Mary *writes secret letter*: Dear former potential husband Archduke Max, if you show up here right away, we're back on!
Maximilian: *to the rescue*
okay, this is AWESOME. I mean, fine, you make it clear there are other considerations. But it's also a super cute story :P Well, besides the part where she dies super early :(
and more that after his own death decades later, he'll order his heart to be buried with Mary in far away Burgundy, not in Vienna.
Me: ...what is up with these Habsburgs and their obsession with burying their body parts separately??
On Juana: WAIT, I did know about her and that she was reputed to have gone mad because she shows up as a very minor plot point in an AU SF novel I once read, only I had remembered it slightly differently, and in fact the line there was that her husband dying early caused her to go mad. OMG. At least a) it got it right that it was the fact she had a fortune (at least partially from Columbus' voyages!) that caused the marriage to Philip le Bel, and b) the minor plot point was that the AU was a fix-it where Juana married someone else entirely and didn't either go insane or have her husband declare her insane, so there's that :)
okay, this is AWESOME. I mean, fine, you make it clear there are other considerations. But it's also a super cute story :P Well, besides the part where she dies super early :(
It is an absurdly romantic tale, and I like it a lot. Also, given the alternative princes available at the time, it must be said Mary got herself the best of the lot (not just theoretical position wise). Here's a darkly humorous fun bit about some of the alternatives.
In England, ruling: Edward IV., brother to Mary's stepmother Margaret. Has two other brothers: the youngest, Richard, future Richard III, who, no matter whether you're a traditionalist (= he killed the princes in the Tower) or a Ricardian (did not!), had been and would be completely loyal to Big Brother throughout Edward's entire life, which included going into exile with him when Edward temporarily lost the crown courtesy of their cousin Richard Neville aka "The Kingmaker", with whom Edward had fallen out, and their middle brother George of Clarence. That would be the other brother. Clarence is famous in history for two things: constantly changing sides in the wars of the Roses, and eventually ending up dead by order of brother Edward, supposedly drowned in wine, which may or may not be a legend, but he did end up dead on his brother's command, and not in secret but after a public accusation and trial.
Now, back when Edward and Richard had to go into exile, they spend those two years with sister Margaret in Burgundy. George, Margaret and Richard were the youngest York siblings and had been raised together. So let's assume Margaret, who hadn't seen George since she got married and thus heard of the constant betrayals only via mail, had a soft spot for him, for:
Margaret: Dear Edward and Richard (in a historical novel she'd write Ned and Dickon), I think I have the solution to the problem with George. Clearly, he won't scheme and change sides anymore if he has a realm of his own! My stepdaughter Mary urgently needs a husband, and I was thinking...
Edward: Yeah, no. Handing over one of the richest provinces on the continent to the brother who still thinks he'd make a better King than me? NO WAY.
Richard: Hate to say this, Meg, but he's right
Edward: However, how about my brother-in-law, Anthony Woodville?
Margaret: ....SERIOUSLY?
(This would have been a serious mesalliance, because Edward's wife, Elizabeth Woodville, had been the daughter of a simple knight, his marriage with her had been one of the primary reasons for his fallout with cousin Neville the Kingmaker, and because Edward kept favoring the Woodvilles (possibly to build them up as an alternate power base to the Nevilles, in a divide and rule sense), they were cordially despised by much of the English nobility.)
Margaret:...I think Mary is right: she should go for the young Habsburg.
Juana: how much or little insane she was is still debated. The traditional story is that she was jealous of every woman Philip as much as looked at so he had to restrain her even in his life time, and then when he died she went completely mad. The problem is that this explanation came from three men who really profited from Juana being declared mad and unable to rule: her husband, her father and her son. (Her father because Spain had only gotten united through the marriage of Ferdinand and Isabella, and the ensuing conquest of Granada, the last Muslim kingdom of Spain. However, Ferdinand did not rule Castile, only his own realm of Aragon, while Isabella lived. And Castile then went to Isabel's children, not to Ferdinand as her husband, which meant Juana.)
