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cahnAnd including Emperor Joseph II!
from Derek Beales: Joseph II, Volume 2: Against the World, 1780 - 1790:
Joseph's alleged comment to Mozart about the Entführung, "Too many notes", has been taken as evidence of his ignorance. But he probably said something like, "Too beautiful for our ears, and monstrous many notes." It is always necessary to bear in mind, when appraising the emperor's remarks, his peculiar brand of humor or sarcasm. He was usually getting at someone. And he did not use the royal "we". The ears in question were those of the Viennese audience, whom he was mocking for their limited appreciation of Mozart's elaborate music.
(though not gonna lie, I think it is a LOT of notes)
from Derek Beales: Joseph II, Volume 2: Against the World, 1780 - 1790:
Joseph's alleged comment to Mozart about the Entführung, "Too many notes", has been taken as evidence of his ignorance. But he probably said something like, "Too beautiful for our ears, and monstrous many notes." It is always necessary to bear in mind, when appraising the emperor's remarks, his peculiar brand of humor or sarcasm. He was usually getting at someone. And he did not use the royal "we". The ears in question were those of the Viennese audience, whom he was mocking for their limited appreciation of Mozart's elaborate music.
(though not gonna lie, I think it is a LOT of notes)
Books about the Great Elector: until the death of Luise Henriette
Date: 2022-02-18 05:17 pm (UTC)A few topics adressed of interest to yours truly (i.e. no campaigns, sorry, Mildred):
- childhood (seven years all in all) in Küstrin: was mostly perceived by young future Elector as dead boring and somewhat claustrophobic (well, it would! Küstrin the town was small and deeply provincial, and he wasn't often allowed to leave the fortress or it anyway because war). Future Elector hated Latin, wasn't a fast learner and had a temper. No prices for guessing these traits will show up further down the bloodline. That he refused to speak French, however, is a 19th century nationalistic legend. Documents at the time prove he spoke and wrote it. Not exactly on a native speaker level, but avarage for the nobility of his time. (Remember, this is before the Huguenots get into the country. No French nurses for little Elector.) Having now read my share of biographies, including the F1 ones, I feel confident to say the intellectual streak doesn't show oup in the Hohenzollern clan until Sophie Charlotte marries F1, and in no children before Wilhelmine and Fritz. The Elector and his own kids aren't stupid, don't get me wrong. And teenage future Elector, being sent to the Netherlands to study, gets acquainted with religious and political pamphlets there and spots their potential usefulness way before most German princes do. But reading for reading's sake and havng discussions with philiosphers is definitely something that Sophie Charlotte brought into the family.
- Because young Elector didn't have an abusive Dad trauma like Fritz did yet ended up The Great, old school Hohenzollern historians were fond of declaring he got toughened up by the 30 Years War instead, though he only perceived it at a distance, growing up. Luh doesn't think so, but then, he doesn't think either the Elector or Fritz are All That. He will concede it left Young Elector with a massive chip on his shoulder, especially since Brandenburg and his father Georg Wilhelm were at everyone's mercy, with no cash and no army.
(Recall for
Young Elector: Hey, fellow Protestant Princes of the HRE! Wow, that decades long war, am I right? Now, when this mess started, the highest ranking Protestant Prince of the HRE was the Prince Elector of the Palatine. Who got himself voted for as King of Bohemia instead of a Habsburg and lasted all of one winter. There's his oldest surviving son Karl Ludwig now, future Dad of Liselotte, but Elizabeth Stuart his mother hasn't managed yet to get the Electorate back for him, so clearly, there needs to be another leaderof the German Protestants. Which should be me! I'm an Elector and Protestant!
German Protestant Princes: You'e a Calvinist. Most of us are Lutheran. Like, for example, the Prince Elector of Saxony. Saxony is the birthplace of Protestantism, meaning, of Luther. Its Prince Elector was Luther's first protector back in the day. Yes, the Elector of Saxony should definitely be leader of the German Protestant Princes.
Young Elector: That's Calvinist discrimination, for which you'll be sorry. Not least when I marry the most important Protestant Princess of Europe. Hey, cousin Chistina of Sweden, how about it?
Christina, daughter of Gustav Adolf, sixteen years old: I'm a future bisexual icon, will be played by Greta Garbo, and have both a hot countess and a hot Catholic Cardinal in my erotic future. Way out of your league.
Young Elector: Hey, Christina's chancellor, Oxtierna, take my bribery money, think again.
Chancellor Oxtierna: Young man, I have enough income of my own not to need any money from foreign princes. Also, you don't offer nearly enough, no wonder with your poor country.
