cahn | Frederick the Great discussion post 15

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cahn

...I have nothing clever to say here, just really pleased this is still going :)

rheinsberg

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From:

selenak

You're right, it's definitely 22, not 20. Also, it's eerie to read this petition for mercy letter from a father to Fritz. Whether Glasow was the tyrant of the household or a nice guy who couldn't hurt a fly, I'm glad Fritz didn't order him executed.

Also, even Crown Prince/brand-new King Fritz handed the treasury to a guy who was 31 and had been with him for 8 years. I stand by my headcanon that Fritz did a lot of training Fredersdorf to do things exactly the way he, Fritz, would have done them, and that's part of why he was trusted so much.

Makes sense to me. And note that in Volz "Fritz as seen by his contemporaries" collection, Bielfeld is quoted being very impressed by and complimentary about Fredersdorf in the Rheinsberg era already. So I'm assuming that Fredersdorf already did plenty of organizing and assuming responsibilities at this point, furthering and justifying Fritz' trust in him. All we know that Glasow did was go with Fritz to the Netherlands and back without causing an international incident.

Otoh, very good point that Glasow signed up for peace time Fritz and ended up with war time Fritz, and that Fritz did hit his servants at times. (Büsching says so, too, though in fairness that's Fritz in the 70s and 80s.) (BTW, I did wonder whether Glasow might also have been assuming Fritz would lose and thus working for the enemy could be a smart life investment, but if he was arrested during the Easter Holidays of 1757, that's pre-Kolin, and at that point Prussians still seem to have thought Fritz was invincible.) Despite ostensibly being in a much envied position, he could have been collecting resentments. Especially if he thought he would become the next Fredersdorf and started to realise this was not in the cards (especially not in war time).

In any event, that his own resentful servant turned out to be his doom - whether he confessed or framed him - could indicate Glasow himself had gotten high-handed. (Or bad at hiring people.) I'd like to know what the mitigating circumstances were, other than him being young, if there were any...

From:

mildred_of_midgard

Also, it's eerie to read this petition for mercy letter from a father to Fritz.

EXACTLY MY REACTION. I couldn't read the whole thing due to the quality of the scan (well, I *could*, but it would have been slow and painful), but from what I could readily read, I found myself with a serious case of deja vu.

Whether Glasow was the tyrant of the household or a nice guy who couldn't hurt a fly, I'm glad Fritz didn't order him executed.

Agreed. And totally in character for Fritz, who would gladly ruin your life at the drop of a hat, while yelling at you about how he should have your head but won't, but was squeamish about outright ordering executions.

Especially if he thought he would become the next Fredersdorf and started to realise this was not in the cards (especially not in war time).

Yep, this occurred to me too.

So I'm assuming that Fredersdorf already did plenty of organizing and assuming responsibilities at this point, furthering and justifying Fritz' trust in him.

Yes, indeed. I've never thought Fredersdorf went from flute-playing valet to prime minister without first displaying his talents.

All we know that Glasow did was go with Fritz to the Netherlands and back without causing an international incident.

Lol!

(BTW, I did wonder whether Glasow might also have been assuming Fritz would lose and thus working for the enemy could be a smart life investment, but if he was arrested during the Easter Holidays of 1757, that's pre-Kolin, and at that point Prussians still seem to have thought Fritz was invincible.)

I went through the same thought process. That said, he was still kind of outnumbered and surrounded on all sides, so it's possible someone could seen him as the underdog...

[ETA: Also, if he thinks he can garner gratitude by helping bring Fritz down from the inside, that changes the odds and the incentives.]

I'd like to know what the mitigating circumstances were, other than him being young, if there were any...

Agreed. Blanning's interpretation is that being young was the only mitigation, but it's not clear to me that that's the case. It might be, but I can't say for sure. [ETA: I stand corrected: on reread, he's saying that it's the only mitigation mentioned by the father, not Fritz.]

Edited Date: 2020-05-06 09:51 pm (UTC)

From:

selenak

EXACTLY MY REACTION. I couldn't read the whole thing due to the quality of the scan (well, I *could*, but it would have been slow and painful), but from what I could readily read, I found myself with a serious case of deja vu.

And if we feel it, do you think Fritz would have, too, or would the fact that by 1757, he must have had a lot of people, including fathers, petitioning him for mercy have diluted it? Otoh given that this is within a year of when he mentions Katte to Mitchell and tells Henri de Catt (according to Henri de Catt) about looking up the original tribunal statements and resealing them, the whole thing might have been in the front rather than the back of his mind.

I stand corrected: on reread, he's saying that it's the only mitigation mentioned by the father, not Fritz.

Well, the father also says Glasow has not a lick of common sense and thus was "easily seducable". (Shades of Trenck?) BTw, I should say here that the Countess Brühl was anything but a femme fatale. She and her husband seem to have been both a love match and a power couple, which, given that her husband was the most powerful and richest man of Saxony and could have anyone he wanted is hardly a given. Poniatowski has a lot of praise for her in his memoirs, too and says about her: "Whoever has known this Lady has to admit that a first minister, a favourite, could not have found no Woman more able to create friends for him, or at least to disperse the envy and jealousy which a man in a similar position would have had to fear." (Hence also Kalckreuth recalling her as a very respected lady, which made it all the more bemusing she should have invited the King's valet for tea, err, chocolate.) Also worthy of note: Marianne von Brühl was Catholic, Bohemian nobility (and thus a subject of MT's before her marriage) and her mother had been lady-in-waiting to MT's mother before becoming lady-in-waiting to MT's Cousin Maria Josepha in Dresden.