Now, there are certainly independent testimonies as to Juana's temper. She and Philip le Bel fell for each other at sight and were so eager to have sex that Philip ordered his Chaplain to marry them immediately instead of waiting for the big ceremony. She was openly jealous of most women around him (with or wihout reason, who can say). But this behavior isn't classified as mad by a great many other people. When Philip and Juana spent three months in England, she certainly didn't apppear to be mad to the people she interacted with there, which included Henry VII, who years later, after the death of his wife Elizabeth of York, indeed proposed to marry her. And when asked whether she wasn't supposed to be mad said no, he saw no sign of madness. Unfortunately, by then Ferdinand was in charge of Juana, see above, and had a vested interest in having her considered as mad. Not to mention that Ferdinand already regreted having married his youngest daughter, Katherine of Aragon, to Henry's son Arthur, only for Arthur to die and Henry keeping Katherine's dowry anyway but refusing to send her back. (This was before future Henry VIII. would marry his sister-in-law.) There's no way he would have handed over Juana and Castile to Henry VII. Still, it's an AU to think about, especially if Henry VII had managed to sire another son before his own death. What Henry VIII. would have done with a baby half brother with a claim to Castile is anyone's guess, of course.
Anyway, back to the question of Juana's sanity: the biggest proof held up for her being insane is that after Philip le Bel's death, she supposedly refused to let him be buried and travelled with his coffin everywhere. Even this is contested, though, with people pointing out that since Philip had wanted to be buried in Granada, and Ferdinand for eons refused to let him be buried there (they had waged war against each other for who got to rule Castile in Juana's name before Philip's death), Juana had no choice but to keep the coffin with her until her father gave in. (One more thing: Ferdinand at this point still hoped to have a son from his second wife, so neither Castile nor Aragon would fall to the Habsburgs. This eventually did not happen, as the only male baby died the day it was born. But that was what he was aiming for at this point.)
Certainly in her later years, after decades of isolated imprisonment and separation from her children (except for the youngest one, Catherine, who had been born after Philip's death and who was allowed to grow up with her mother before getting married), Juana seems to have been severely depressed. But when the representatives of the Castilian diet met her after her father's death, she came across as compos mentis and reasonable to them, and they would have been willing to support her against her son, but Juana wasn't willing to go to war against her son, so that was that. He did at least visit her a lot in the ensuing decades, but her de facto imprisonment and being declared insane never ended. (When the Castilian diet representatives did swear the loyalty oath to Charles eventually, they did so only under the condition that he promised that if Juana ever regained her sanity, he would step back from power and be her subordinate in everything. You don't have to be a cynic to conclude what the chances were of that ever happening.)
Only in the 19th century, historians started to doubt whether she'd been clinically insane, and the first "Juana wasn't insane, she was the victim of three men wanting her heritage" historian, one Gustav Bergenroth, published. The debate has been ongoing ever since.
Edward: However, how about my brother-in-law, Anthony Woodville?
Margaret: ....SERIOUSLY?
AHAHAHAHA
I did know about the Woodvilles from reading The Dragon Waiting -- a while enough ago now that I might not have been able to catch why it was funny without your explanation, but I certainly appreciate it with the reminder :D
Certainly in her later years, after decades of isolated imprisonment and separation from her children (except for the youngest one, Catherine, who had been born after Philip's death and who was allowed to grow up with her mother before getting married), Juana seems to have been severely depressed.
I MEAN. AS MANY PEOPLE WOULD BE.
(When the Castilian diet representatives did swear the loyalty oath to Charles eventually, they did so only under the condition that he promised that if Juana ever regained her sanity, he would step back from power and be her subordinate in everything. You don't have to be a cynic to conclude what the chances were of that ever happening.)
A couple of vids for you, all English subtitled scenes from the Spanish series Carlos Rey Emperador and its predecessor, Isabel.
Juana meets her grown up children: Teenage Charles (the not yet V) and his oldest sister Eleanor meet their mother Juana (and youngest sister Catherine) for the first time since early, early childhood, in the first episode of the series
And a correspondending scene from near the end, when Charles abdicates (and splits the Empire and the Habsburg line) in order to retire into a monastary (so he can save his grandson in one of the endings of the Verdi opera *g*. Juana is mentioned in this scene, not least because it takes place not too long after her death (she lived to be this old) and Charles chooses to abdicate in Flanders, where he was born and grew up. Also present: young not yet Philip II (and Austrian Habsburg cousins, the kids of Charles' younger brother Ferdinand): Abdication scene
Scene from shortly thereafter, in which Philip the now II, who has just married Mary Tudor which he hadn't been too keen on, is NOT happy about not becoming Emperor, but makes up with Dad when Charles explains some more: The burden of Empire
And now let me introduce you to an awesome woman also in play in this saga, briefly mentioned before, Margaret of Austria, daughter of Maximilian and Mary, sister of Philip le Bel, and by far the most sympathetic Habsburg of her generation.
