Volume 2, about Joseph's decade as a lone ruler, continues to be concise, informative, neither dense and headache inducing nor as vividly told as the biographies romancees. Beales remains non-partisan in that he shows very clearly how Joseph manages to alienate most people, including most of his siblings, and piss off the nobility of various countries under his rule (whom he'd have direly needed on his side) in completely unnecessary ways, while also making mince meat of some legends (there's a chapter basically all about Joseph as a patron of music, with special emphasis on Mozart, where Beales really cuts loose against Joseph vilification in some older Mozart biographies and makes a convincing case of Joseph having been a good patron to Mozart (and in general responsible for Vienna really being the capital of European music under his reign), and showing the sheer magnitude and radicalism of what Joseph was aiming for. There's a good discussion near the end of putting Joseph in context not just with the two other enlightened despots of his time - Fritz and Catherine - but also with the two monarchs before him who could be called not enligihtened, but revolutionaries from the top who did succeed in radically changing their countries and societies - Peter the Great and FW. He points out that the usual explanation as to why they were successful in ways Joseph was not, that Joseph's temper, the high handedness, the sarcasm, the know it all ness, the arrogance etc. ruined his efforts, really does not work, because both Peter and FW were easily as difficult as Joseph, if not way more so, and Joseph would never have done to his nephew (or alienated siblings) what they did to their sons. But, says Beales, Peter and FW worked with their nobles. And that, in his opinion, did make the difference.
Joseph does come across as the child MT and Fritz never had in his flaws, but also virtues. All MT feared in her September 14th, 1766 letter to Joseph (as translated by me here, the "don't be like Fritz, you don't want to pay the human price" letter comes to pass. However, Beales also argues that a better tempered, less stubborn monarch would not have achieved what Joseph did. What did he achieve that wasn't taken back? For example: Abolishment of serfdom (something neither Catherine or Fritz managed in their territories), obligatory school attendance in all Monarchy territories, complete restructuring of the Austrian Catholic Church, since neither Leopold nor Franz after him refounded those monasteries Joseph had dissolved en masse, and kept the obligation for priests to study at state universities in addition to theological colleges. Speaking of the dissolution of many a monastery and Joseph stating that no order which didn't do social work, i.e. no purely contemplative order, should remain, the big difference between his actions and that of, say, Henry VIII and Thomas Cromwell, was that a) the money from the dissolution didn't go to the throne and some nobles, it went to a fund for social charity purposes, which exists to this day in Austria, and b) the monks from the dissolved monasteries had the option of either joining their order in other countries or work as parish priests, which mosts of them did. (The nuns could either join their order in other countries or work as nurses in hospitals.)
Meanwhile in Rome: What even? Does he want a schism? Pope: *decides to visit*
This was really unusual at the time. In the 20th century, popes from JP2 onwards were travelling popes, but in the 18th century, they hardly ever left the immediate Roman surroundings, let alone Italy. That the Pope came to Vienna and visit Joseph was both an honor (also a balm because remember, they didn't have a memorial service for MT, to which Joseph wrote angrily on the letter saying this: ""It is of little consequence whether the Bishop of Rome behaves courteously or discourteously") and a huge sign of concern. In the end, while the papal visit was a big affair, and Joseph, who almost immediately after Mt's death had started transforming his court into a small scale bachelor court, proved he could be a perfectly splendour providing attentive host if he tried, it did not have practical results in that Joseph continued with his reforms and Rome looked on aghast. When Joseph himself died, he did get a memorial service as a male monarch, but everything laudatory was stricken out of the young priest's sermon until it only contained blanishments. (How do we know? The young priest would later become Pope himself.
Another celebrity visit providing a big party break to Joseph's Spartan routine was when Grandduke Paul, Catherine's son, and his wife arrived. This was after Joseph had managed one of his few foreign policy coups, which was getting Catherine as his ally, which in effect, though not in letter yet, ended her alliance with Fritz. As a symbol of this, Joseph's oldest nephew, Leopold's son the Archduke Franz, was to be married to Paul's sister-in-law. (Since Catherine had no (legal) daughters, this was the closet thing to it. Paul's sister-in-law was a princess of Württemberg, closely related to the Hohenzollern (remember, Carl Eugen duke of Württemberg had been married to Wilhelmine's daughter?), and she was supposed to have married future FW3. So Catherine agreeing to this alternate match was a big signal of her change in ally priorities. (It wasn't because Joseph had charmed her that much; Catherine needed an alliance of use against the Turks. Which Prussia was not. Austria, otoh, had shared borders and old history with the Turks, and while MT had always refused to go to war with them, not least because she saw them as her allies, who had NOT done what Fritz wanted them to do in the 7 Years War and attacked Austria, for which she always wasa grateful, MT was no longer there to object.) cahn, future Mrs. Franz is the Princess Elisabeth of Würtemberg whose teacher Mozart tries to become in order to get a court job in "Amadeus". She would be one of the few family members with whom Joseph was to remain on excellent terms for his remaining life. Ultra tragicallly, she would die in childbirth three days before Joseph died himself. He ordered she was to be buried as his first wife Isabella had been, and her new baby to be baptized as his dead daughter had been and in her baptism robe. That the biggest tragedies of his life should thus repeat themselves while he was painfully dying is just extra awful.
