Frederick the Great, Discussion Post 30

[cahn]

In which, despite the title, I would like to be told about the English Revolution, which is yet another casualty of my extremely poor history education :P :)

Also, this is probably the place to say that RMSE opened with three Fritz-fics, all of which I think are readable with minimum canon knowledge:

The Boy Who Lived - if you knew about the doomed escape-from-Prussia-that-didn't happen and tragic death of Fritz's boyfriend Hans Hermann von Katte, you may not have known about Peter Keith, the third young man who conspired to escape Prussia -- and the only one who actually did. This is his story. I think readable without canon knowledge except what I just said here.

Challenge Yourself to Relax - My gift, I posted about this before! Corporate AU with my problematic fave, Fritz' brother Heinrich, who's still Fritz's l'autre moi-meme even in corporate AU. Readable without canon knowledge if one has familiarity with the corporate world and the dysfunctions thereof.

The Rise and Fall of the RendezvousWithFame Exchange - Fandom AU with BNF fanfic writer Voltaire, exchange mod Fritz, and the inevitable meltdown. (I wrote this one and am quite proud of the terrible physics-adjacent pun contained within.) Readable without canon knowledge if one has familiarity with fandom and the dysfunctions thereof :P

Comments

Re: Reading group: In the Shadow of the Empress

[selenak]

So at some level, even if Winter Queen was *this* bad, I still learned a lot of basic things that are confirmed by Wikipedia :

Since it just so happened that I saw the repeatedly mentionened docu series Age of Iron about the 30 Years War basically at the same time I read her book, I also had the sense that the basic facts there were accurate, with just one drastic bias betraying difference I spotted, to wit:

NG: Elizabeth and Friedrich were popular and beloved in Bohemia until having to flee the city. Sure, there was am minor upset over some statues Friedrich ordered to be taken down, but that was quickly over as the Catholics approached...

Die Eiserne Zeit: Elizabeth and Friedrich were popular and beloved until Friedrich the Calvinist started order Prague's patron saints statues being taken down and the beautiful Cranach altar in the cathedral destroyed which was a major insult to local feeling as well as being a great loss to art. Suddenly, Bohemians were far less motivated to fight for their new royals, and that definitely was a factor when the Imperial army showed up!

And since I had read Sophie's memoirs, from which she quotes a lot, the rendition of the Stuart-Palatinate clan (their personalities etc.) struck me as pretty source faithful to it there. Though who knows what I missed!

Anyway, should we continue with the book: I vote yes, for the entertainment value alone. I mean, she can tell a good story. And us getting upset over our pet peeve inaccuraces is good mental training to renember the actual circumstances. :)

Re: Reading group: In the Shadow of the Empress

[mildred_of_midgard]

I also had the sense that the basic facts there were accurate, with just one drastic bias betraying difference I spotted, to wit:

Right, I remember that.

Also, is it normal to refer to Elizabeth as the Queen of Bohemia decades after she's stopped being any such thing? I know it distinguishes her from her daughter, but it felt a bit like referring to James II as the King of England in 1700.

And us getting upset over our pet peeve inaccuraces is good mental training to renember the actual circumstances. :)

I was thinking this. :) I'm writing up a Spanish Succession rant as we speak! It should be helpful for cahn, who clearly needs the repetition.

Okay, let us continue! We've had more activity in salon today than we have in recent memory. ;)

(Somebody yell at me to do German today, though, I can't spend the *whole* day going on about 3 chapters of Goldstone. I have German to learn, several other books to read, and a Peter Keith essay to write. Clearly we need to do this book extra slowly, because it clearly involves a lot of research and writing. I might limit myself to Friday-Sunday. ;))

Re: Reading group: In the Shadow of the Empress

[selenak]

Also, is it normal to refer to Elizabeth as the Queen of Bohemia decades after she's stopped being any such thing? I know it distinguishes her from her daughter, but it felt a bit like referring to James II as the King of England in 1700.

True, though in Elizabeth's case her contemporaries actually did it (if they were Protestants, that is; Catholics had never recognized her as such to begin with), including her daughter in her memoirs. I also dimly recall her being referred to as the Queen of Bohemia when she died in London. It's not unprecedented, even James aside; Christina was still referred to as "The Queen of Sweden" decades after her abdication, for example.

Consider yourself yelled at. You could try the Zweig chapter I linked you to, the one about Scott and the Race to the North Pole. That's shorter than the Goldstone you've read so far!

Re: Reading group: In the Shadow of the Empress

[mildred_of_midgard]

Well, sure, contemporaries who supported the ousted or abdicated monarch's claims, just like the Jacobites referred to James III and Charles III as the kings over the water. I'm just questioning whether it is the practice of modern responsible historians to treat her like the real queen, or if that's as misleading as it felt.

Re: Reading group: In the Shadow of the Empress

[cahn]

Lol, okay! I actually think this is not a bad idea for me personally to read this first, and then I think SR will be rather easier going for me because I'll have (possibly incorrect :P ) background info at that point.

I can also read slower -- actually it's not the reading that's the problem, it's the writing it up afterwards that's very time-intensive for me, I don't have time for this either :)

Yeah, see, you guys have been telling me about Fritz (and for that matter about the Potsdam Giants :P ) for two years, I've only got the Spanish Succession thing once, I need it more times :P

okay but go do German now instead of writing up the Spanish Succession, I can wait :PP