Young Elector: Grrrr. Argh. Okay. Life goals:
1.) Money, 2.) Standing Army, 3.) Respect #HohenzollernPriorities
Young Elector: Looking at the bridal market, the richest bride currently available seems to be Luise Henriette, sister to William II. of Orange.
Luise Henriette's mother: But I just managed to marry my son off into the Stuart family - he's married the oldest sister of future monarchs Charles and James, Mary. I don't know yet he'll die young and leave behind only one child, future William III who'll marry another Mary Stuart and become King of England. But I do know I love the sound of an English Double Marriage Project. Luise Henriette/Charles sounds like a dream pairing!
Luise Henriette's father: I somehow sense we start a karmic cycle here, but no. I'm fading fast, the English negotiations are taking forever, I'll give her to the Young Elector instead. At least we're related, and also he's spent some years in this country.
Luise Henreitte's mother: Young Elector sucks! He's ugly and pear-shaped!
Diary of a Dutch noble whose dead brother was engaged to LH when they were children and who therefore gets to hang out with the Orange family, reporting tihs family concersation with the insult and, has teen LH then say: I wish I was dead or a farmer, then I could take someone I know, who was to my taste and whom I could love!"
Marriage: proceeds. LH gets a dowry of 120.000 Reichstaler and jewelry worth an additional 60 0000 Gulden. Also, if her brother William II, who has just married into the Stuart family, dies without an heir, she inherits the House of Orange's possessions.
Elector: Now we're talking!
Jürgen Luh: The marriage was unhappy and didn't pick up until she produced Karl Emil, because their first baby died.
Cordula Bschoff: Not true. She mostly travelled with him before that, and wrote that she missed him when she did not. With those kind of put downs from her mother, of course she thought he was awful before the marriage! But once they lived togethe and got to know each other, things were okay. Unlike you, I emphasize that LH was very much into starting and leading model agricultural estates, like grandson FW (but without his temper), founded orphanages and schools left and right and in general they were a team at reabuilding Brandenburg. Which so needed rebuilding. That forms a bond!
Back to the Elector and the House of Orange, because that has Stuart crossover fun potential. As mentioned, William II dies young, and future Willliam III. is just a baby.
Elector: Hey, I totally should be this kid's guardian and regent! I would run the country for you, I'm just that generous and gifted.
Dutch people: We're starting to get suspicious of the House of Hohenzollern. Who do you think you are, Protestant Philippe D'Orleans? No way. The kid has his mother, his grandmother and his aunt, and also some staunchly Republican manly men to do the actual governiing. Stay away!
Fast forward to:
Adult William III: *meets the Elector's sons, future F1 and Ludwiig*
William III: Hey, Elector, me and Mary haven't produced a kid yet, so I was thinking... how about I adopt your boy Ludwig? You have an heir, Karl Emil, and a spare, F1, so you can give me Ludwig. I like Ludwig. And I was always told you have ambitions for your family get your hands on the Netherlands.
Elector: I do, but I am also incredibly insulted at the implication that MY SON, even if it's the son I care least about, should have another guardian than myself. No way!
William III: I'm serious about this, and to prove my honorable intentions, I'm making Ludwig honorary commander of a Dutch infantry regiment. Which even gives him additional income.
Elector: You're up to something else. No one likes Ludwig that much.
William III: I do like Ludwig, but I also want you to end your alliance with my arch enemy Louis XIV and start one with me.
Elector: I knew it! Also, no. Louis hasn't kicked out the Huguenots yet, so he and I are bffs.
Willliam III: I have just discoverd that my grandmother left a last will where she says that the male heir, which is me, should be the guardian of any male related prince he's related to by blood who is still a minor. Which is your son Ludwig. Send him over.
Elector: WTF? That will clearly only accounts for DUTCH PRINCES. I am his father, and you will never get him! Though feel free to leave him the Netherlands.
William: Fine.
Elector: Fine.
Ludwig: I die tragically at age 20 without having ruled anything. And with Dad refusing to see me. Should have gone with cousin William.
