Historical Characters, Including Frederick the Great, Discussion Post 44

[cahn]

Not only are these posts still going, there is now (more) original research going on in them deciphering and translating letters in archives that apparently no one has bothered to look at before?? (Which has now conclusively exonerated Fritz's valet/chamberlain Fredersdorf from the charge that he was dismissed because of financial irregularities and died shortly thereafter "ashamed of his lost honor," as Wikipedia would have it. I'M JUST SAYING.)

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18th Century Letters from non celebrities on Salon relevant matters

[selenak]

As mentioned elsewhere, reading the Lindgren/Hartung correspondence pointed me towards an 18th century correspondence which was only published in the early 1960s (before, it was transferred among family members through the centuries) and which the two women loved to read. It's between Heinrich Christian Boje and Luise Mejer, who are 32 and 30 already when they become (romantic) friends. She's from Hannover, he's from even further up north, Holstein. He edited a literary magazine but lived from being a civil servant, and then a countryside judge, she was passed among various relations as was an unmarried bourgois' woman's lot. They were both friends with the Kestners (that's the Lotte Buff who inspired the Lotte from Werther and her husband, Not!Albert Kestner), distantly knew Goethe, knew the previous generation's fave German poet Klopstock even better, knew Dr. Zimmermann of Fritz fandom fame but didn't like him much, and because Boje like many a Northern German, especially from Holstein, tried to get a job in Denmark, knew Bernstorff. He had bad timing: when he befriended Bernstorff, Bernstorff was about to lose his influence again in the Juliana-Guldberg led regime, and when Bernstorff regained some influence, Boje had a job elsewhere. However, one of the Bernstorff daughters, Emilie, stayed with him and Luise for the year their eventual marriage lasted. Boje/Luise is a happy story with an incredibly tragic ending. They met and were simpatico at once and he quicly proposed, but she pointed out that a) neither of them had much money, and b) she was in bad health, so let's stay friends instead. They then spend years of intense, loving correspondence for years and years and him trying to find a rich wife and her trying to find good candidates for good marriage for him, but then her health improved, she signalled she was reconsidering, and he at once re proposed and they married. Happy ending! Except then she got pregnant and died by childbirth along with the child after only a year of marriage. Eerily, early in the correspondence this happened to German literary legend Gotthold Ephraim Lessing whom Boje (in his capacity as editor of a literary magazine) knew as well and he quotes from Lessing's heartbroken letter to Luise, and they both agree that this is the worst fate.

But to return to happier things. Now the correspondence doesn't contain every letter, sometimes one got lost, and sometimes the editor decides we wouldn't be interested and just sums it up. Alas this happens when Boje first visits Copenhagen and comes across mad King Christian in the royal park which we're told but don't get to read he describes to Luise in detail. Because Boje tries to get a job from Bernstorff for a while and befriends the family beyond that, there are occasonal comments from both Boje and Luise on Danish events. Struensee is already dead and executed when the correspondence starts, but Luise is definitely Team Caroline Matilda and when Boje reports that CM's son has reached his majority and takes over, essentially deposing his half uncle, Juliana's son, and Guldberg, as well as Juliana, there is much rejoicing from both her and Boje, plus Luise describes the creation of the monument in memory of Caroline Matilda which you can see today. Now, this is obviously a big contrast with how Lehndorff in Prussia thinks she's yet another MESSALINA, but the explanation is obvious: Luise is from Hannover, whose Prince Elector happens to be King G3 of Britain, CM's brother, and CM spent her last few years on Hannover territory. Where she was very popular. (BTw, G3 also has his second son, the Duke of York, living in Hannover through most of the correspondence years, and at first I was confused because Luise refers to him mostly as "the Bishop". This is because said son has the Hannover family inheritable bishopry of Osnabrück. Luise describes "the Bishop" as so popular in Hannover that people wouldn't be sad at all if the Prince of Wales (future G4) dies and "their" guy becomes King. (Doesn't this sound familiar.) (BTW, as it is, York didn't get old and died many years before the Prince Regent, future G4 would.)

But the excerpts I'll give you don't concern any of this. They're Boje and Luise reacting to THE bestseller of 1784. Note: Gleim is a German poet who actually served in the 7 Years War and was a hardcore Fritz fan.

