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Kattes
Date: 2021-11-07 10:52 pm (UTC)One thing I found that I don't remember you reporting was that Hans Heinrich, when he was in East Prussia, was apparently lining his pockets?
zähneknirschend hatten Bürgermeister und Rat ständige Einmischungen des Gehorsam gewohnten Generalleutnants in ihr Stadtregiment zu ertragen, der dabei durchaus auch tüchtig in die eigene Tasche (etwa zugunsten seiner Brau- und Hökergerechtigkeit oder bei der Verbesserung seines Gutes Reussen) zu wirtschaften verstand.
Grudgingly, the Burgermeisters and council had to endure the constant interference of the lieutenant general in their town regiment, the lieutenant general who was accustomed to obedience and who knew how to do business economically in his own pocket (like in favor of his brewing- or hawking-?? or in the improvement of his estate Reussen).
"Gerechtigeit" I only know as "justice", but "interests" or "businesses" makes more sense in context here. Anyway, it does sound like he's using his position for his financial benefit, especially with this footnote:
Entschädigung von Bürgern durch die Erben des verstorbenen Generalfeldmarschalls von Katte für ihre von diesem zu unbilligen Kaufpreisen abgekauften und seinem Gut Reussen zugeschlagenen Ländereien, 1743 – 1748)
Compensation of the townspeople by the heirs of the late Field Marshal von Katte for their lands purchased by this man at unreasonable prices and added to his estate Reussen, 1743-1748.
The 1743-1748 date is fascinating. It sounds like a long, drawn-out lawsuit, and it must have ended either with or just before the deaths of the two brothers in the duel over the inheritance. I wonder if the lawsuit was something else they clashed over. Or was it just the ginormous amount of money (lol, I'm seeing how HH got so rich :P) they stood to inherit?
And speaking of Hans Hermann's possibly corrupt immediate ancestors, Kloosterhuis talks about FW's decision not to dismiss Grandpa Wartensleben with his fellow "Wehs". Whereas Göse says, per your summary, "that the army was FW's beloved and holy grail, so if he'd been under the impression that Wartensleben, once in command, had fucked with the army, he would never have let it go as opposed to keeping the guy around and treating him like a man of honor. And FW did investigate the three Ws rather thoroughly," Kloosterhuis says FW probably didn't want to let the gruff ("schroffen") Old Dessauer take his place.
That seems like very odd speculation; Göse's line of reasoning is more convincing to me. Kloosterhuis cites Hinrich's bio of FW (which we talked about but never read), but I can't tell if the speculation is Kloosterhuis' or Hinrich's.
Re: Kattes
Date: 2021-11-08 08:58 am (UTC)"Gerechtigeit" I only know as "justice", but "interests" or "businesses" makes more sense in context here.
Let me remind you of my write up of the Gundling biography, and specifically this bit from how he impressed FW at first: What's more, it's also documented that he made the suggestion to discontinue allowing every little estate to brew their beer according to their own standards but to introduce a single state standard which the breweries had to adher to, which made a lot of nobility hate his gut because it essentially created both state control and a state monopoly on said quality control; FW, though, was delighted.
Also of Fredersdorf making the Kiekemal colonists buy only his beer. Gerechtigkeit in this old fashioned sense is the right/privilege of a liege lord to brew and sell their beer ("Höker" has nothing to do with hawks, it's another old fashioned word which lives on in the modern German slang word "verhökern" = sell) and make their dependents take it as opposed to buying someone else's beer.
This lawsuit, btw, does sound very much like the entire Kiekemal business to me. I note no one thought Hans Heinrich lost his honor over it.
Re: Kattes
Date: 2021-11-08 02:34 pm (UTC)And yes, it did remind me of Kiekemal! But I had forgotten about that Gundling detail, and didn't think to apply the concept of the lord of the manor's legal privileges, thank you.
I note no one thought Hans Heinrich lost his honor over it.
Lol, yes, and I notice Fritz is still rewarding Kattes with heiresses after 1748, notwithstanding. Maybe HH being dead helped. But Pfeiffer managed to recover and make a name for himself, to the point where after his death, people thought he was innocent!