(The marriage - and the Paul invitation to Vienna - had been an attempt to ensure the Austro-Russian alliance would not die with Catherine, since Joseph very much did notice that Paul was a Prussia fan in (P)Russian Pete's mold. In effect, of course, Catherine outlived Joseph despite being twelve years older.)
One of Joseph's most sympathetic reforms were the emancipation of the Jews (and toleration of Protestant) edicts, which were also the direct result of all his travelling (which included Galicia, which had one of the largest Jewish populations in a territory ruled by the Habsburgs). It was also one of the few reforms where he changed the edict according to the territory in phasing. One of Joseph's big problems was that he aimed for a centralized, unified administration for all the Monarchy's territories. ("The Monarchy" = Habsburg controlled lands, not the HRE. The later is the Empire.) This was directly against MT s advice to always allow for the different laws for Hungary and the Austrian Netherlands (i.e. Belgium). Now, there were understandable reasons; the Hungarian nobles had always insisted on keeping their serfs, for example, and unless you were willing to subordinate the Hungarian contitution to the new Austrian law, this would not change. But it was still a wholesale disaster that in the end resulted in rebellions in both Hungary and Belgium.
Beales points out that both were not rebellions in the sense of the French Revolution, they were quintessentially conservative rebelllions by the nobility which didn not want to give up a single privilege; in the case of Belgium, their demand was even to go back to the law as it had been when Phiilip II of Spain ruled, which tells you something. But Joseph did make it unecessarily worse than it needed to have been from the get go. One of the first things he did was change the capital of Hungary from Pressburg back to Buda. (As I mentioned before, Pressburg had become the capital after the Turkish conquest of most of Hungary in Charles V's time.) This was actually a popular move, and the city authorities of Buda sent him a letter of thanks and asked whether they might erect him a statue. Whereupon Joseph wrote, making his biographer head desk:
When prejudices are eradicated, and true love of country and concern for the general good of the Monarchy take hold; when everyone cheerfully does his fair share to serve the needs of the state, to work for its security and success; when enlightenment through improved studies and simplification in clerical training is achieved; when, by the reconciliation of true concepts of religion with civil laws, a more effective system of justice is established (...) as I confidentally hope it will come to pass - it is then that I shall deserve a statue. But not now, when the town of Buda has merely, through my happening to move the administration there in the interest of more thorough supervisions, been enabled to secure better prices for its wine and higher rents for its houses.
Yeah, that's one way to win Hungarian hearts. Leopold, btw, was a fan of the Hungarian constitution, not for the serf factor but for a general liking of constitutionalism. He saw Joseph as a despot much as Fritz' brothers saw him as one, and he wasn't wrong about that, though Joseph's brand of despotism lacked the elements commonly associated with the term as it's used now - he didn't use the money from the realm for his own luxury, or randomly ordered people beheaded, or showed privileges at a few minions while exploiting the rest. But he did want complete obedience, and was very disappointed when establishing freedom of the press inevitably meant it would be used against him, too. That Joseph curtailed the regular court life (safe for a few occasions) and bypassed the traditional chain of petitioning via nobles meant he was simultanously one of the least and most approachable of Emperors. Least for the nobility, most for the commons - he famously made a point of talking to commoners and taking petitions from everyone during his walks. Musical anecdote for cahn: Couirt Composer Salieri had overextended his leave. (This was the kind of thing which when young Mozart did it to his orignal patron, the prince bishop of Salzburg, it ended really really badly and was a major reason why he was eventually fired.) Since he was afraid that the Emperor would be angry, a returning Salieri went to the Kreuzgang where the Emperor usually was taking petitions from the commons. Joseph spotted him, greeted him warmly in welcome and spent the next two hours talking with him about music.) Leopld thought this whole thing was just cheap populism for Joseph's ego and yet another mistake in terms of the nobility, but Joseph was really consistent about it and kept it up until he was physically unable to walk near the end of his life.