The Louise Henriette essay quotes the same letter of hers that the F1 biographies quote, where she says she doesn't want Danckelmann, aka Prussian Severus Snape, yell at Fritzchen but that kindness and gentleness is the way to go. There's also an extra essay on the family life, special emphasis on the first family, which has even more details. In many ways, the instructions of how to educate the princes from the Elector set the role model for future generations. We have the diary of Schwerin (many of the later names show up here, there's even a Lehndorff hanging out with Karl Emil later!). Schwerin was the governor, Danckelmann (Snape) the teacher of F1, Stephani the one of Karl Emil. Schwerin writes inhis diary:
At six I got the princes used to rise willingly and without complaints. (...) Then I knelt beside the princes to pray. (...)n At seven, Herr Stephani made the beginning with the Institutio, first with reading, (...) then with vocabulary and little questions from the catechism, then again with some reading, and then the prince (Karl Emil) is taught in the maps of Europe. After nine, the prince gets taught in writing, andn then until lunch in dancing. After lunch, the prince is allowed to spend the time until 2 with playing, but I have taken care to arrange it so that he only plays games where he learns something at the same time and which drill both his mind and his body. (...) From 2 to 3 o'clock, the prince writes; afterwards, he studies what is given to him until four, half to five or five. (...) At half to nine or nine I bring both princes to bed after having prayed with them once more.
"Playing" usually meant Karl Emil and "Fritzchen" playing with each other, and/or with Schwerin's children. Later when Karl Emil got older, he was also allowed to play chess with Dad. Unfortunately, though, Karl Emil turned out to hate Latin. And have temper trantrums. These led to the following events: with nine years, Tiny Terror Karl Emil hurt a page with bow and arrow, at Christmas 1668, he threatened a Kammerjunker with a gun, then he beat up his page, and in 1671, Karl Emil threatened a gentleman with a pistol.
He - and future F1, if he joined in - was immediately punished. Not with beatings, though. Punishments usually came in the form of the princes losing access to their toys and pets, which were taken away for a few days, and they got house arrest. When Karl Emil threatened Schwerin's daughter, Frau von Blumenthal, with a knife, said knife was broken apart in front of him and thrown out of the window. Moverover, both Karl Emil and future F1 were not allowed to visit their parents. F1 burst into tears and write immediately apologetic letters, Karl Emil needed three days until he asked pardon on his knees (and was admonished by the Elector for an hour), after which all was forgiven.
While the princes did live in a separate household from their parents, they saw them often, otherwise, and when friightening things happened, like a fire of the stables in 1665, they didn't calm down until Schwerin allowed them to go to Luise Henriette who comforted them, and remained with little F1 till he fell asleep. When Luise Henriette died, all three of her surviving sons - Karl Emil, F1 and Ludwig - would not stop crying, and Schwerin took them to his country seat Altlandsberg.
Re: Books about the Great Elector: until the death of Luise Henriette
Date: 2022-02-19 10:31 am (UTC)1.) Money, 2.) Standing Army, 3.) Respect #HohenzollernPriorities
Heee! On point. (Could one do "in this order" variants for the different kings? I'm undecided.)
I feel like "dead or a farmer" has hashtag potential as well. :P
Ludwig: I die tragically at age 20 without having ruled anything. And with Dad refusing to see me. Should have gone with cousin William.
You totally should have. I'm still not quite sure why the Elector was such a bad father for F1 and Ludwig - related to the chip on his shoulder I guess.
Tiny Terror Karl Emil
Well, I had no idea this was a thing, but it seems like a well-deserved moniker going by your list of incidents.
punished. Not with beatings, though.
Interesting! And also unexpected, given that even Wilhelmine got punished with a beating for accidentally hurting little Fritz.
Very entertaining write-up.
Re: Books about the Great Elector: until the death of Luise Henriette
Date: 2022-02-19 01:57 pm (UTC)Heee! On point. (Could one do "in this order" variants for the different kings? I'm undecided.)
I feel F1 and FW2 are outliers who also add "splendor" and "mistresses who love me" to the list, respectively, but otherwise, yeah.
I'm still not quite sure why the Elector was such a bad father for F1 and Ludwig - related to the chip on his shoulder I guess.
To be fair, he seems to have been doing okay being a father to them for as long as Karl Emil was still alive. I.e. there are no ambassadorial reports about snide remarks or put downs , and if he doesn't favor them, or show the intense interest he shows in Karl Emil and which his first wife showed in all the kids, he does see them regularly. Bear in mind, though, he had grown up without siblings, and separated from his parents for the most part. Even taking in mind that noble parents had less interactions with their children anymore, I don't think he had a model to fall back on when it came to grieving with them once his first wife had died. His own solution for the situation was to remarry as quickly as possible because he couldn't stand being alone - and apparantly a mistress was no option -, remember, and while Dorothea did try to win the stepkids before having children of her own, she did show less attention once her own pregnancies started. So you already have an enstrangement brewing that started with the death of Luise Henriette, though it's momentarily papered over, especially since Karl Emil is already a teenager and grown out of his wild phase, just the type of fuuture successor the Elector wants, and Karl Emil gets along very well with his younger brothers.
