I tentatively suggest Fritz might have been aware that Katte wasn't a deist, let alone an atheist, but was in fact despite liking French philosophers serious about his Protestantism
I came to the same conclusion after reading the Hans Heinrich letters and thinking about them for a while. Fritz (probably) lying to Katte about this is another argument in favor of Katte's sudden display of religious fervor at the end being sincere, in that it doesn't even seem to have come out of the blue for someone who knew him well.
Either way, I don't think I've ever seen fanfic or profic tackling the (very likely) fact that Fritz lied to Katte in 1730 in order to get him to agree to the escape plan.
As noted, I can't think of any *nonfic* that tackles it. I'm curious if anyone other than you has picked up on it.
BTW, I don't know where Fritz heard FS is no longer an option for MT. Clearly, his sources suck when it comes to Austrian gossip.
Clearly! What Stollberg-Rilinger says is that around this time (late 1720s/early 1730s), the Vienna court was trying to keep secret the marriage plans, so as not to provoke France (who didn't want to see Lorraine become a Habsburg domain). So it came as a relief in 1729 when FS's father died and he could go hang out in Lorraine, but they didn't like him there and he didn't like him, so he went on his Grand Tour at the time. In 1731, he's in England getting inducted into Freemasonry (at the house of the Earl of Chesterfield, per Wikipedia), and, as we know, meeting Fritz in 1732.
So clearly Charles VI's "Marriage? What marriage? Nothing to see here," tactics worked on Fritz. ;)
cahn, since you like maps, here's a reminder of why France would be concerned about Habsburg expansion into Lorraine. Everything in yellow is the Habsburgs (this is related to why they keep getting elected HRE). Notice that includes the Austrian Netherlands!
By the end of the decade, FS will give up Lorraine (but not so much that Joseph doesn't get cheered as duke many years later when he goes there) and accept Tuscany instead, when the last Medici conveniently dies out and leaves FS as a plausible heir (on his mother's side, I think). And because Leopold (younger brother of Joseph) inherits Tuscany without MT having any say-so, he gets to implement his own reforms there without fighting with her, and thus Tuscany becomes the first European state to take the death penalty completely off the books (as opposed to severely limiting it, like other states, such as Prussia under Fritz, had done).
If one tries to distract him ever so delicately and to suggest less worse interpretations, I get the reply: "If I see him coming from thirty feet away, I can read from his face what's in his heart. He probably thinks I have magical powers"
Wow. I need to write that fix-it fic where Fritz escapes, just as an antidote to all this. Fritz, I'm sorry about your dad and that you had to lie to your boyfriend just to get some help getting out of there! I'm sorry it didn't work! Katte, I'm sorry you got dragged into a mess of a Hohenzollern family. FW, I'm sorry you weren't born a burgher and married to the right woman and ended up with children who share your values!
except in early 1732, he's back to telling Grumbkow the Empress shouldn't give him her niece (EC) but her daughter, and wouldn't that be a great idea.
Early 1732, as a reminder for cahn, being exactly when Fritz gets the "EC or Küstrin" ultimatum from FW, and Fritz is desperately going, "Anything else! Anything but EC! No Austrian archduchess? Okay, what if I threaten to put a bullet through my head, will that get me what I want?" Grumbkow: "No, you may be suicidal, but I'm not. Stop dragging me into this. FFS."
I would say Eugene could be right about this just being a fishing expedition by Fritz
It reads to me exactly like his desperation to marry cousin Amelia: just another escape attempt. </3
![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
timeasmymeasure
Re: Austrian marriage plans
Date: 2021-02-20 05:09 pm (UTC)I came to the same conclusion after reading the Hans Heinrich letters and thinking about them for a while. Fritz (probably) lying to Katte about this is another argument in favor of Katte's sudden display of religious fervor at the end being sincere, in that it doesn't even seem to have come out of the blue for someone who knew him well.
Either way, I don't think I've ever seen fanfic or profic tackling the (very likely) fact that Fritz lied to Katte in 1730 in order to get him to agree to the escape plan.
As noted, I can't think of any *nonfic* that tackles it. I'm curious if anyone other than you has picked up on it.
BTW, I don't know where Fritz heard FS is no longer an option for MT. Clearly, his sources suck when it comes to Austrian gossip.
Clearly! What Stollberg-Rilinger says is that around this time (late 1720s/early 1730s), the Vienna court was trying to keep secret the marriage plans, so as not to provoke France (who didn't want to see Lorraine become a Habsburg domain). So it came as a relief in 1729 when FS's father died and he could go hang out in Lorraine, but they didn't like him there and he didn't like him, so he went on his Grand Tour at the time. In 1731, he's in England getting inducted into Freemasonry (at the house of the Earl of Chesterfield, per Wikipedia), and, as we know, meeting Fritz in 1732.
So clearly Charles VI's "Marriage? What marriage? Nothing to see here," tactics worked on Fritz. ;)
By the end of the decade, FS will give up Lorraine (but not so much that Joseph doesn't get cheered as duke many years later when he goes there) and accept Tuscany instead, when the last Medici conveniently dies out and leaves FS as a plausible heir (on his mother's side, I think). And because Leopold (younger brother of Joseph) inherits Tuscany without MT having any say-so, he gets to implement his own reforms there without fighting with her, and thus Tuscany becomes the first European state to take the death penalty completely off the books (as opposed to severely limiting it, like other states, such as Prussia under Fritz, had done).
If one tries to distract him ever so delicately and to suggest less worse interpretations, I get the reply: "If I see him coming from thirty feet away, I can read from his face what's in his heart. He probably thinks I have magical powers"
Wow. I need to write that fix-it fic where Fritz escapes, just as an antidote to all this. Fritz, I'm sorry about your dad and that you had to lie to your boyfriend just to get some help getting out of there! I'm sorry it didn't work! Katte, I'm sorry you got dragged into a mess of a Hohenzollern family. FW, I'm sorry you weren't born a burgher and married to the right woman and ended up with children who share your values!
except in early 1732, he's back to telling Grumbkow the Empress shouldn't give him her niece (EC) but her daughter, and wouldn't that be a great idea.
Early 1732, as a reminder for
I would say Eugene could be right about this just being a fishing expedition by Fritz
It reads to me exactly like his desperation to marry cousin Amelia: just another escape attempt. </3