Now, remember when Mildred mentioned that when Tuscany became transferred to FS in exchange for Lorraine, one of the conditions was that secundogeniture should apply, i.e. Tuscany would be inherited by FS's second son, not his first born, to ensure Tuscany would not become part of the Empire. Which is why in 1765, when FS dies, Leopold immediately inherits Tuscany. Nominal consent from Joseph is needed which he gives. (There is an irony here in that while Joseph is at this point Emperor, he's an Emperor without a land of his own. MT still holds the Habsburg main lands, Leopold has Tuscany, and Teschen, one of the few FS territories brought into the marriage which Joseph inherits, are given by Joseph to Maria Christina and Albert as a generous gesture.) At this point, the assumption is still that Joseph will have children, meaning the next Emperor will be Joseph's son while the next Duke of Tuscany will be Leopld's son. However, once it's clear Joseph will not have any children, meaning Leopold will be the next Emperor (unless he, who is eight years younger, will die before Joseph, in which case his son is the next Emperor), it means Tucany's Duke and the Emperor will again be the same person, as FS was. Joseph thinks this means that clearly, this means they should put it in writing that no matter who dies first, he or Leopld, Tuscany and the Monarchy and thus Tuscany and the Empire should be united again.
Leopold, who has lived in Tuscany for decades now and is aware of local feeling: Head. Desk.
My work deadline got extended late last night, yay, so I have a little more time than expected for salon this week.
But, says Beales, Peter and FW worked with their nobles.
Yeah, I can see that. I mean, I'm still surprised Peter pulled off what he did, because he didn't exactly cater to his nobles, but he wasn't opposed to the idea of nobles. And I guess "yay serfdom" does count as catering.
Joseph does come across as the child MT and Fritz never had in his flaws, but also virtues.
Never thought of it that way, but what a great way to put it!
(something neither Catherine or Fritz managed in their territories)
cahn: note that they both made an effort, with all the enlightenment discourse about same, but backed off pretty quickly because they needed the support of the nobility. Catherine in large part because her grip on power was rather shaky, Fritz because he'd killed off half his nobles in the Seven Years' War insisting they be front-line officers. Well, Fritz really because he'd started with the a priori belief that the nobility of the sword made the best servants of the state, and then structured his approach to rule around keeping the support of the nobility.
Joseph, on the other hand, was like, "I don't need no stinkin' nobles!"
(How do we know? The young priest would later become Pope himself.
Ha. Which pope was this?
Ultra tragicallly, she would die in childbirth three days before Joseph died himself. He ordered she was to be buried as his first wife Isabella had been, and her new baby to be baptized as his dead daughter had been and in her baptism robe. That the biggest tragedies of his life should thus repeat themselves while he was painfully dying is just extra awful.
Ooof, yes. :(
Now, there were understandable reasons; the Hungarian nobles had always insisted on keeping their serfs, for example, and unless you were willing to subordinate the Hungarian contitution to the new Austrian law, this would not change. But it was still a wholesale disaster that in the end resulted in rebellions in both Hungary and Belgium.
Didn't...remind me, didn't Joseph write some Realpolitik memorandum about how if he had his way, he would ask the Hungarians for 10 years to make changes, and then make laws that they didn't like and possibly had agreed not to make, on the grounds that it was for their own good?
Yeah, that's one way to win Hungarian hearts.
Oh, lololol. That letter starts out so promising, and then he shoots himself in the foot with the increasing sarcasm. Yeah, I can see why MT was like, "Look, Fritz is not your role model, you're going to alienate everyone!"
Leopold, btw, was a fan of the Hungarian constitution, not for the serf factor but for a general liking of constitutionalism.
Someone I was reading recently--I can't remember if it was Beales--was casting Leopold's interest in constitutionalism as lip service, since the Tuscans never actually got a constitution out of him. Thoughts? Of course, we all have yet read any Leopold bios.
one of the conditions was that secundogeniture should apply, i.e. Tuscany would be inherited by FS's second son, not his first born, to ensure Tuscany would not become part of the Empire
As I recall, that was the one political point that Gian Gastone actually stood firm on, at least according to the less-than-trustworthy Acton, I think.
Leopold, who has lived in Tuscany for decades now and is aware of local feeling: Head. Desk.