Because child marriages are a thing, toddler Margaret, the same year Mary of Burgundy dies tragically, gets betrothed to Charles the son of Louis the Spider King of France in order to achieve France/Burgundy/HRE peace. The French insist she grows up with them so she'll become a proper French Queen. Margaret accordingly spends much of her childhood and youth in France only for Charles to marry Anne of Brittany instead (the French still don't let her go back to her father until two years after the marriage.
Margaret: *not a cheerleader of the House of Valois thereafter*
Max(imilian): Chin up! I've just arranged a double marriage. You get the only son of Ferdinand and Isabella, Juan, and your brother Philip le Bel gets his sister Juana. That way, Habsburgs will sit on the Spanish thrones for sure. Unlike certain events taking place centuries after our life time, MY double brother/sister marriages work.
Margaret: sets sail for Spain
Mighty storm: happens.
Margaret: composes her epitath just in case: "Here lies Margaret, the willing bride, Twice married - but a virgin when she died."
Margaret: doesn*t die, marries Juan. Juan, however, dies only six MONTHS into the marriage (which will make his sister Juana the next heir of Castile). Margaret is pregnant by then, but has a stillbirth. This means it's back to Burgundy with her.
Max: Given my on/off feuding with France, and Savoy being strategically placed, clearly Margaret should marry the Duke of Savoy next.
Margaret: *becomes Mrs. Savoy; three years later, her husband dies*
Margaret: I've had it! Legend has it I'm throwing myself out of a window of grief, which I survive. This may or may not have been the case, but I do keep his heart with me for my remaining very long life. Note no one is declaring me insane fo r eihter action. As it turns out, the positive part of my life is finally beginning, since I refuse to marry a third time. No more marriages, say I.
Max: ...okay. Since your brother Philip just died, how about I appoint you governor of Flanders and guardian of his older kids instead?
Margaret: Accepted.
Margaret: *is so successful as governor of the Netherlands that Charles, once he's grown up, reappoints her indefinitely until her death*
Margaret: *also starts to become first her father's and then her nephew's chief representative in tricky negotiations; she ends up being called the greatest diplomat of her era*
Treaties and events negotiated by Margaret: Maximilian/Louis treaty in 1508 anti-France alliance between Max and young Henry VIII, 1513 election of Charles as HRE (backed with Fugger money, but Margaret was doing the actual negotiating with the Princes Elector and the Papacy, which was just a biiiiiit worried about the prospect of a Habsburg ruling Spain and the HRE at the same time (not unjustifiedly so, ask a later Pope driven from Rome by Charles) in 1519 Charles/Francis treaty in 1529
Margaret was also a great patron of the arts, and her Netherlands court was supposedly the most cultivated of Europe, which is why one Thomas Boleyn, English diplomat, sent his child daughter Anne there (before she ended up at the French court). Thus one of the earliest mentions of Anne Boleyn is by Margaret in a letter to Thomas, stating the little girl was "so presentable and so pleasant, considering her youthful age, that I am more beholden to you for sending her to me, than you to me."
She died in 1530 according to the best known version by gangrene in her foot that developed after she stepped into a shard of glass, and may or may not have drunk too much of an opiate to dull her pain. By this time, the was the Matriarch of the family and the realms, having raised several of their monarchs. In addition to Charles, there was Eleanor (Queen of Portugal, later Queen of France, which was part of the Charles/Francis peace deal), Isabella (Queen of Norway and Denmark), and Mary (Queen of Bohemia and Hungary, also Margaret's successor as governess of the Netherlands and like her trying to keep the peace between Charles and brother Ferdinand. Whom Margaret had not raised. Ferdinand, ironically enough, had been raised in Spain, though not by Juana, but at the court of the grandfather he was named after. (Ironically enough because Ferdinand, who grew up in Spain, and did want the Spanish crown(s), never ruled Spain - remember, he got the HRE eventually - whereas Charles, who'd grown up in Flanders and was a stranger when he came to Spain for the first time, did end up ruling it.)
Margaret vid, showing her both as a young and older woman and the voice of sanity for two generations
And a scene from the series the footage is from again:
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Re: War of the Spanish Succession: Netherlands: Gossipy Addenda
Date: 2021-05-23 12:20 am (UTC)Mary *writes secret letter*: Dear former potential husband Archduke Max, if you show up here right away, we're back on!