But once Karl Emil is dead, and F1 becomes Kurprinz, all the chickens come home to roost - the Elector is devastated, and he feels humiliated his new successor is the one with the physical handicap and the gentle, not-manly-enough nature, and seems to have gotten a "should have been you" blame game in his mind with the surviving kid. As for Ludwig, Ludwig is very close to F1 which seems to have tainted him by association. And finally: they made the Elector feel bad about himself. His new kids with Dorothea made him feel good. Bad feedback loop installed.
Well, I had no idea this was a thing, but it seems like a well-deserved moniker going by your list of incidents.
Quite. I suspect it was a combination of him venting his frustrations about the tight teaching schedule and the prince situation, i.e. the problem of him being of higher rank than his teachers and knowing it. There are no more such incidents mentioned once Karl Emil is past puberty, and he also notably never seems to have beaten up his younger brothers but behaved protectively towards them instead, so he's not exactly a replica of Tiny Terror FW. But certainly I would not have wanted to be in chargeof that kid!
No beatings: yes, I thought that was interesting. But then, we're probably looking at this from the wrong perspective - you could make a case that FW's children are the outliers here, because coming to think about it, most later 17th and then 18th century princes and princesses were not spanked or beaten. FW himself wasn't and, if Morgenstern is to be trusted, complained about this, seeing it as parental negligence. Allowing, nay, ordering physical punishment was probably part of his "my children should be raised like I imagine Christian bürgerliche Kinder are!" program.
Disciplinary methods for royal children
Date: 2022-02-20 06:13 pm (UTC)Through a coincidence of timing, my German reading in the last month has give me both an example of this generalization and a counterexample!
In a bio of Maria Carolina of Naples, the author told me that part of Spanish court etiquette (remember that Naples in this period is a Spanish secondogeniture, meaning it's ruled by the younger son of the Spanish king) was that the heir to the throne got a whipping boy. This was meant both to impress on the prince that his person was untouchable, and also that his subjects would pay for any of his misdeeds when he was king, so he should be a good king. (I have a feeling one of these lessons was learned a lot more readily than the other in most cases.)
These whipping boys were chosen from the lowest classes, and ugly, even handicapped children were chosen, so that when they weren't needed as whipping boys any more, they had a career waiting for them as court fools.
(Sigh.)
Ferdinand, who liked hanging out with the lower classes, became lifelong BFFs with his whipping boy, Gennaro. (It's not clear that he learned much about being a good king.)
But on the flip side, his contemporary and cousin, also named Ferdinand for extra confusion, the Duke of Parma*, was apparently brutally disciplined by his governors/tutors as a kid, getting yelled at and even hit and kicked. I read a whole monograph on his upbringing, which I will try to find time to summarize for salon, because I think you guys would find it interesting. (Spoiler: he didn't turn out the way his tutors wanted any more than Fritz turned out the way FW wanted; he just went *even more* in the opposite direction, while learning to be sneaky.)
* Younger brother of Isabella of Parma, future wife of Joseph II. She was his surrogate mother after their mom died, and apparently she had things to say about how being mean to your kids leads to them turning out bad, and being nice to them, which is currently out of fashion, would make them turn out much better. "Exhibit A: my brother" is probably the subtext, according to the author.
(If you're inclined to read it yourself while you wait for me to have time, it's 100 pages and it's the Elisabeth Badinter book,
Re: Disciplinary methods for royal children
Date: 2022-02-21 01:40 pm (UTC)Given Ferdinand's reign and the anecdote of him being asked in his old age to name a single good thing he did for his people, whereupon he was unable to name even one, I think it's safe to say he didn't learn anything. Re: whipping boy, famously the premise of Mark Twain's The Prince and the Pauper, and in fact I associate it not so much with the Spanish as with the Tudors and Stuarts, see also here, where the whipping boy of future Charles I. is identified as William Murray, apparantly also a later life long friend. Though as with Ferdinand, one can't help but conclude the practice did not teach young Charles how to be a good King. (Unless you're Tim Blanning or Henrietta Maria and convinced Charles I. was the best Stuart King ever.) Otoh, Murray got an earldom out of it, not a career as a court fool, so there was that.
ETA: Katte as FW's version of a whipping boy for Fritz, y/y?
Re: Disciplinary methods for royal children
Date: 2022-02-21 03:13 pm (UTC)Yep, I'm incapable of hearing "whipping boy" without thinking of this.
ETA: Katte as FW's version of a whipping boy for Fritz, y/y?
Y. My abandoned WIP where he gets life imprisonment in exchange for Fritz's good behavior is called "Whipping Boy." :)
Re: Books about the Great Elector: until the death of Luise Henriette
Date: 2022-02-24 01:15 am (UTC)This makes me wonder if Fritz was the product of an oral family tradition about how late and lamented Karl Emil was the best.