Yeah, there was a lot of that on Leopold's part (as you mention in the next installment).
But, says Beales, Peter and FW worked with their nobles.
That seems quite plausible to me! I remember the first time you ever told me about Joseph you pointed out that he basically made everyone mad at him all the time, which Peter and FW don't seem to have done to nearly the same degree (well, I am still reading about Peter). Poor Joseph -- in a way he honestly reminds me of this xkcd cartoon, only replace "sex" with "politics." That is, I love him because okay, maybe he wasn't a well-loved or always-politically-astute emperor, but he does hit all those buttons of "geeky idealist who is shocked when life is more complicated than that" for me <3
However, Beales also argues that a better tempered, less stubborn monarch would not have achieved what Joseph did.
But this is really cool :)
the big difference between his actions and that of, say, Henry VIII and Thomas Cromwell, was that a) the money from the dissolution didn't go to the throne and some nobles, it went to a fund for social charity purposes, which exists to this day in Austria, and b) the monks from the dissolved monasteries had the option of either joining their order in other countries or work as parish priests, which mosts of them did.
And so is this! I love that he really was idealistic <3
How do we know? The young priest would later become Pope himself.
Like mildred_of_midgard, I want to know who this Pope is and did he write gossipy tell-all diaries which is how we know about this??
She would be one of the few family members with whom Joseph was to remain on excellent terms for his remaining life. Ultra tragicallly, she would die in childbirth three days before Joseph died himself. He ordered she was to be buried as his first wife Isabella had been, and her new baby to be baptized as his dead daughter had been and in her baptism robe.
:(((( I'm afraid to ask, what happened to the baby?
One of Joseph's most sympathetic reforms were the emancipation of the Jews (and toleration of Protestant) edicts
YAY JOSEPH, seriously this is just so refreshing given... all the other over-the-top anti-Semitism going on :P
Yeah, that's one way to win Hungarian hearts.
Oh nooooo Joseph :(
Since he was afraid that the Emperor would be angry, a returning Salieri went to the Kreuzgang where the Emperor usually was taking petitions from the commons. Joseph spotted him, greeted him warmly in welcome and spent the next two hours talking with him about music.
<3 Aww! And also, the more I find out about historical!Salieri the more I like him too :)
The baby lived only for 16 months, see here the English wiki entry on Elisabeth and also the German entry, which as a few more details on her pregnancy and death, to wit:
1789 wurde Elisabeth schwanger, ihr Zustand war jedoch sehr instabil, nicht zuletzt verursacht durch die Unruhe wegen des sich ständig verschlechternden Gesundheitszustands von Kaiser Joseph. Nachdem Joseph am 15. Februar 1790 die letzte Ölung empfangen hatte, wollte Elisabeth ihn besuchen; bis dahin war ihr dies nämlich aufgrund ihres Zustands nicht gestattet worden. Um sie nicht durch seine Todesblässe zu erschrecken, ließ der Kaiser sein Krankenzimmer bei ihrem Empfang nur matt erleuchten. Dennoch war Elisabeth beim Anblick des todkranken Kaisers tief erschüttert und fiel in Ohnmacht. In der Nacht auf den 17. Februar gebar sie vorzeitig ein geistesschwaches Kind, Erzherzogin Ludovika Elisabeth, die bereits am 24. Juni 1791 starb. Elisabeth überlebte die über 24 Stunden dauernde Niederkunft nicht, bei der eine Notoperation eingeleitet wurde, um das Leben der Mutter zu retten. Sie starb am 18. Februar 1790 im Alter von nur 22 Jahren in Wien.
Joseph (who died on the 20th) not wanting to frighten her by his looks and having the room badly illuminated is yet another heartbreaking detail.
The future Pope who had to preach the sermon about Joseph at the Vatican was future Leo XII. For you and Mildred, here's the entire passage from Beales' book:
It was customary for a funeral serman to be preached at the Vatican when an emperor died. The task was entrusted to a young priest called Genga, who later became Pope Leo XII. A thick file in the archive of the Vienna nunciature shows how the text developed, or rather dwindled, in the face of criciticsm by the poope and others. It must be questionable whether any such sermon ever gave so much trouble.* Genga had brgun by trying to make the best case for Joseph as a devout Catholic reformer, adducing in his favour his repeal of some objectionable measures during his lastmonths. But almost all the favourable comments were vetoed. The result, of course, was bland and anodyne, much concerned with Joseph's fortitude on campaign and on his deathbed.
