okay, I am OFFICIALLY YELLING AT YOU. How are you ever going to tell me about the Greeks and Romans if you skip your reading?? :P (Well, just kidding about the Greeks and Romans. I mean mostly.)
I consider myself yelled at, thank you! And yes, one day I want to tell you about the Greeks (and hope for Selena to tell us both about the Romans)!
But for now, I want to tell you about all the things on my German reading list, which means I need to be able to read my German reading list!
Thank you. :) I did meet quota yesterday, though I only partly made up for Friday's deficit due to financial reforms.
ETA: Though I should warn you, if we ever have a Classics salon, the evidence is infinitesimal compared to what we have for Fritz, so it will be a rather different experience. There will be no finding out if Lehndorff's wife ever had to see the phosphor inscription on his wallpaper. ;)
When I was reading histories of Alexander the Great two years ago, right before Fritz salon, I was frustrated that people would cite Plutarch uncritically even when contrary evidence existed. Plutarch, I might add, is one of our main sources for AtG...writing 400 years after Alexander died, and drawing heavily on the now lost memoirs of Ptolemy. Who was a friend and general of Alexander, which sounds promising, until you realize that he was Pharoah of Egypt by right of conquest, and was writing his memoirs to justify his rule with reference to the late Alexander.
Documentary evidence from the archives? Alexander's correspondence? What's that?
And yet historians will not only assert facts without mentioning caveats about their sources, they'll draw conclusions about individual people's *personalities* from the most minute details of these works, when, if you consider how few witnesses there must have been and how many mouths a detail must have had to go through to get to Ptolemy in the first place, and the biases inherent in the nature of the evidence...
One historian rather defensively said that if we can't trust our sources, we have no business doing Athenian history at all, to which my reaction is, "Well, you certainly have no business doing Athenian history the way you're doing it."
selenak, I may have said this, but one of the things I appreciate most about salon with you (and now you too, felis! and gambitten, whenever you come back) is that you share my priorities about the quality of our evidence and largely my opinions about how one determines the quality of evidence). I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have stayed in salon this long if you weren't such a rigorously critical thinker. :)
the evidence is infinitesimal compared to what we have for Fritz
All this is very true, but there is the occasional research gold still. Also, for the Romans: cook books!
I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have stayed in salon this long if you weren't such a rigorously critical thinker. :)
Imagine me blushing. I definitely have been called a gossipy sensationalist far more often. <3, also, I am in awe of your detective research skills, language acquiring abilities and, to quote Hamilton lyrics, top notch brain in general!
Like mildred says, I am in awe of your (and mildred_of_midgard's, and felis's, and gambitten's) rigorous critical thinking skills! Though I am also loving the gossipy sensationalism and honestly probably that keeps me in salon just as much as the critical thinking, much as I love it and am benefiting from it <3 :)
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timeasmymeasure
Re: Martin Sabrow's Gundling Biography: II
Date: 2021-03-21 05:55 am (UTC)Re: Martin Sabrow's Gundling Biography: II
Date: 2021-03-21 01:12 pm (UTC)But for now, I want to tell you about all the things on my German reading list, which means I need to be able to read my German reading list!
Thank you. :) I did meet quota yesterday, though I only partly made up for Friday's deficit due to financial reforms.
ETA: Though I should warn you, if we ever have a Classics salon, the evidence is infinitesimal compared to what we have for Fritz, so it will be a rather different experience. There will be no finding out if Lehndorff's wife ever had to see the phosphor inscription on his wallpaper. ;)
When I was reading histories of Alexander the Great two years ago, right before Fritz salon, I was frustrated that people would cite Plutarch uncritically even when contrary evidence existed. Plutarch, I might add, is one of our main sources for AtG...writing 400 years after Alexander died, and drawing heavily on the now lost memoirs of Ptolemy. Who was a friend and general of Alexander, which sounds promising, until you realize that he was Pharoah of Egypt by right of conquest, and was writing his memoirs to justify his rule with reference to the late Alexander.
Documentary evidence from the archives? Alexander's correspondence? What's that?
And yet historians will not only assert facts without mentioning caveats about their sources, they'll draw conclusions about individual people's *personalities* from the most minute details of these works, when, if you consider how few witnesses there must have been and how many mouths a detail must have had to go through to get to Ptolemy in the first place, and the biases inherent in the nature of the evidence...
One historian rather defensively said that if we can't trust our sources, we have no business doing Athenian history at all, to which my reaction is, "Well, you certainly have no business doing Athenian history the way you're doing it."
Re: Martin Sabrow's Gundling Biography: II
Date: 2021-03-21 07:03 pm (UTC)All this is very true, but there is the occasional research gold still. Also, for the Romans: cook books!
I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have stayed in salon this long if you weren't such a rigorously critical thinker. :)
Imagine me blushing. I definitely have been called a gossipy sensationalist far more often. <3, also, I am in awe of your detective research skills, language acquiring abilities and, to quote Hamilton lyrics, top notch brain in general!
Re: Martin Sabrow's Gundling Biography: II
Date: 2021-03-21 07:09 pm (UTC)Indeed! I think there is a responsible way to do ancient history, and it involves cookbooks. :D
I definitely have been called a gossipy sensationalist far more often.
That's why our
band namesalon name is Gossipy Sensationalists With Scholarly Instincts! They're not mutually exclusive, as I myself prove.<3, also, I am in awe of your detective research skills, language acquiring abilities and, to quote Hamilton lyrics, top notch brain in general!
<3
Re: Martin Sabrow's Gundling Biography: II
Date: 2021-03-21 11:21 pm (UTC)Re: Martin Sabrow's Gundling Biography: II
Date: 2021-03-21 11:24 pm (UTC)