Re: Kattes
Date: 2021-11-08 02:41 pm (UTC)Though that would be yet another good reason why the Kattes keep the true reason for the duel super secret and go for "love" rather than "financial greed", I bet!
Lehndorff: ....
Re: Kattes
Date: 2021-11-08 02:44 pm (UTC)Exactly what I was thinking this morning! (It's been a long morning: I woke up at 4:30, saw your comments, did some database maintenance, the database broke, I had to fix it, I took an inadequate nap, and I'm now half asleep and multitasking salon and keeping an eye on the database, so I'm forgetting about 50% of the things I meant to say, ugh.)
Re: Kattes
Date: 2021-11-16 04:09 pm (UTC)What's intriguing to me is that Lövenörn was sent to Berlin in April 1730, " this time with the task of mediating between Prussia and England-Hanover." That means he must have been in Denmark in February-March. Lövenörn, as you may remember, is the Danish ambassador who allegedly warned Katte about his impending arrest and may have been told by Katte that he had to say goodbye to
Wilhelminea girl. He also got in hot water with FW because he knew about the escape plans and didn't say anything. Fortunately, his king died a few weeks later and he got recalled. Fritz was still asking after his health in 1739, and Wilhelmine speaks favorably of him in her memoirs.So I wonder if Katte's trip to Denmark in February-March either had something to do directly with Lövenörn, or if they at least met up. Lövenörn is on my list of people to learn more about, but I need a little more sleep to read the English sources and a lot more sleep and some more time before I'm up to the German sources.
Kloosterhuis also said that Katte made a trip to "the Danube" [where on the Danube? The Danube is really big! and I'd think if you meant Vienna, you'd say Vienna] in the same spring. And we also don't know what he was doing there.
But what this does is add to my increasing awareness that Fritz and Katte did not have very long to get to know each other. They only started becoming friends in mid 1729 (though they had had a few, mostly not positive, encounters before that). Fritz presumably spends some (much? all?) of the autumn stuck in That HellholeTM, aka Wusterhausen. In spring, Katte's traveling abroad for one to two months. Then they get April? May? through mid-July together (June is Zeithain). Then Fritz leaves on the ill-fated trip through southern Germany, and they never see each other again except for one minute on the morning of November 6. We'll always have Zeithain, I guess?
But as someone who likes to travel, I've always been glad Katte got to travel in the short time he had. That's one reason I'm disappointed that I suspect he didn't make it to Madrid after all! (Still researching that one, though.) And I'm still :( that Fritz's issues kept him from going to Italy.
Re: Kattes
Date: 2021-11-17 08:41 am (UTC)Danube: you can say that again. My first thought, btw, wasn‘t „Vienna“ but „Regensburg“, presumably due to having recently been there. But also because of the Perpetual Diet. (Maybe Katte went with someone on semi-official business?). Other German Danube towns are Passau and Ingolstadt (the later has a university where Victor Frankenstein studies in Mary Shelley‘s novel), and Kelheim (didn‘t FW stop there at the trip of doom?).
But what this does is add to my increasing awareness that Fritz and Katte did not have very long to get to know each other.
That is very true, and perhaps a reason why my mind insists on refusing to come up with scenarios where they are a happy long term couple. It‘s too much like a Romeo and Juliet thing - brief, intense as hell, but by its very nature tragic and short. Though I like your idea that Katte was a milder Keyslerlingk and maybe a living Katte would have been treated by Fritz the same way (much favored, but kept far from politics). BTW, what would then have become of Keyserlingk Actual? Not to mention all the other boyfriends, with or without (depending on the AU) Fredersdorf included….
Re: Kattes
Date: 2021-11-17 01:50 pm (UTC)Maybe! Kloosterhuis cites a whole book on Prussian-Danish relations 1688-1789, which I don't feel up to reading yet (as it's in German, naturally), but am keeping on my mental list for our Danish ambassador.
Ooh, hmm, this is interesting! I had always been convinced by biographical dictionaries plus Koser that Lövenörn was back in Denmark when Katte was executed, which was too bad because I wanted to read his take on the execution. But Kloosterhuis does cite a footnote, from same said book about Prussian-Danish relations, in which Lövenörn's Nov 5 report reads, Katte habe bei der Verlesung des Todesurteils alle ,Contenance‘ verloren und sei in Tränen ausgebrochen. "Katte lost all composure during the reading of the death sentence and broke into tears."