Re: Books about the Great Elector: until the death of Luise Henriette
Date: 2022-02-22 05:26 am (UTC)I agree!
Re: Books about the Great Elector: until the death of Luise Henriette
Date: 2022-02-24 01:14 am (UTC)Re: Books about the Great Elector: until the death of Luise Henriette
Date: 2022-02-22 05:23 am (UTC)Thank you! :P
Chancellor Oxtierna: Young man, I have enough income of my own not to need any money from foreign princes. Also, you don't offer nearly enough, no wonder with your poor country.
HEE.
So, um. I think I definitely need to know more about Christina's hot countess and hot Catholic Cardinal!
Young Elector: Grrrr. Argh. Okay. Life goals:
1.) Money, 2.) Standing Army, 3.) Respect #HohenzollernPriorities
Hee!
has teen LH then say: I wish I was dead or a farmer, then I could take someone I know, who was to my taste and whom I could love!"
Aw. I mean... yeah, I'm very happy to live in a time and place where I didn't have a partner picked for me!
and when friightening things happened, like a fire of the stables in 1665, they didn't calm down until Schwerin allowed them to go to Luise Henriette who comforted them, and remained with little F1 till he fell asleep.
Aww, this is really sweet.
Queen Christina: a brief summary
Date: 2022-02-22 09:04 am (UTC)So: Daughter of Gustavus Adolphus "Lion of the North", King of Sweden, hero of Protestants and terror of Catholics in the Thirty Years War, and his wife Maria Eleonora. Maria Eleonora was a Hohenzollern (which makes Christina half one), the sister of Georg Wilhelm and aunt of the Great Elector), and one of the Queens, like Juana, who were either mad or classified as such to keep them out of the way or both. Supposedly after Gustav Adolf's death in battle, when he was brought home to Sweden, she insisted he was not to be buried until after her own death, and that the coffin was to remain open so she could look at him whenever she wanted, with the obvious consequences until Chancellor Oxenstierna put guards outside to keep her away and prevent this from continueing. Gustav Adolf had wanted his half sister as regent for his daughter, but Maria Eleonora wanted to be regent and had her sister-in-law banished until, again, Oxenstierna overrode her and had her banished to Castle Gripsholm while putting Christina into her aunt's custody again. The net effect was that Christina grew up raised by people not her mother (first the aunt, then after the aunt's death other foster mothers appointed by Oxenstierna) and never had a relationship with her.
Christina was in one sense a tomboy - famously and often dressed in male clothing - but not in the sense that most people use the term today, because she did love luxury, and jewelry, and male clothing in the 17th century was as fancy and ruffled with lace and silk as female clothing. She also loved books, art, music, theatre, science... but not governing. (One problem if one looks for easy feminist narratives; this wasn't a powerful woman brought down by men.) One positive political action of hers once she came of age was to be pro peace at the end of the 30 Years War when Oxenstierna wanted to fight on and not to make peace with the Catholic Habsburgs, and it's debatable how much of that was a desire for peace and how much the awareness that once peace was there, she'd get a better budget to spend on things she actually enjoyed from parliament.
The hot countess was one Ebba Sparre. Christina wrote her passionate letters, introduced her to the British ambassador as her bedfellow and praised her mind and body, and the one reason why there's a slight question mark on "Were they lovers?" is that people did write more emo letters in the era, and Christina also wrote passionate letters to women she never met but admired. She briefly flirted and considered marrying her first cousin Karl Gustav (who ended up becoming King after her), but not her other first cousin the Elector. (The hot Cardinal comes later.) Like Catherine and Fritz a century later, she tried to collect scientists and philosophers, and did induce Descartes to come to Stockholm. (This is somewhat covered in "The Winter Queen and her daughters", because Christina competed with one of the daughters, Louisa the Mathematician, for Descartes.) Big mistake. Descartes was a late riser, Christina wanted to meet him at 5.a.m in the morning, Descartes caught a cold and died, having greatly regreted his journey to Sweden.
Also coming to Sweden as writers and scientists: Jesuits. Now, Sweden, deeply Lutheran, is THE PROTESTANT NATION of Europe. (No, not England. The Anglican Church courtesy of Henry VIII still had huge Catholic elements in it.) But Christina gets interested in Catholic theology along with being interested in the Jesuits she meets. This will beoome a plot point. By now, gossip about Christina is exploding everywhere, and when she has a guy and his son beheaded for calling her a shameless Jezebel, her until then fairly large popularity in Sweden abruptly ends.