Boje on November 28th 1784: Yesterday I wasn't in a mood to write, but was busy with the "Mémoires de Voltaire" which were sent to me from Hamburg, and as much as I was infuriated by a lot in them, I couldn't stop reading. It's undoubtedly written by him, at least I don't know anyone who could imitate his style so perfectly. May God save every man from having such a friend and companion. Much of what he writes about the King of Prussia may be true, and fits with similar anecdotes known to me. But did Voltaire have to preserve this knowledge for posterity? Friedrich isn't even the man he used to be in his youth anymore, and back then he was mainly seduced by French buffoons. And how such a Frenchman looks on all foreigners as barbarians! Gleim won't be able to sleep for eight days once he reads the "Mémoires".

Luise on December 3rd 1784: The "Mémoires de Voltaire" aren't available here yet, but the anecdotes from them are already talked about aplenty. Once Fritz Stolberg reads it, he'll rant about the French even more, and yet all nations include bitchy Voltaire types. If Zimmermann had been the friend of the King, he would avenge himself in exactly the same manner, but since he doesn't have Voltaire's genius, the malice would only express itself in rough rudeness. I'm sorry, dear Boje, but with the years my enthusiasm for great men has very much lessened. I would have liked the deception to continue, but since it has ended for me, I love people in general even more, don't demand extraordinary things from them and notice goodness much more than I used to.

Comments from me on this contempary reaction to Voltaire's memoirs: when Boje clarifies they're really from Voltaire, this refers to the habit of fake memoir publishing after a celebrity has died which we in Salon have come across more than once, see also Austrian Trenck and Eugene memoirs not by Trenck and Eugene. Note that unlike many a fervent Fritz fan, he doesn't call Voltaire a dirty liar and on the contrary says that yes, sounds like Fritz, alright; his problem is with Voltaire going into print with these stories. (But he couldn't put down the trash talking anyway, evidently, finding it compulsive reading.) His argument that King Fritz is now a very different person and that young Fritz was only thus because he was seduced by "französische Witzlinge" says something about Fritz' succesful image crafting and is of course a dig at Voltaire himself. (Voltaire being the most prominent French "Witzling" of them all.) "Looking down on all other nations as barbarians" isn't really something you can accuse Voltaire of. He has his biases (see also: Turks, and Muslims in general), but the whole point of Voltaire's "Letters from England" was to praise British law and British social circumstances in favour of French ones (thus urging the French to reform), he's a life long dispenser of sarcasm on his own nation in addition to everyone else, and I don't think the Memoirs have a "aren't we French so much better" attitude. (They definitely paint FW as a barbarian, of course, and Fritz as a highly cultured thug.)

I'm also plenty amused that Luise thinks Zimmermann in Voltaire's place would have reacted exactly the same way to a Fritz breakup, just without the verbal genius. (Reminder this is two years before Fritz' death, so Zimmermann hasn't published yet either his first book about how he was treating a dying Fritz nor the next one with the broken penis theory, and evidently while he has met Fritz already, he hasn't yet convinced everyone who knows him that they are bffs.) She has reason for doing so - earlier the same year, Zimmermann threw a terrible tantrum just because a letter to another Dr. Zimmermann ended with him by mistake, because the post guys should have known him from all other Zimmermanns, this despite the fact they apologized - , but I get a kick of how indignant Zimmermann would be at the compmarison!

Re: 18th Century Letters from non celebrities on Salon relevant matters

[mildred_of_midgard]

Only quick notes, but the whole thing was interesting and informative as always!

back then he was mainly seduced by French buffoons.

Glasow: you can accuse me of many things, but being French is not one of them.

evidently while he has met Fritz already

Yes, per Blanning, he has:

After his first encounter with his hero in 1771 he left the room in floods of tears, exclaiming, “Oh, my love for the King of Prussia is beyond words!”

But he couldn't put down the trash talking anyway, evidently, finding it compulsive reading.

Well, it is!

Fritz as a highly cultured thug.

I still love the modern Polish historian's description of him as "that thinking man's thug."

Re: 18th Century Letters from non celebrities on Salon relevant matters

[cahn]

Except then she got pregnant and died by childbirth along with the child after only a year of marriage.

Oh noooooo! WHY must history not conform to my expectations of tidy happy endings :PP

and he quotes from Lessing's heartbroken letter to Luise, and they both agree that this is the worst fate.

THIS IS TERRIBLE

Alas this happens when Boje first visits Copenhagen and comes across mad King Christian in the royal park which we're told but don't get to read he describes to Luise in detail.