Maximilian: *to the rescue*
okay, this is AWESOME. I mean, fine, you make it clear there are other considerations. But it's also a super cute story :P Well, besides the part where she dies super early :(
and more that after his own death decades later, he'll order his heart to be buried with Mary in far away Burgundy, not in Vienna.
Me: ...what is up with these Habsburgs and their obsession with burying their body parts separately??
On Juana: WAIT, I did know about her and that she was reputed to have gone mad because she shows up as a very minor plot point in an AU SF novel I once read, only I had remembered it slightly differently, and in fact the line there was that her husband dying early caused her to go mad. OMG. At least a) it got it right that it was the fact she had a fortune (at least partially from Columbus' voyages!) that caused the marriage to Philip le Bel, and b) the minor plot point was that the AU was a fix-it where Juana married someone else entirely and didn't either go insane or have her husband declare her insane, so there's that :)
Re: War of the Spanish Succession: Netherlands: Gossipy Addenda
Date: 2021-05-23 07:42 am (UTC)It is an absurdly romantic tale, and I like it a lot. Also, given the alternative princes available at the time, it must be said Mary got herself the best of the lot (not just theoretical position wise). Here's a darkly humorous fun bit about some of the alternatives.
In England, ruling: Edward IV., brother to Mary's stepmother Margaret. Has two other brothers: the youngest, Richard, future Richard III, who, no matter whether you're a traditionalist (= he killed the princes in the Tower) or a Ricardian (did not!), had been and would be completely loyal to Big Brother throughout Edward's entire life, which included going into exile with him when Edward temporarily lost the crown courtesy of their cousin Richard Neville aka "The Kingmaker", with whom Edward had fallen out, and their middle brother George of Clarence. That would be the other brother. Clarence is famous in history for two things: constantly changing sides in the wars of the Roses, and eventually ending up dead by order of brother Edward, supposedly drowned in wine, which may or may not be a legend, but he did end up dead on his brother's command, and not in secret but after a public accusation and trial.
Now, back when Edward and Richard had to go into exile, they spend those two years with sister Margaret in Burgundy. George, Margaret and Richard were the youngest York siblings and had been raised together. So let's assume Margaret, who hadn't seen George since she got married and thus heard of the constant betrayals only via mail, had a soft spot for him, for:
Margaret: Dear Edward and Richard (in a historical novel she'd write Ned and Dickon), I think I have the solution to the problem with George. Clearly, he won't scheme and change sides anymore if he has a realm of his own! My stepdaughter Mary urgently needs a husband, and I was thinking...
Edward: Yeah, no. Handing over one of the richest provinces on the continent to the brother who still thinks he'd make a better King than me? NO WAY.
Richard: Hate to say this, Meg, but he's right
Edward: However, how about my brother-in-law, Anthony Woodville?
Margaret: ....SERIOUSLY?
(This would have been a serious mesalliance, because Edward's wife, Elizabeth Woodville, had been the daughter of a simple knight, his marriage with her had been one of the primary reasons for his fallout with cousin Neville the Kingmaker, and because Edward kept favoring the Woodvilles (possibly to build them up as an alternate power base to the Nevilles, in a divide and rule sense), they were cordially despised by much of the English nobility.)
Margaret:...I think Mary is right: she should go for the young Habsburg.
Juana: how much or little insane she was is still debated. The traditional story is that she was jealous of every woman Philip as much as looked at so he had to restrain her even in his life time, and then when he died she went completely mad. The problem is that this explanation came from three men who really profited from Juana being declared mad and unable to rule: her husband, her father and her son. (Her father because Spain had only gotten united through the marriage of Ferdinand and Isabella, and the ensuing conquest of Granada, the last Muslim kingdom of Spain. However, Ferdinand did not rule Castile, only his own realm of Aragon, while Isabella lived. And Castile then went to Isabel's children, not to Ferdinand as her husband, which meant Juana.)
