Historical Characters, Including Frederick the Great, Discussion Post 45

[cahn]

Unfortunately, there was then at Berlin a King who pursued one policy only, who deceived his enemies, but not his servants, and who lied without scruple, but never without necessity.

(from The King's Secret - by Duke de Broglie, grand-nephew of the subject of the book, Comte de Broglie, and grandfather of the physicist) )

Comments

Re: James I and VI: Scotsman on the English Throne

[luzula]

And from everything I've read and been told, the Scots still largely hated those bastards, but the Scottish Parliament was basically bribed into dissolving itself and letting Scotland be ruled from London. OTOH, that could be Jacobite propaganda, idk.

Ah, yes, Wikipedia says "The role played by bribery has long been debated" and doesn't come to a firm conclusion. It does agree, though, that "the Union was carried by members of the Scottish elite against the wishes of the great majority. The Scottish population was overwhelmingly against the union with England."

Bruce Lenman goes into this in some detail in his book The Jacobite Risings in Britain 1689-1746. According to him, the English Parliament introduced an act (the Alien Act) which said that unless a union was put in place, all Scots not living on English territory would become aliens (apparently James I/VI had introduced a joint citizenship for all English and Scots born after his succession to the English throne). This was bad for Scots nobles because they often owned land in both England and Scotland (often through marriage), and then their English land holdings would be threatened. They would also ban the three main Scottish exports to England (cattle, linen, and coal).

Further, the Scottish Parliament was manipulated into letting Queen Anne appoint the Scots commissioners who would negotiate the terms of union. This was accomplished by the Duke of Hamilton, one of the leaders of the Scottish opposition to union, encouraging people to go home, and then putting it to the vote when few people were there. There are indications in correspondence between pro-union politicians that some sort of pressure had been brought to bear on Hamilton, either financial or legal (he had lots of debts).

So the people negotiating for Scotland were in reality not properly representing Scotland. Nevertheless there had to be enough concessions for the Scots parliament to pass the Treaty of Union. These concessions were 1) securing the position of the Scottish Presbyterian Kirk, 2) that the rights and privileges of the Scottish burghs would remain the same (they were later abolished in the 20th century), 3) Scots law and the heritable jurisdictions of Scotland would remain the same (the latter were obviously abolished about 50 years later), 4) everybody who had lost money in the Darien scheme would have it repaid. You could call the latter a bribe, of course. And of course there's lots of other stuff in the treaty.

But it was still massively unpopular. To avoid this unpopularity affecting the next election, the old, discredited Scottish Parliament appointed the first Scottish representatives to the new union parliament, instead of them being elected.

Lenman has the following to say (this is a great example of his scathing irony): The jobbery and pressures used to expedite the progress of the treaty through the Scots parliament would appear to have been little different from the behavior which was standard government practice in the 18th century. It was perhaps neither less nor more reputable than the practices of government in late 20th century Britain, another patronage-ridden society.

Re: James I and VI: Scotsman on the English Throne

[cahn]

Huh, wow. It's interesting how much they had to do to get it through!

Lenman has the following to say (this is a great example of his scathing irony)

Hee. The more things change...

Re: James I and VI: Scotsman on the English Throne

[mildred_of_midgard]

Ah, thank you for elaborating with detail and actual sources! Mostly what I remember is my tour guide in Edinburgh going, "And THIS is where the Scottish parliament was bribed into moving to London!"