Basically, it all accumulates: Christina created a lot of new noble titles, which needed estates and money, which wasn't good for the population, she's spending money on art and sciences and her faves, she's not really interested in governing (unlike, say, Catherine a century later - Catherine loved her creature comforts, but she also was a hard worker), and she's secretly becoming a Catholic. => Christina decides to abdicate in cousin Carl Gustav's favour. (Though with the caveat that if he dies without an heir, she'll take the crown back.) This she does, and starts to travel through Europe. Including Rome. And when she goes public about having become a Catholic, this is possibly the biggest PR coup of the counter reformation, because of who she is - the daughter of THE PROTESTANTEST PROTESTANT HERO EVER.
Pope Alexander VII. is very happy with her. He becomes progressively less happy when Christina flirts with the hot Cardinal Decio Azzolino, both because this isn't the Renaissance anymore, Cardinals are actually supposed to keep their vows now, and because Decio Azzolino belongs to the progressive party in the Conclave, unlike Alexander, who is a conservative. Decio Azzolino gets transferred to Romania partly because of this for a while, but he gets back, and he and Christina continue their (they insist) platonic relationship till her death (he's at her side when she dies decades later, she leaves her gigantic art collection to him, but alas he only survives her by a few weeks and his heir sells all the art stuff!). This is by far not the only scandal about now Catholic Christina, though. When visiting France, - where she shocks the Grande Mademoiselle, Louis XIV's cousin when going to the theatre with her "applauding the parts which pleased her, taking God to witness, throwing herself back in her chair, crossing her legs, resting them on the arms of her chair, and assuming other postures" - she stuns everyone by having her master of the horse executed in her palace for disloyalty.
Christina: What? I'm a Queen. I had his correspondance read, I had proof, I asked him how, in his opinion, betrayal should be punished, he said by death, I then revealed I meant him and had my guys do as he suggested. That's royal prerogative.
The rest of the world: But... you're not a Queen anymore! That kind of thing is murder without a trial.
Christina: No, it's not. It's execution, with me as judge and jury, as is my royal prerogative. Once a Queen, always a Queen.
Mazarin: Then could you be a Queen back in Rome?
Christina returns to Rome. Where the Pope is askance and now describes her as: 'a woman born of a barbarian, barbarously brought up and living with barbarous thoughts [...] with a ferocious and almost intolerable pride", and "a queen without a realm, a Christian without faith, and a woman without shame". He doesn't want to see her again, but otoh, Azzolino is back from Romania and gets her new staff (the business with the executed Marchese who was her master of the horse let to staff shortage for obvious reasons). Christina continues to live the high life in Rome and occasionally in other European countries on a visit, but it's not all partying. For example, on the very sympathetic side, she was disgusted by the Roman custom of chasing the Jews through the streets in Carnival time, and took the Roman Jews under her personal protection (there's a letter of hers about this, signed "la Regina" - once a Queen, always a Queen), and when Alexander VII died and was replaced by her and Azzolino's pal who became Clement IX, she succeeded in making said new Pope declaring the custom illegal, full stop.
Unlike other famous converts from Protestantism to Catholicism, like, say, Madame de Maintenon, who then became more Catholic than Catholic, Christina never became a fanatic but was one of the rare moderate tolerant people of her age. (Though she pissed off the people of Hamburg - Lutherans - where she was staying at the time Clement became Pope by throwing a spontanous party for the occasion.) When Louis XIV kicked out the Huguenots, she wrote him an indignant letter.
Lastly: when the Polish throne became available because Poland, remember, was an elective monarchy, she put herself forward, her arguments being: a) Catholic, b) Queen experience, c) Old Maid and wants to remain so, thus not inflicting a new dynasty on the country. Clement IX supported her, but the Poles didn't go for it. Christina, having thought better of it in the meantime, said she was okay with this since it allowed her to continue staying with her beloved Azzolino. When she died, she was buried in the Grotte Vaticane in St. Peter's, one of only three women (among 200 plus popes) to whom this honor was extended, still Europe's most prominent Catholic convert, providing people with gossip material for centuries to come.
There are a few conspiracy theories about her, one of whom being that she was intersex, but ambassadorial reports say she menunstruated, and at any rate liking to wear male clothing and being bisexual doesn't mean you're also intersex.
ETA: Trailers for two movies about Christina, neither of whom I've watched but both of which I heard about:
The Girl King
Queen Christina with Greta Garbo in the title role, and that's one surreal trailer because two thirds of it isn't about Christina at all, but solely about Garbo!