Now, there are certainly independent testimonies as to Juana's temper. She and Philip le Bel fell for each other at sight and were so eager to have sex that Philip ordered his Chaplain to marry them immediately instead of waiting for the big ceremony. She was openly jealous of most women around him (with or wihout reason, who can say). But this behavior isn't classified as mad by a great many other people. When Philip and Juana spent three months in England, she certainly didn't apppear to be mad to the people she interacted with there, which included Henry VII, who years later, after the death of his wife Elizabeth of York, indeed proposed to marry her. And when asked whether she wasn't supposed to be mad said no, he saw no sign of madness. Unfortunately, by then Ferdinand was in charge of Juana, see above, and had a vested interest in having her considered as mad. Not to mention that Ferdinand already regreted having married his youngest daughter, Katherine of Aragon, to Henry's son Arthur, only for Arthur to die and Henry keeping Katherine's dowry anyway but refusing to send her back. (This was before future Henry VIII. would marry his sister-in-law.) There's no way he would have handed over Juana and Castile to Henry VII. Still, it's an AU to think about, especially if Henry VII had managed to sire another son before his own death. What Henry VIII. would have done with a baby half brother with a claim to Castile is anyone's guess, of course.
Anyway, back to the question of Juana's sanity: the biggest proof held up for her being insane is that after Philip le Bel's death, she supposedly refused to let him be buried and travelled with his coffin everywhere. Even this is contested, though, with people pointing out that since Philip had wanted to be buried in Granada, and Ferdinand for eons refused to let him be buried there (they had waged war against each other for who got to rule Castile in Juana's name before Philip's death), Juana had no choice but to keep the coffin with her until her father gave in. (One more thing: Ferdinand at this point still hoped to have a son from his second wife, so neither Castile nor Aragon would fall to the Habsburgs. This eventually did not happen, as the only male baby died the day it was born. But that was what he was aiming for at this point.)
Certainly in her later years, after decades of isolated imprisonment and separation from her children (except for the youngest one, Catherine, who had been born after Philip's death and who was allowed to grow up with her mother before getting married), Juana seems to have been severely depressed. But when the representatives of the Castilian diet met her after her father's death, she came across as compos mentis and reasonable to them, and they would have been willing to support her against her son, but Juana wasn't willing to go to war against her son, so that was that. He did at least visit her a lot in the ensuing decades, but her de facto imprisonment and being declared insane never ended. (When the Castilian diet representatives did swear the loyalty oath to Charles eventually, they did so only under the condition that he promised that if Juana ever regained her sanity, he would step back from power and be her subordinate in everything. You don't have to be a cynic to conclude what the chances were of that ever happening.)
Only in the 19th century, historians started to doubt whether she'd been clinically insane, and the first "Juana wasn't insane, she was the victim of three men wanting her heritage" historian, one Gustav Bergenroth, published. The debate has been ongoing ever since.
Re: War of the Spanish Succession: Netherlands: Gossipy Addenda
Date: 2021-05-27 04:38 am (UTC)Margaret: ....SERIOUSLY?
AHAHAHAHA
I did know about the Woodvilles from reading The Dragon Waiting -- a while enough ago now that I might not have been able to catch why it was funny without your explanation, but I certainly appreciate it with the reminder :D
Certainly in her later years, after decades of isolated imprisonment and separation from her children (except for the youngest one, Catherine, who had been born after Philip's death and who was allowed to grow up with her mother before getting married), Juana seems to have been severely depressed.
I MEAN. AS MANY PEOPLE WOULD BE.
(When the Castilian diet representatives did swear the loyalty oath to Charles eventually, they did so only under the condition that he promised that if Juana ever regained her sanity, he would step back from power and be her subordinate in everything. You don't have to be a cynic to conclude what the chances were of that ever happening.)
Oof. :(
Spanish Sidenotes
Date: 2021-05-27 06:57 am (UTC)Juana meets her grown up children: Teenage Charles (the not yet V) and his oldest sister Eleanor meet their mother Juana (and youngest sister Catherine) for the first time since early, early childhood, in the first episode of the series
And a correspondending scene from near the end, when Charles abdicates (and splits the Empire and the Habsburg line) in order to retire into a monastary (so he can save his grandson in one of the endings of the Verdi opera *g*. Juana is mentioned in this scene, not least because it takes place not too long after her death (she lived to be this old) and Charles chooses to abdicate in Flanders, where he was born and grew up. Also present: young not yet Philip II (and Austrian Habsburg cousins, the kids of Charles' younger brother Ferdinand): Abdication scene
Scene from shortly thereafter, in which Philip the now II, who has just married Mary Tudor which he hadn't been too keen on, is NOT happy about not becoming Emperor, but makes up with Dad when Charles explains some more: The burden of Empire
And now let me introduce you to an awesome woman also in play in this saga, briefly mentioned before, Margaret of Austria, daughter of Maximilian and Mary, sister of Philip le Bel, and by far the most sympathetic Habsburg of her generation.