This is extremely annoying in a completely different way!

and as much as I was infuriated by a lot in them, I couldn't stop reading. It's undoubtedly written by him, at least I don't know anyone who could imitate his style so perfectly.

LOL, the first sentence is evidence of the second!

May God save every man from having such a friend and companion.

I mean, most of us think that! Except... I guess.. for Voltaire and Fritz.

young Fritz was only thus because he was seduced by "französische Witzlinge" says something about Fritz' succesful image crafting and is of course a dig at Voltaire himself.

lolololol of course it is! (Me: Who are these French buffoons he talks about? Selena: Voltaire! Me: OH!)

Re: 18th Century Letters from non celebrities on Salon relevant matters

[selenak]

Real life sucks when it comes to the tidy happy ending plots, verily.

This is extremely annoying in a completely different way!

LOL, what I thought. I can just see the 1960s editor going "who cares about what Boje thought of King Christian?", to which the obvious reply is "Salon cares!"

LOL, the first sentence is evidence of the second!

Indeed!

May God save every man from having such a friend and companion.

I mean, most of us think that! Except... I guess.. for Voltaire and Fritz.

Quite. I mean, it would have been incredibly stressful to be friends with either of them (let alone both at the same time), BUT on the bright side, as has been pointed out by his biographer and you, Voltaire's vices are directly connected to his virtues, i.e. he's a truly good friend to have when being in a tight spot. He will fight for you. Chances are that he might after decades still carry a grudge about an old slight from you, and his trash talking you is all but guaranteed, but if you're in distress, and he cares, he will be there with terrier like tenacity.

I think the reasons why you have fare more contemporaries going "poor Fritz, for having such a bad friend" while far more present day writer folk are going "poor Voltaire, ditto" are

a) 18th century pre revolution people give Fritz a bonus for being a King alone. He's doing something to Voltaire by condescending to have a relationship in the first place, and Voltaire, who isn't even a noble by birth, behaves like this is nothing. Present day people tend to see this as part of a "man of power vs man of intellect" struggle and are prone to sympathize with the intellectual instead.

b) Much of what Fritz did to Voltaire, like the forging of a poem so Voltaire would get another arrest warrent and be forced to flee to Prussia, wasn't known in the 18th century. Of course the big Frankfurt arrest was (Voltaire made sure no one would ever forget it), but I can see 18th century people concluding Voltaire had it coming for taking Fritz' poetry with him in the first place. Ditto for the public burning of the "Doktor Akakia" pamphlet, which to us (and sure as hell to Voltaire) is Fritz breaking one of his own principles in favour of resorting of an old school anti enlightened barbaric punishment, plus the burning of books has even worse overtones now than it had then. Wheraes to many 18th century people, it would be an okay punishment after Voltaire had been warned, promised not to trash talk anyone and doubled down on the trash talking thereafter.
b
I'm also remembering how Andrew Mitchell when reporting how Fritz on the one hand trash talks Voltaire but on the other is addicted to answering his letters and is ever so happy when the next one arrives is afraid that cunning Voltaire will use this to spy for the French and elicit military secrets out of poor, poor Fritz. I mean. Leaving aside Voltaire failed at spying even when he was actually in Prussia, this shows you how a contemporary who isn't naive still is prone to see Fritz was the wronged party in his conflict with Voltaire. (Mind you, this is early in the 7 Years War, when Mitchell is definitely hero worshipping Fritz (and suspects of Heinrich of being ready to sell out Prussia to the French behind everyone's back because he's an evil scheming Prince, not knowing that Fritz used both Wilhelmine and Heinrich to sound out the French for conditions for a separate peace without telling the Brits anything, and of course Mitchell would do a 180% in his Heinrich opinion once he got to know him).

Me: Who are these French buffoons he talks about? Selena: Voltaire! Me: OH!

Well, it sure as hell wasn't Duhan the old teacher. :) Of course, FW suspected Fritz of being seduced by generic French types back in the day, but Boje can't have read FW's letters.

Re: 18th Century Letters from non celebrities on Salon relevant matters

[cahn]

Much of what Fritz did to Voltaire, like the forging of a poem so Voltaire would get another arrest warrent and be forced to flee to Prussia, wasn't known in the 18th century.

Yeah, I mean... and one of the parties here was VERY PUBLIC about alllll the dirt he was writing and trash-talking he was doing, I totally understand the sentiment of "oh geez, it's Voltaire, what do you expect?" :)