Daughter of ETA: Christina shocks everyone by deciding on peace in the Thirty Years War, a scene from the above movie which I just watched, which reminded me that this movie was scripted by Salka Viertel, who was bff (and maybe more) with Garbo, one of the few female scriptwriters in the golden age of Hollywood. Also a left leaning social democratic emigrated Austrian, whose salon became the favourite meeting point for the émigres in Hollywood in the 1940s, a decade later. This movie, however, was produced in 1932 and released in 1933, and Salka Viertel giving Christina a passionate plea for peace and not to impose too harsh conditions on a a defeated Germany, err, on the Catholic German states is both of best and worst timing.
Re: Queen Christina: a brief summary
Date: 2022-02-22 11:51 pm (UTC)I will try to catch up on awesomely informative posts (I still owe you the Great Elector) once I have a weekend where I don't have to work or a workday where I'm too sleep-deprived to do German after work, whichever comes first. (Though the better I get at German, the easier it is to do while sleep-deprived, muahahaha. :D)
Re: Queen Christina: a brief summary
Date: 2022-02-23 05:19 pm (UTC)Re: Queen Christina: a brief summary
Date: 2022-02-24 02:45 am (UTC)Re: Queen Christina: a brief summary
Date: 2022-02-24 02:44 am (UTC)Wow, this was amazingly close to the way Juana was accused of being mad.
Christina was in one sense a tomboy - famously and often dressed in male clothing - but not in the sense that most people use the term today, because she did love luxury, and jewelry, and male clothing in the 17th century was as fancy and ruffled with lace and silk as female clothing.
Ditto Orzelska!
THE PROTESTANTEST PROTESTANT HERO EVER.
I laughed at "PROTESTANTEST." It's funny 'cause it's true!
Christina: No, it's not. It's execution, with me as judge and jury, as is my royal prerogative. Once a Queen, always a Queen.
All the executing and none of the governing responsibilities, I see! Someone wants to have her throne and abdicate it too.
d took the Roman Jews under her personal protection (there's a letter of hers about this, signed "la Regina" - once a Queen, always a Queen)
Using her powers for good! Good for her.
one of only three women (among 200 plus popes)
Who are the other two?
at any rate liking to wear male clothing and being bisexual doesn't mean you're also intersex.
Uh, yes. This reminds me of Lucasta Miller's observation that you can't conclude Emily Bronte was a lesbian because she whistled and was physically strong and liked outdoor activity.
Thank you for this!
Re: Queen Christina: a brief summary
Date: 2022-02-24 06:05 am (UTC)Christina was in one sense a tomboy - famously and often dressed in male clothing - but not in the sense that most people use the term today, because she did love luxury, and jewelry, and male clothing in the 17th century was as fancy and ruffled with lace and silk as female clothing.
I am starting to feel like all the interesting women dressed in male clothing of the era. Massie says Elizaveta and Catherine did this too? (Which is also shown in Ekaterina, and Catherine does look rather cute in male clothing.)
(
Christina wrote her passionate letters, introduced her to the British ambassador as her bedfellow and praised her mind and body, and the one reason why there's a slight question mark on "Were they lovers?" is that people did write more emo letters in the era, and Christina also wrote passionate letters to women she never met but admired.
But... like... bedfellows! Ah well, I suppose I don't really think the lively and fervent Danae ever got it on with Fritz either :P
I did also know about Descartes! I even knew a Queen Christina was involved, although I assumed it was probably not this one because I figured there were probably a bunch of Christinas, knowng history :P
he and Christina continue their (they insist) platonic relationship till her death (he's at her side when she dies decades later, she leaves her gigantic art collection to him, but alas he only survives her by a few weeks and his heir sells all the art stuff!).
<3 I... kind of like the idea of them being platonic life partners, although I suppose that's less likely than not.
For example, on the very sympathetic side, she was disgusted by the Roman custom of chasing the Jews through the streets in Carnival time, and took the Roman Jews under her personal protection (there's a letter of hers about this, signed "la Regina" - once a Queen, always a Queen), and when Alexander VII died and was replaced by her and Azzolino's pal who became Clement IX, she succeeded in making said new Pope declaring the custom illegal, full stop.
Okay, that is super awesome :D
(the business with the executed Marchese who was her master of the horse let to staff shortage for obvious reasons)
heeeee!
Re: Queen Christina: a brief summary
Date: 2022-02-24 03:30 pm (UTC)But did the *most* interesting woman, namely Émilie?
Massie says Elizaveta and Catherine did this too?
So I'm told! Because it allowed them to show off their well-formed legs.