A more informative and rather striking sermon was preached in the athedral of Lucca by Christoforo Boccella in April 1790. The tiny independent republic of Lucca regarded itself as protected by the Emperor and gloried in his patronage. The preacherspoke of Joseph's tireless efforts for the benefit of his subjects, of his taking command of rescue operations when there were fires or floods in Vienna, of his extensive and clearly expressed legislation, and, most remarkably, of his having 'abolished the ill-conceived feudal system, a malign Gothic survival. Now the provinces do not groan under the burden and disgrace of servitude, which he destroyed, restoring an oppressed humanity its basic but too violated rights." This was a rare and penetrating acknowledgment of what was perhaps his greatest achievement.
Joseph (who died on the 20th) not wanting to frighten her by his looks and having the room badly illuminated is yet another heartbreaking detail.
It is. :( History as the most depressing fandom indeed.
Thank you for supplying the passage! (I was hoping to have read both volumes in full by now, but the 1720s took longer than expected--and still are, as I need to finish the Mecklenburg book--and I'm trying to stay focused on German this month. One day! In the meantime, I appreciate the excerpts and summaries. <3)
he honestly reminds me of this xkcd cartoon, only replace "sex" with "politics."
Ah, yes, that is so great, thank you for that link! That is extremely Joseph. The alt-text reminds me of that SMBC physicist comic I linked you to recently. ;)
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cahn
Derek Beales: Joseph II, Volume 2: Against the World, 1780 - 1790 - A
Date: 2022-01-11 05:55 pm (UTC)Joseph does come across as the child MT and Fritz never had in his flaws, but also virtues. All MT feared in her September 14th, 1766 letter to Joseph (as translated by me here, the "don't be like Fritz, you don't want to pay the human price" letter comes to pass. However, Beales also argues that a better tempered, less stubborn monarch would not have achieved what Joseph did. What did he achieve that wasn't taken back? For example: Abolishment of serfdom (something neither Catherine or Fritz managed in their territories), obligatory school attendance in all Monarchy territories, complete restructuring of the Austrian Catholic Church, since neither Leopold nor Franz after him refounded those monasteries Joseph had dissolved en masse, and kept the obligation for priests to study at state universities in addition to theological colleges. Speaking of the dissolution of many a monastery and Joseph stating that no order which didn't do social work, i.e. no purely contemplative order, should remain, the big difference between his actions and that of, say, Henry VIII and Thomas Cromwell, was that a) the money from the dissolution didn't go to the throne and some nobles, it went to a fund for social charity purposes, which exists to this day in Austria, and b) the monks from the dissolved monasteries had the option of either joining their order in other countries or work as parish priests, which mosts of them did. (The nuns could either join their order in other countries or work as nurses in hospitals.)
Meanwhile in Rome: What even? Does he want a schism?
Pope: *decides to visit*
This was really unusual at the time. In the 20th century, popes from JP2 onwards were travelling popes, but in the 18th century, they hardly ever left the immediate Roman surroundings, let alone Italy. That the Pope came to Vienna and visit Joseph was both an honor (also a balm because remember, they didn't have a memorial service for MT, to which Joseph wrote angrily on the letter saying this: ""It is of little consequence whether the Bishop of Rome behaves courteously or discourteously") and a huge sign of concern. In the end, while the papal visit was a big affair, and Joseph, who almost immediately after Mt's death had started transforming his court into a small scale bachelor court, proved he could be a perfectly splendour providing attentive host if he tried, it did not have practical results in that Joseph continued with his reforms and Rome looked on aghast. When Joseph himself died, he did get a memorial service as a male monarch, but everything laudatory was stricken out of the young priest's sermon until it only contained blanishments. (How do we know? The young priest would later become Pope himself.
Another celebrity visit providing a big party break to Joseph's Spartan routine was when Grandduke Paul, Catherine's son, and his wife arrived. This was after Joseph had managed one of his few foreign policy coups, which was getting Catherine as his ally, which in effect, though not in letter yet, ended her alliance with Fritz. As a symbol of this, Joseph's oldest nephew, Leopold's son the Archduke Franz, was to be married to Paul's sister-in-law. (Since Catherine had no (legal) daughters, this was the closet thing to it. Paul's sister-in-law was a princess of Württemberg, closely related to the Hohenzollern (remember, Carl Eugen duke of Württemberg had been married to Wilhelmine's daughter?), and she was supposed to have married future FW3. So Catherine agreeing to this alternate match was a big signal of her change in ally priorities. (It wasn't because Joseph had charmed her that much; Catherine needed an alliance of use against the Turks. Which Prussia was not. Austria, otoh, had shared borders and old history with the Turks, and while MT had always refused to go to war with them, not least because she saw them as her allies, who had NOT done what Fritz wanted them to do in the 7 Years War and attacked Austria, for which she always wasa grateful, MT was no longer there to object.)
