shows Valory doing what Suhm does not, and certainly Voltaire (who didn't know FW) never did, seeing the similarity between FW and Fritz.
Oh, that's really interesting!
Isn't it just! I mean, Suhm, who loved Fritz, is able to correctly see his love for fame as a primary motive, and his capacity for acting militarily not according to personal sympathies but to what is ueseful to him. Manteuffel's Anonymous (or Le Diable himself) is able to predict Fritz will go the military way as well. But I think Valory is the only one who in a chorus of "he and his father are so different, complete opposites of each other" is saying "nope, he and Dad are totally alike, only Fritz is a far better actor/liar". Now if he was writing this after Fritz had become King, it wouldn't be that remarkable. (For example, the passage in Valory's 1750s Fritz assessment where he says that Fritz treats his brothers like his father treated him is clearly personal observation, but anyone could have said that.) But making that assessment before Fritz gets to the throne, and based on just a year or so of observation is pretty sharp and astute. And I think that Fritz initially didn't like him might have helped seeing what the others missed, because I don't believe Valory is just referring to Fritz and FW both privileging the army. Just look as Suhm confidently declaring that Fritz might have mocked people in the past, but now he's grown beyond that; Fritz sharing FW's capacity for verbal abuse (especially when miserable himself) and the need to make family members (Heinrich, Wilhelmine, AW) submit to him the way he submitted to Dad after an argument is not something I can see Suhm or even Manteuffel predicting, but it's entirely in line with the early Valory assessment.
(By contrast, early Valory misses what later Valory in his 1750s portrait does point out, that Fritz can also be incredibly charming. Presumably because later Valory actually had times when he was charmed, once Fritz had warmed up to him during the Silesian Wars.)
The sole difference is that the father had a fetish for tall soldiers, and the son just wants good looking ones, and more of them.
I gotta say this made me laugh :D
Same. No matter whether the phrase comes from New Brunswick Ambassador, Wartensleben or Manteuffel himself, it's well put, well put indeed. :)
But I think Valory is the only one who in a chorus of "he and his father are so different, complete opposites of each other" is saying "nope, he and Dad are totally alike, only Fritz is a far better actor/liar".
He's the only one writing this to Brühl, evidently, but as noted, at least some people (like Superville) did pick up on it.
And I think that Fritz initially didn't like him might have helped seeing what the others missed
Just look as Suhm confidently declaring that Fritz might have mocked people in the past, but now he's grown beyond that;
Yep, for all Suhm's protestations that love isn't blinding him, I feel the fact that one loves and is loved by him (which is important enough to make it into the write-up multiple times! including as a positive character trait) makes it harder to see the similarities to the guy who threatened to hang him.
It's also worth mentioning that Valory has seen Fritz up close in recent years, whereas Suhm has been correspondence- (and spies?) only for the last three. He might easily have been misled by letters criticizing people who mock others and miss out on the constant in-person mockery of everyone around Fritz.
Fritz sharing FW's capacity for verbal abuse (especially when miserable himself) and the need to make family members (Heinrich, Wilhelmine, AW) submit to him the way he submitted to Dad after an argument is not something I can see Suhm or even Manteuffel predicting, but it's entirely in line with the early Valory assessment.
Agreed. Suhm would clearly have been less shocked than some people, but still caught off guard by various things, and especially as the years went on.
Same. No matter whether the phrase comes from New Brunswick Ambassador, Wartensleben or Manteuffel himself, it's well put, well put indeed. :)
That's why part of me wants it to have originated with Voltaire! Lol.
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timeasmymeasure
Re: Valory and Mantteuffel
Date: 2021-02-17 06:54 am (UTC)Oh, that's really interesting!
Isn't it just! I mean, Suhm, who loved Fritz, is able to correctly see his love for fame as a primary motive, and his capacity for acting militarily not according to personal sympathies but to what is ueseful to him. Manteuffel's Anonymous (or Le Diable himself) is able to predict Fritz will go the military way as well. But I think Valory is the only one who in a chorus of "he and his father are so different, complete opposites of each other" is saying "nope, he and Dad are totally alike, only Fritz is a far better actor/liar". Now if he was writing this after Fritz had become King, it wouldn't be that remarkable. (For example, the passage in Valory's 1750s Fritz assessment where he says that Fritz treats his brothers like his father treated him is clearly personal observation, but anyone could have said that.) But making that assessment before Fritz gets to the throne, and based on just a year or so of observation is pretty sharp and astute. And I think that Fritz initially didn't like him might have helped seeing what the others missed, because I don't believe Valory is just referring to Fritz and FW both privileging the army. Just look as Suhm confidently declaring that Fritz might have mocked people in the past, but now he's grown beyond that; Fritz sharing FW's capacity for verbal abuse (especially when miserable himself) and the need to make family members (Heinrich, Wilhelmine, AW) submit to him the way he submitted to Dad after an argument is not something I can see Suhm or even Manteuffel predicting, but it's entirely in line with the early Valory assessment.
(By contrast, early Valory misses what later Valory in his 1750s portrait does point out, that Fritz can also be incredibly charming. Presumably because later Valory actually had times when he was charmed, once Fritz had warmed up to him during the Silesian Wars.)
The sole difference is that the father had a fetish for tall soldiers, and the son just wants good looking ones, and more of them.
I gotta say this made me laugh :D
Same. No matter whether the phrase comes from New Brunswick Ambassador, Wartensleben or Manteuffel himself, it's well put, well put indeed. :)
Re: Valory and Mantteuffel
Date: 2021-02-20 02:53 pm (UTC)He's the only one writing this to Brühl, evidently, but as noted, at least some people (like Superville) did pick up on it.
And I think that Fritz initially didn't like him might have helped seeing what the others missed
Just look as Suhm confidently declaring that Fritz might have mocked people in the past, but now he's grown beyond that;
Yep, for all Suhm's protestations that love isn't blinding him, I feel the fact that one loves and is loved by him (which is important enough to make it into the write-up multiple times! including as a positive character trait) makes it harder to see the similarities to the guy who threatened to hang him.
It's also worth mentioning that Valory has seen Fritz up close in recent years, whereas Suhm has been correspondence- (and spies?) only for the last three. He might easily have been misled by letters criticizing people who mock others and miss out on the constant in-person mockery of everyone around Fritz.
Fritz sharing FW's capacity for verbal abuse (especially when miserable himself) and the need to make family members (Heinrich, Wilhelmine, AW) submit to him the way he submitted to Dad after an argument is not something I can see Suhm or even Manteuffel predicting, but it's entirely in line with the early Valory assessment.
Agreed. Suhm would clearly have been less shocked than some people, but still caught off guard by various things, and especially as the years went on.
Same. No matter whether the phrase comes from New Brunswick Ambassador, Wartensleben or Manteuffel himself, it's well put, well put indeed. :)
That's why part of me wants it to have originated with Voltaire! Lol.