Re: Books about the Great Elector: until the death of Luise Henriette
Date: 2022-02-22 12:22 pm (UTC)I thought so, too, and was also reminded of the letter from Karl Emil to F1 which the F1 biography quoted, from when Karl Emil was allowed to go on a hunting trip: "Herzallerliebstes Brüderchen,
weil Ihr bei Eurer grossen Glückseligkeit da Ihr alllzeit bei Papa und Mama seit, meiner ganz vergesset, so will ich hiermit beweisen, dass ich fleissig an Euch gedenke. Ich hoffe, mein Herzensbrüderchen bald wieder zu sehen."
(Most beloved of little brothers, as you forget me due to your great happiness of being with Mama and Papa always, I shall prove that I'm thinking of you all the time. I hope to see my dearest little brother again soon.)
For a royal family, they were really closely attached to to each other... for as long as Luise Henriette was still alive. Now even under current day conditions, it can happen that a family falls apart when a parent dies. Here the complete falling apart was delayed for a few years until Karl Emil died, but to me it does look like the Elector had zero coping methods for the original loss of Luise Henriette other than remarriage, and because this helped him expected it would work just as well for his sons, was confused when it didn't work out this way, and then angry when things got seriously sour once Karl Emil died, seeing F1 and Ludwig as symbols of his failures.
On a less depressing note, Luise Henriette being a princess of Orange and, if her brother had died without heirs, the Orange heir, is why the Hohenzollern ever after kept "Prince of Orange" (Oranien in German) among their titles - for example if you look at the list of titles in the Zernikow donation document shortly after Fritz' coronation, he calls himself "Prinz von Oranien" there as well. The Dutch kept a baleful eye on this Hohenzollern practice, lest it be a pretext for invasion a la Louis XIV and Spain.
Re: Books about the Great Elector: until the death of Luise Henriette
Date: 2022-02-24 06:06 am (UTC)Re: Books about the Great Elector: until the death of Luise Henriette
Date: 2022-02-24 01:13 am (UTC)Neat, I've put it on my maybe-someday list. (Too expensive and too far away for the now list.)
(I'll keep calling him the Elector, because, as mentioned previously, "Friedrich Wilhelm" is just too confusing.
YES PLEASE. My #1 (tongue-in-cheek) theory for why Fritz picked Karl Emil as a name was that he secretly wanted some freaking variety. :P
(i.e. no campaigns, sorry, Mildred):
Haha, no worries. I don't expect you guys to be into military history, and I can read my own books if I want to know about his campaigns. (I increasingly can even them in German, which opens whole new doors in a very exciting way!)
Or, campaigns: almost the only thing I *can* read about in German. :P
Küstrin the town was small and deeply provincial
Very. Reminder that this is what it looked like in 1921, and I don't have the impression it was *bigger* than this three hundred years earlier. The idea was you needed a fortress to control the approach to Berlin from the east (this became a thing during the Seven Years' War, and again when the Red Army was invading in 1945, and is why it's in ruins today). Not that you needed a large and happening town there.
Future Elector hated Latin, wasn't a fast learner and had a temper. No prices for guessing these traits will show up further down the bloodline.
Hahaha.
"Was ist ds doch vo ein ding: neutralität? Ich verstehe es nicht".
I quoted this to my wife, whose German is juuust good enough that with context she got it, and we had a good laugh together.
Young Elector: Grrrr. Argh. Okay. Life goals:
1.) Money, 2.) Standing Army, 3.) Respect #HohenzollernPriorities
Lol. I was like, "Now where I have seen that list before?"
I wish I was dead or a farmer, then I could take someone I know, who was to my taste and whom I could love!"
Wow. I join the list of people who are glad not to ever been in this position! Even if it turned out better than expected, still not great.
like grandson FW (but without his temper)
I'm seeing a lot of recurring themes here.
Elector: Hey, I totally should be this kid's guardian and regent! I would run the country for you, I'm just that generous and gifted.
How selfless of you, Elector!
with nine years, Tiny Terror Karl Emil hurt a page with bow and arrow, at Christmas 1668, he threatened a Kammerjunker with a gun, then he beat up his page, and in 1671, Karl Emil threatened a gentleman with a pistol.
...This is putting Tiny Terror FW throwing a chamberlain out the window into the shade!
I still like your theory that Ferdinand accidentally hit one of Fritz's dogs with a makeshift bow and arrow and that was why Fritz decided he was a tiny terror, the worst of the Hohenzollerns.
I also wonder how much Fritz knew about Karl Emil.
F1 burst into tears and write immediately apologetic letters, Karl Emil needed three days until he asked pardon on his knees
Hahaha, yeah, those both sound very in character.
they didn't calm down until Schwerin allowed them to go to Luise Henriette who comforted them, and remained with little F1 till he fell asleep.
I join the chorus of "awwww"s!