(The marriage - and the Paul invitation to Vienna - had been an attempt to ensure the Austro-Russian alliance would not die with Catherine, since Joseph very much did notice that Paul was a Prussia fan in (P)Russian Pete's mold. In effect, of course, Catherine outlived Joseph despite being twelve years older.)
One of Joseph's most sympathetic reforms were the emancipation of the Jews (and toleration of Protestant) edicts, which were also the direct result of all his travelling (which included Galicia, which had one of the largest Jewish populations in a territory ruled by the Habsburgs). It was also one of the few reforms where he changed the edict according to the territory in phasing. One of Joseph's big problems was that he aimed for a centralized, unified administration for all the Monarchy's territories. ("The Monarchy" = Habsburg controlled lands, not the HRE. The later is the Empire.) This was directly against MT s advice to always allow for the different laws for Hungary and the Austrian Netherlands (i.e. Belgium). Now, there were understandable reasons; the Hungarian nobles had always insisted on keeping their serfs, for example, and unless you were willing to subordinate the Hungarian contitution to the new Austrian law, this would not change. But it was still a wholesale disaster that in the end resulted in rebellions in both Hungary and Belgium.
Beales points out that both were not rebellions in the sense of the French Revolution, they were quintessentially conservative rebelllions by the nobility which didn not want to give up a single privilege; in the case of Belgium, their demand was even to go back to the law as it had been when Phiilip II of Spain ruled, which tells you something. But Joseph did make it unecessarily worse than it needed to have been from the get go. One of the first things he did was change the capital of Hungary from Pressburg back to Buda. (As I mentioned before, Pressburg had become the capital after the Turkish conquest of most of Hungary in Charles V's time.) This was actually a popular move, and the city authorities of Buda sent him a letter of thanks and asked whether they might erect him a statue. Whereupon Joseph wrote, making his biographer head desk:
When prejudices are eradicated, and true love of country and concern for the general good of the Monarchy take hold; when everyone cheerfully does his fair share to serve the needs of the state, to work for its security and success; when enlightenment through improved studies and simplification in clerical training is achieved; when, by the reconciliation of true concepts of religion with civil laws, a more effective system of justice is established (...) as I confidentally hope it will come to pass - it is then that I shall deserve a statue. But not now, when the town of Buda has merely, through my happening to move the administration there in the interest of more thorough supervisions, been enabled to secure better prices for its wine and higher rents for its houses.
Yeah, that's one way to win Hungarian hearts. Leopold, btw, was a fan of the Hungarian constitution, not for the serf factor but for a general liking of constitutionalism. He saw Joseph as a despot much as Fritz' brothers saw him as one, and he wasn't wrong about that, though Joseph's brand of despotism lacked the elements commonly associated with the term as it's used now - he didn't use the money from the realm for his own luxury, or randomly ordered people beheaded, or showed privileges at a few minions while exploiting the rest. But he did want complete obedience, and was very disappointed when establishing freedom of the press inevitably meant it would be used against him, too. That Joseph curtailed the regular court life (safe for a few occasions) and bypassed the traditional chain of petitioning via nobles meant he was simultanously one of the least and most approachable of Emperors. Least for the nobility, most for the commons - he famously made a point of talking to commoners and taking petitions from everyone during his walks. Musical anecdote for
Now, remember when Mildred mentioned that when Tuscany became transferred to FS in exchange for Lorraine, one of the conditions was that secundogeniture should apply, i.e. Tuscany would be inherited by FS's second son, not his first born, to ensure Tuscany would not become part of the Empire. Which is why in 1765, when FS dies, Leopold immediately inherits Tuscany. Nominal consent from Joseph is needed which he gives. (There is an irony here in that while Joseph is at this point Emperor, he's an Emperor without a land of his own. MT still holds the Habsburg main lands, Leopold has Tuscany, and Teschen, one of the few FS territories brought into the marriage which Joseph inherits, are given by Joseph to Maria Christina and Albert as a generous gesture.) At this point, the assumption is still that Joseph will have children, meaning the next Emperor will be Joseph's son while the next Duke of Tuscany will be Leopld's son. However, once it's clear Joseph will not have any children, meaning Leopold will be the next Emperor (unless he, who is eight years younger, will die before Joseph, in which case his son is the next Emperor), it means Tucany's Duke and the Emperor will again be the same person, as FS was. Joseph thinks this means that clearly, this means they should put it in writing that no matter who dies first, he or Leopld, Tuscany and the Monarchy and thus Tuscany and the Empire should be united again.
