18th-Century Characters, Including Frederick the Great, Discussion Post 36

[cahn]

Starting a couple of comments earlier than usual to mention there are a couple of new salon fics! These probably both need canon knowledge.

felis ficlets on siblings!

Siblings (541 words) by felisnocturna
Chapters: 2/2
Fandom: 18th Century CE RPF
Rating: General Audiences
Warnings: No Archive Warnings Apply
Characters: Friedrich II von Preußen | Frederick the Great, Michael Gabriel Fredersdorf, August Wilhelm von Preußen | Augustus William of Prussia (1722-1758), Wilhelmine von Preußen | Wilhelmine of Prussia (1709-1758)
Summary:

Three Fills for the 2022 Three Sentence Ficathon.

Chapter One: Protective Action / Babysitting at Rheinsberg (Frederick/Fredersdorf, William+Henry+Ferdinand)
Chapter Two: Here Be Lions (Wilhelmine)

Unsent Letters fic by me:

Letters for a Dead King (1981 words) by raspberryhunter
Chapters: 1/1
Fandom: 18th Century CE RPF
Rating: General Audiences
Warnings: No Archive Warnings Apply
Relationships: Friedrich II von Preußen | Frederick the Great & Friedrich Heinrich Ludwig von Preußen (1726-1802)
Characters: Friedrich Heinrich Ludwig von Preußen | Henry of Prussia (1726-1802)
Additional Tags: Epistolary, Love/Hate, Talking To Dead People, Canonical Character Death, Dysfunctional Family
Summary:

Just because one's king and brother is dead doesn't mean one has to stop writing to him.

Comments

Re: Austrian Succession tidbits

[mildred_of_midgard]

Don't forget the Hohenzollerns were using the "Prince of Orange" title already

I did not forget this, but what I remembered was that the Dutch were extremely nervous in the 1730s that the Hohenzollerns might actually try to assert these claims, and were accordingly doing everything they could to keep FW from getting support from other powers for Jülich and Berg, because those territories would give Prussia an increased power base in the area. So I was extremely surprised to see the Dutch actually *inviting* Fritz/his brothers! I guess a lot can change on the political front in 10 years, especially when those years include the War of the Austrian Succession.

So if Anna hadn't died, and Fritz would still have gone ahead with the invasion despite later claims to the contrary, this could have happened?

Perhaps! Though the way things played out in real life, Fritz knew he needed to keep Russia out of the war, so he pressured France to pressure Sweden to invade Russia, and that's why from 1741-1743 James Keith was busy in Finland and Russia had no opportunity to participate in the War of the Austrian Succession until Silesia was safely in Fritz's hands. So...given how long it took Russian troops to arrive in central Europe (a factor in numerous wars and treaties), and the fact that Fritz invaded Silesia in winter, he might still have managed to pull it off without having to face Keith. Sorry, Bisset!

(Also, according to Anderson, apparently part of the deal in 1741 was that Elizaveta agreed with the Swedes that if their invasion helped bring her to power¹, she would cede provinces back to Sweden that had been lost to Peter the Great in the Great Northern War. WELL, she came to power and then did not keep her word, oops.)

1. For additional context, remember that La Chétardie, the French ambassador to Russia whom we've previously met in Berlin, was head of the coup that overthrew Ivan VI and Anna Leopoldovna in favor of Elizaveta. This is part of why Elizaveta initially inclined toward pro-French policies, which made her more inclined to take Prussia's side over Austria's (in contrast to the usual pro-Habsburg policy of Russia) at first. Then she was worn down by a combination of anti-Prussian foreign minister Bestushev, Fritz being an asshole, and a conspiracy against Bestushev among La Chétardie, Fritz, and Johanna of Zerbst (Catherine the Great's mother). La Chétardie got promptly kicked out of Russia, and the Prussian ambassador and Johanna were more politely sent away. And then Russia became gradually more anti-Prussian as the years passed, culminating in the Seven Years' War.

I'm somewhat sceptical if we're talking of actual Burgundy (including the France-Comte region), but given that the parts of Burgundy the medieval realm which now are Belgium were under Austrian control as the Spanish/Austrian Netherlands, I could see her declaring this old Habsburg heritage she has no intention of giving up, or something like that.

I had the same thought, but according to Anderson, this is in the context of invading France and conquering existing French territory to compensate for territory that's been seized from her, so it would kind of have to be Burgundy/Franche-Comté. What she actually said, I have no idea (and like you, I don't trust Anderson). I'm remaining agnostic on this point until further evidence emerges one way or the other.

Of course, I could be wrong, but I don't remember a claim to actual Burgundy from Stollberg-Rillinger.

I searched my Kindle copy for Burgundy in Stollberg-Rilinger before writing this post, and found nothing.

the Dutch would have wanted a Prince who isn't also King of Prussia, it would have had to be Heinrich, wouldn't it?

That was exactly my reasoning!

But I really don't think it came up during the relevant time. If Heinrich found out, then probably when he made his much delayed first foreign trip, and since Lehndorff doesn't report anything of the sort, it probably didn't happen. (Then again, Lehndorff was recently widowed and still reeling from his first wife's painful death, so he might have missed out on that bit of information.)

Yeah, makes sense.