Because child marriages are a thing, toddler Margaret, the same year Mary of Burgundy dies tragically, gets betrothed to Charles the son of Louis the Spider King of France in order to achieve France/Burgundy/HRE peace. The French insist she grows up with them so she'll become a proper French Queen. Margaret accordingly spends much of her childhood and youth in France only for Charles to marry Anne of Brittany instead (the French still don't let her go back to her father until two years after the marriage.
Margaret: *not a cheerleader of the House of Valois thereafter*
Max(imilian): Chin up! I've just arranged a double marriage. You get the only son of Ferdinand and Isabella, Juan, and your brother Philip le Bel gets his sister Juana. That way, Habsburgs will sit on the Spanish thrones for sure. Unlike certain events taking place centuries after our life time, MY double brother/sister marriages work.
Margaret: sets sail for Spain
Mighty storm: happens.
Margaret: composes her epitath just in case: "Here lies Margaret, the willing bride,
Twice married - but a virgin when she died."
Margaret: doesn*t die, marries Juan. Juan, however, dies only six MONTHS into the marriage (which will make his sister Juana the next heir of Castile). Margaret is pregnant by then, but has a stillbirth. This means it's back to Burgundy with her.
Max: Given my on/off feuding with France, and Savoy being strategically placed, clearly Margaret should marry the Duke of Savoy next.
Margaret: *becomes Mrs. Savoy; three years later, her husband dies*
Margaret: I've had it! Legend has it I'm throwing myself out of a window of grief, which I survive. This may or may not have been the case, but I do keep his heart with me for my remaining very long life. Note no one is declaring me insane fo r eihter action. As it turns out, the positive part of my life is finally beginning, since I refuse to marry a third time. No more marriages, say I.
Max: ...okay. Since your brother Philip just died, how about I appoint you governor of Flanders and guardian of his older kids instead?
Margaret: Accepted.
Margaret: *is so successful as governor of the Netherlands that Charles, once he's grown up, reappoints her indefinitely until her death*
Margaret: *also starts to become first her father's and then her nephew's chief representative in tricky negotiations; she ends up being called the greatest diplomat of her era*
Treaties and events negotiated by Margaret: Maximilian/Louis treaty in 1508
anti-France alliance between Max and young Henry VIII, 1513
election of Charles as HRE (backed with Fugger money, but Margaret was doing the actual negotiating with the Princes Elector and the Papacy, which was just a biiiiiit worried about the prospect of a Habsburg ruling Spain and the HRE at the same time (not unjustifiedly so, ask a later Pope driven from Rome by Charles) in 1519
Charles/Francis treaty in 1529
Margaret was also a great patron of the arts, and her Netherlands court was supposedly the most cultivated of Europe, which is why one Thomas Boleyn, English diplomat, sent his child daughter Anne there (before she ended up at the French court). Thus one of the earliest mentions of Anne Boleyn is by Margaret in a letter to Thomas, stating the little girl was "so presentable and so pleasant, considering her youthful age, that I am more beholden to you for sending her to me, than you to me."
She died in 1530 according to the best known version by gangrene in her foot that developed after she stepped into a shard of glass, and may or may not have drunk too much of an opiate to dull her pain. By this time, the was the Matriarch of the family and the realms, having raised several of their monarchs. In addition to Charles, there was Eleanor (Queen of Portugal, later Queen of France, which was part of the Charles/Francis peace deal), Isabella (Queen of Norway and Denmark), and Mary (Queen of Bohemia and Hungary, also Margaret's successor as governess of the Netherlands and like her trying to keep the peace between Charles and brother Ferdinand. Whom Margaret had not raised. Ferdinand, ironically enough, had been raised in Spain, though not by Juana, but at the court of the grandfather he was named after. (Ironically enough because Ferdinand, who grew up in Spain, and did want the Spanish crown(s), never ruled Spain - remember, he got the HRE eventually - whereas Charles, who'd grown up in Flanders and was a stranger when he came to Spain for the first time, did end up ruling it.)
Margaret vid, showing her both as a young and older woman and the voice of sanity for two generations
And a scene from the series the footage is from again:
Margaret and brother Philip le Bel fight about Juana; she tries to make him treat her better.
Re: Spanish Sidenotes
Date: 2021-05-27 12:29 pm (UTC)