Leopold, who has lived in Tuscany for decades now and is aware of local feeling: Head. Desk.
Re: Derek Beales: Joseph II, Volume 2: Against the World, 1780 - 1790 - A
Date: 2022-01-13 12:18 am (UTC)But, says Beales, Peter and FW worked with their nobles.
Yeah, I can see that. I mean, I'm still surprised Peter pulled off what he did, because he didn't exactly cater to his nobles, but he wasn't opposed to the idea of nobles. And I guess "yay serfdom" does count as catering.
Joseph does come across as the child MT and Fritz never had in his flaws, but also virtues.
Never thought of it that way, but what a great way to put it!
(something neither Catherine or Fritz managed in their territories)
Joseph, on the other hand, was like, "I don't need no stinkin' nobles!"
(How do we know? The young priest would later become Pope himself.
Ha. Which pope was this?
Ultra tragicallly, she would die in childbirth three days before Joseph died himself. He ordered she was to be buried as his first wife Isabella had been, and her new baby to be baptized as his dead daughter had been and in her baptism robe. That the biggest tragedies of his life should thus repeat themselves while he was painfully dying is just extra awful.
Ooof, yes. :(
Now, there were understandable reasons; the Hungarian nobles had always insisted on keeping their serfs, for example, and unless you were willing to subordinate the Hungarian contitution to the new Austrian law, this would not change. But it was still a wholesale disaster that in the end resulted in rebellions in both Hungary and Belgium.
Didn't...remind me, didn't Joseph write some Realpolitik memorandum about how if he had his way, he would ask the Hungarians for 10 years to make changes, and then make laws that they didn't like and possibly had agreed not to make, on the grounds that it was for their own good?
Yeah, that's one way to win Hungarian hearts.
Oh, lololol. That letter starts out so promising, and then he shoots himself in the foot with the increasing sarcasm. Yeah, I can see why MT was like, "Look, Fritz is not your role model, you're going to alienate everyone!"
Leopold, btw, was a fan of the Hungarian constitution, not for the serf factor but for a general liking of constitutionalism.
Someone I was reading recently--I can't remember if it was Beales--was casting Leopold's interest in constitutionalism as lip service, since the Tuscans never actually got a constitution out of him. Thoughts? Of course, we all have yet read any Leopold bios.
one of the conditions was that secundogeniture should apply, i.e. Tuscany would be inherited by FS's second son, not his first born, to ensure Tuscany would not become part of the Empire
As I recall, that was the one political point that Gian Gastone actually stood firm on, at least according to the less-than-trustworthy Acton, I think.
Leopold, who has lived in Tuscany for decades now and is aware of local feeling: Head. Desk.
Yeah, there was a lot of that on Leopold's part (as you mention in the next installment).
Re: Derek Beales: Joseph II, Volume 2: Against the World, 1780 - 1790 - A
Date: 2022-01-13 06:06 am (UTC)That seems quite plausible to me! I remember the first time you ever told me about Joseph you pointed out that he basically made everyone mad at him all the time, which Peter and FW don't seem to have done to nearly the same degree (well, I am still reading about Peter). Poor Joseph -- in a way he honestly reminds me of this xkcd cartoon, only replace "sex" with "politics." That is, I love him because okay, maybe he wasn't a well-loved or always-politically-astute emperor, but he does hit all those buttons of "geeky idealist who is shocked when life is more complicated than that" for me <3
However, Beales also argues that a better tempered, less stubborn monarch would not have achieved what Joseph did.
But this is really cool :)
the big difference between his actions and that of, say, Henry VIII and Thomas Cromwell, was that a) the money from the dissolution didn't go to the throne and some nobles, it went to a fund for social charity purposes, which exists to this day in Austria, and b) the monks from the dissolved monasteries had the option of either joining their order in other countries or work as parish priests, which mosts of them did.
And so is this! I love that he really was idealistic <3
How do we know? The young priest would later become Pope himself.
Like
and did he write gossipy tell-all diaries which is how we know about this??She would be one of the few family members with whom Joseph was to remain on excellent terms for his remaining life. Ultra tragicallly, she would die in childbirth three days before Joseph died himself. He ordered she was to be buried as his first wife Isabella had been, and her new baby to be baptized as his dead daughter had been and in her baptism robe.
