the much nearer city of Gophna rather than to Yavneh, on the basis of the similarity of sounds?

selenak, in our translation also, Sabinus the Syrian is "black-skinned, scrawny, with the flesh compact on him". As you say, it seems uncharacteristic for a Roman historian to say much about skin color, nor was skin color prejudice a major factor in Roman ethnic stereotypes. Perhaps we are just to infer that the glorious Titus can inspire men of any nationality to feats of reckless heroism?

From:

cahn

In fact, what he doesn't say is that Titus is pressing the assault--- with predictably high casualties for his men--- precisely because Vespasian needs to begin his reign as emperor with a triumph over the Judeans. This is what is setting the timetable. Ladders, storming the breach, the futile efforts to break in at night, are all the strategems that an impatient commander uses to trade bodies for time. I wonder if the soldiers' efforts to fire the temple are based to some extent on their understanding that Titus will continue to incur heavy casualties until the city is successfully taken.

Ohhhh, that is really interesting, especially your observation that these are strategies for trading bodies and time.

And there will be three Roman-Jewish wars, culminating in Bar Kochva's revolt (about a hundred years from now) when the Romans will decide to raze Jerusalem, replace it with a pagan colony and exile most of the Jews. If they'd wanted to do that on this occasion, they probably would have?

Ah! I suppose it's not much consolation to Josephus that it could have been worse...

From:

cenozoicsynapsid

Brett Devereaux has some good blog articles about ancient siege tactics. Here (no orcs: https://acoup.blog/2021/10/29/collections-fortification-part-i-the-besiegers-playbook/) and here (with orcs: https://acoup.blog/2020/05/01/collections-the-battle-of-helms-deep-part-i-bargaining-for-goods-at-helms-gate/) are two of them.

From:

cahn

Ahhhhh thank you for this! I should read Brett Devereaux more than I actually do.

From:

selenak

precisely because Vespasian needs to begin his reign as emperor with a triumph over the Judeans. This is what is setting the timetable.

Very good point. We know Vespasian is here to stay until his natural death millenia later, but at the time neither Titus nor anyone else can be sure Vespasian will hang around any longer than the previous three guys. If the Year of the Four Emperors proved one thing, then that the rules from the last century don't apply anymore. Anyone (with an army or two) can become Emperor, and they can be deposed as quickly if they don't demonstrate something that makes them different.

Brushing up my Suetonius has also reminded me that people at the time when Titus post victory at Jerusalem made a little detour to Egypt before heading home to Italy were wildly speculating whether he's going to turn this into the era of the Five Emperors and make his own bid for the throne. (For symbolic reasons - apparantly Titus observed the ritual of the Apis bull, which is something Alexander did back in the day when in Egypt - and also because Egypt is still the breadbasket of the ancient world and whoever has troops there could cut off Rome's supply of grain very fast.) Which he doesn't do, but it gives one a sense of the atmosphere at the time, everything still very jittery and up in the air, with a sense that anything is possible.

Another Suetonius tidbit, this time from the Domition bio, is the reminder that one consequence of the Jewish defeat was that Vespasian ordered the tax the Jews had previously paid to the Temple to be paid to him instead where it was used to rebuild the Temple of Jupiter that had been burned down in the grand climax of the Year of the Four Emperors (with young Domitian and Vespasian's brother inside). (The Temple of Jupiter in Rome and the Second Temple in Jerusalem burning down a year or so apart begs for some mythological connection, btw, but for once, Suetonius, who otherwise loves a good omen, doesn't go there.) Domitian keeps this tax when the Jupiter Temple has finished rebuilding - of course he does - but he also introduces the novelty of people suspected of being undercover Judeans tax evaders having to show their penises to prove they aren't (because of circumsision), and Suetonius comments he can still renember that from being a boy. Good grief.

It is interesting that (6.115) some of the upper-class citizens and priests leave Jerusalem and are sent by Vespasian to Gophna. Gophna (just north of Jerusalem) is not the same as Yavneh (Jamnia to the Greeks), but they sound extremely similar. I wonder if J has heard something about the escape of R' Yohanan and his disciples, but has mistakenly inferred that Vespasian sent them to the much nearer city of Gophna rather than to Yavneh, on the basis of the similarity of sounds?

Could be!

As you say, it seems uncharacteristic for a Roman historian to say much about skin color, nor was skin color prejudice a major factor in Roman ethnic stereotypes. Perhaps we are just to infer that the glorious Titus can inspire men of any nationality to feats of reckless heroism?

I guess. Or it's like with the Essenes - for some reason lost on us Josephus goes into details (in this case, skin colour) that don't really seem to contribute something to the narrative.

From:

cahn

Brushing up my Suetonius has also reminded me that people at the time when Titus post victory at Jerusalem made a little detour to Egypt before heading home to Italy were wildly speculating whether he's going to turn this into the era of the Five Emperors and make his own bid for the throne.

Oh wow, that would be an interesting dark AU, though...

Domitian keeps this tax when the Jupiter Temple has finished rebuilding - of course he does - but he also introduces the novelty of people suspected of being undercover Judeans tax evaders having to show their penises to prove they aren't (because of circumsision), and Suetonius comments he can still renember that from being a boy.

Uh. Well. Okay then.