Which is interesting in two respects: 1. Was Lövenörn still in Prussia, or was he writing reports from Denmark using his sources? 2. This contradicts the Wilhelmine-Pöllnitz tradition that he heard his sentence without changing color. And anything the Danish ambassadors, with their good sources, say in November 5, 1730 has way more credibility than anything Wilhelmine says a decade later.
Hmm, this book suddenly seems more interesting.
33 euros and who knows how many months for US shipping. Sigh.
Maybe Katte was trying to sound out the Danes as a possible alternate escape destination but had to learn they‘d most likely hand Fritz back to his Dad.
Yeah, so my two questions are: What was Katte *officially* doing in Denmark (presumably not sounding out Danesa about escape routes), and what were he and Lövenörn *possibly* doing behind the scenes?
Also, it is still interesting to me that Aunt Melusine was probably also not going to be the escape supporter that we thought she was.
Poor Fritz.
My first thought, btw, wasn‘t „Vienna“ but „Regensburg“, presumably due to having recently been there. But also because of the Perpetual Diet.
Hmm, perhaps!
Oh, wait, he was an assistant
It‘s too much like a Romeo and Juliet thing - brief, intense as hell, but by its very nature tragic and short.
Yeah, I've made the exact same comparison. "I love you! I barely know you, but I will die for you! If I knew you longer, I'd probably be less enthusiastic about the dying, but right now LET'S DO IT!"
Does not make a whiff of difference to my brain's desire to FIX THIS, by coming up with long-term happiness scenarios. :P
BTW, what would then have become of Keyserlingk Actual?
Oh, I imagine he would have been unaffected. Fritz liked to have a collection of people he loved around him, and one more or less wouldn't make a difference.
Not to mention all the other boyfriends, with or without (depending on the AU) Fredersdorf included….
Now, this is more of a question mark for me. I think they both would have hit on Algarotti, let's be real. :P Suhm, no change. Voltaire...not sure what Katte would have made of that. :P Keith, well, it depends on the AU. If the three of them end up in exile together, I've always wondered to what extent Fritz has moved on from Keith to Katte and Keith is <3, vs. they make it work. (I'm making them make it work in the fix-it fic, obvs. :P)
Fredersdorf is the really, really big question. If Katte sees that Fritz means to rule alone and doesn't let anyone have influence, maybe he accepts that things are different than in his grandfather's day, and he's content with his artistic/intellectual role. But if he sees that the town musician's son gets more insight into affairs and treasury control than he does...maybe he doesn't like that. And so I'm with you on it being difficult to find a scenario in which they peacefully coexist.
Re: Kattes
Date: 2021-11-17 03:57 pm (UTC)Re: Kattes
Date: 2021-11-17 03:57 pm (UTC)Re: Kattes
Date: 2021-11-17 04:31 pm (UTC)Lol, unfinished sentence is totally because I went, "Wait, was he?", wandered off to Kloosterhuis to check dates, got side-tracked, and forgot to come back.
So he was the Brandenburg-Schwedt cousin's "Begleiter" in the second half of 1726 and again at Zeithain in June 1730, but I'm not sure whether that means Schwedt cousin could have been a possible reason for Katte's spring 1730 missions abroad.
(I still wonder what business Hans Heinrich had sent Hans Hermann to Paris on in 1728. Perhaps
Re: Kattes
Date: 2021-11-18 12:40 am (UTC)Too late to edit, but that was supposed to be </3.
Zeithain (the camp, not the novel)
Date: 2021-11-17 03:49 pm (UTC)If any of our German speakers are interested, thanks to Kloosterhuis' footnotes and my obsession therewith, the Frederician library now contains a 50-page overview of every depiction, written or visual, of the Zeithain camp that the 1906 article author could get his hands on. (Or such is my impression.) There might be some goodies in there, especially since yours truly starts her fix-it fic's AU divergence point with a successful escape from Zeithain, and is thus always on the lookout for more details about the camp.
From skimming, I see that Meissen porcelain was first used as a dinner service at Zeithain? That's cool. Fritz must have been impressed, when not busy being beaten up by Dad and trying to get his boyfriend to run away with him.