:(((( I'm afraid to ask, what happened to the baby?
One of Joseph's most sympathetic reforms were the emancipation of the Jews (and toleration of Protestant) edicts
YAY JOSEPH, seriously this is just so refreshing given... all the other over-the-top anti-Semitism going on :P
Yeah, that's one way to win Hungarian hearts.
Oh nooooo Joseph :(
Since he was afraid that the Emperor would be angry, a returning Salieri went to the Kreuzgang where the Emperor usually was taking petitions from the commons. Joseph spotted him, greeted him warmly in welcome and spent the next two hours talking with him about music.
<3 Aww! And also, the more I find out about historical!Salieri the more I like him too :)
Re: Derek Beales: Joseph II, Volume 2: Against the World, 1780 - 1790 - A
Date: 2022-01-13 01:25 pm (UTC)1789 wurde Elisabeth schwanger, ihr Zustand war jedoch sehr instabil, nicht zuletzt verursacht durch die Unruhe wegen des sich ständig verschlechternden Gesundheitszustands von Kaiser Joseph. Nachdem Joseph am 15. Februar 1790 die letzte Ölung empfangen hatte, wollte Elisabeth ihn besuchen; bis dahin war ihr dies nämlich aufgrund ihres Zustands nicht gestattet worden. Um sie nicht durch seine Todesblässe zu erschrecken, ließ der Kaiser sein Krankenzimmer bei ihrem Empfang nur matt erleuchten. Dennoch war Elisabeth beim Anblick des todkranken Kaisers tief erschüttert und fiel in Ohnmacht. In der Nacht auf den 17. Februar gebar sie vorzeitig ein geistesschwaches Kind, Erzherzogin Ludovika Elisabeth, die bereits am 24. Juni 1791 starb. Elisabeth überlebte die über 24 Stunden dauernde Niederkunft nicht, bei der eine Notoperation eingeleitet wurde, um das Leben der Mutter zu retten. Sie starb am 18. Februar 1790 im Alter von nur 22 Jahren in Wien.
Joseph (who died on the 20th) not wanting to frighten her by his looks and having the room badly illuminated is yet another heartbreaking detail.
The future Pope who had to preach the sermon about Joseph at the Vatican was future Leo XII. For you and Mildred, here's the entire passage from Beales' book:
It was customary for a funeral serman to be preached at the Vatican when an emperor died. The task was entrusted to a young priest called Genga, who later became Pope Leo XII. A thick file in the archive of the Vienna nunciature shows how the text developed, or rather dwindled, in the face of criciticsm by the poope and others. It must be questionable whether any such sermon ever gave so much trouble.* Genga had brgun by trying to make the best case for Joseph as a devout Catholic reformer, adducing in his favour his repeal of some objectionable measures during his lastmonths. But almost all the favourable comments were vetoed. The result, of course, was bland and anodyne, much concerned with Joseph's fortitude on campaign and on his deathbed.
A more informative and rather striking sermon was preached in the athedral of Lucca by Christoforo Boccella in April 1790. The tiny independent republic of Lucca regarded itself as protected by the Emperor and gloried in his patronage. The preacherspoke of Joseph's tireless efforts for the benefit of his subjects, of his taking command of rescue operations when there were fires or floods in Vienna, of his extensive and clearly expressed legislation, and, most remarkably, of his having 'abolished the ill-conceived feudal system, a malign Gothic survival. Now the provinces do not groan under the burden and disgrace of servitude, which he destroyed, restoring an oppressed humanity its basic but too violated rights." This was a rare and penetrating acknowledgment of what was perhaps his greatest achievement.
Re: Derek Beales: Joseph II, Volume 2: Against the World, 1780 - 1790 - A
Date: 2022-01-13 03:08 pm (UTC)It is. :( History as the most depressing fandom indeed.
Thank you for supplying the passage! (I was hoping to have read both volumes in full by now, but the 1720s took longer than expected--and still are, as I need to finish the Mecklenburg book--and I'm trying to stay focused on German this month. One day! In the meantime, I appreciate the excerpts and summaries. <3)
Re: Derek Beales: Joseph II, Volume 2: Against the World, 1780 - 1790 - A
Date: 2022-01-13 02:53 pm (UTC)Ah, yes, that is so great, thank you for that link! That is extremely Joseph. The alt-text reminds me of that SMBC physicist comic I linked you to recently. ;)