Frederick the Great, Discussion Post 19
Oct. 5th, 2020 10:05 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
cahnYuletide nominations:
18th Century CE Federician RPF
Maria Theresia | Maria Theresa of Austria
Voltaire
Friedrich II von Preußen | Frederick the Great
Ernst Ahasverus von Lehndorff
Friedrich Heinrich Ludwig von Preußen | Henry of Prussia (1726-1802)
Wilhelmine von Preußen | Wilhelmine of Prussia (1709-1758)
Anna Amalie von Preußen | Anna Amalia of Prussia (1723-1787)
Catherine II of Russia
Hans Hermann von Katte
Peter Karl Christoph von Keith
Michael Gabriel Fredersdorf
August Wilhelm von Preußen | Augustus William of Prussia (1722-1758)
Circle of Voltaire RPF
Emilie du Chatelet
Jeanne Antoinette Poisson (Madame de Pompadour)
John Hervey (1696-1743)
Marie Louise Mignot Denis
Lady Mary Wortley-Montagu
Pierre Louis Moreau de Maupertuis
Armand de Vignerot du Plessis de Richelieu (1696-1788)
Francesco Algarotti
18th Century CE Federician RPF
Maria Theresia | Maria Theresa of Austria
Voltaire
Friedrich II von Preußen | Frederick the Great
Ernst Ahasverus von Lehndorff
Friedrich Heinrich Ludwig von Preußen | Henry of Prussia (1726-1802)
Wilhelmine von Preußen | Wilhelmine of Prussia (1709-1758)
Anna Amalie von Preußen | Anna Amalia of Prussia (1723-1787)
Catherine II of Russia
Hans Hermann von Katte
Peter Karl Christoph von Keith
Michael Gabriel Fredersdorf
August Wilhelm von Preußen | Augustus William of Prussia (1722-1758)
Circle of Voltaire RPF
Emilie du Chatelet
Jeanne Antoinette Poisson (Madame de Pompadour)
John Hervey (1696-1743)
Marie Louise Mignot Denis
Lady Mary Wortley-Montagu
Pierre Louis Moreau de Maupertuis
Armand de Vignerot du Plessis de Richelieu (1696-1788)
Francesco Algarotti
Stratemann
Date: 2020-10-07 12:34 am (UTC)OOOHHH. Yes, this is my new theory! I couldn't find Fröschlinge from googling, but I did find plain "Frösche" as firecrackers, so maybe Stratemann just wrote "Fröschlinge" to signal that they were small firecrackers, suitable for indoor use. Like sparklers?
Also, calling firecrackers frogs makes sense! All that leaping.
Ferdinand’s wetnurse: chosen about a month before SD gave birth via comitee consisting of favored court ladies, there were so many other passages I wanted to translate that I abandoned it. Still can do it, though, since I assume this is how it worked for the other royal children as well.)
I mean, you did kind of almost translate the whole book for us! For which we are endlessly grateful. But if you should have time at some point, I would be interested in hearing about this committee. As you say, relevant for fanfic!
There’s no way to spin “so I hear the Queen and our future Duchess in front of the servants talked about Princess EC has fistula in her anus”.
ROTFL. At least a dozen, remember!
Re: Stratemann
Date: 2020-10-07 09:53 am (UTC)And he really avoids unpleasantness and extolls the King and Queen as good parents whenever he can, hence no reported Fritz abuse before the escape attempt and only cryptic hints that things are tense between the two oldest and FW. There’s actually more about Wilhelmine’s pre-escape attempt problems with FW than those of Fritz, and that only in retrospect (i.e. in the description of FW being considerate to very pregnant with Ferdinand SD, bringing the kids to her, forgiving Wilhelmine and taking her to look after Heinrich). This is really different to all the other envoys, not just from the court of FW. For example, think of Valory remarking on Fritz ruling over his brothers with an iron thumb in his reports, or the French ambassador, after the MT/FS wedding, writing that no one other than MT likes FS at the Austrian court. (Even discounting the French bias - and they were deeply distrustful that the Lorrraine guy would use the Habsburg might to make a play for his former dukedom for years, so the envoy is invested in showing FS in a weak position - he’s reporting some genuine grumblings, though they were probably because from the point of the Austrian nobility, foreigner FS had undeservedly hit the jackpot by marrying himself into the Empire.)
You know what Mitchell wrote about Fritz and Heinrich. And Seckendorff the Younger certainly reports all the ups and downs of the 1730s Fritz/FW relationship as he observes and hears about it (i.e. sometimes it’s “Fritzchen” and paternal love, sometimes it’s snide remarks. And Mantteuffel provides with all the indiscreet utterings Fritz gave about his siblings and inability to get excited about EC. To say nothing of Suhm, back in the day, with the Hubertusday report. Now wasn’t that in 1728 as well, i.e. when Stratemann starts to write? Because I have this vision of Stratemann going “hey, Suhm, you were at the hunting, want to share some adorable stories about how the King is such great father to his children?”
Basically: what I’m saying is that Stratemann is clearly the scriptwriter for Fritz: The Disney Version. Or rather FW: The Disney Version. And since none of the others are, how on earth did they get along?
ETA: OMG.It just occured to me - the Hohenzollern as described by Stratemann was what EC thought she was marrying into. You know, that adorable family where Dad goes Christmas shopping for his kids, and if he neglects one, Mom is there to make her feel treasured, Mom and Dad love each other, of course, he's feeding her hot soup when she's sick, and sure, there was that tiny tiny escape attempt problem, but you know, Dad forgave Sonny almost immediately, and Oldest Daughter was sick, I swear, with her parents making sure she had a good long time to recover from that dreadful illness. And everyone is rejoicing and loving each other. /ETA
Dilettanti: at a guess, this sounds like Horace Walpole the younger was suffering from sour grapes, i.e. maybe he wanted to be a member, but they wouldn’t have him - he had been in Italy, remember, meeting Lady Mary during her years there and writing home disgustedly he heard about her menstruating so that she bled through to the bed of the inn, and this at her age, how disgusting, and she DANCED, too, etc, etc.
Garrick: we should also tell Cahn Garrick had been Johnson’s old pupil. They were from the same place, Lichfield, and Johnson had taught David Garrick and his brother when they were boys. This informed their relationship in both good and bad ways, depending on whether Johnson thought Garrick needed to be defended or was overly praised. (I.e. it was a “no one talks trash about Davy but me” thing.) After Garrick had produced Johnson’s play Irene, Garrick invited him backstage, but Johnson said: “No, Davy, I shall never come back. For the white bubbies and the silk stockings of your actresses excite my genitals.”
Re: Stratemann
Date: 2020-10-07 02:03 pm (UTC)Excellent detective work!
Now wasn’t that in 1728 as well, i.e. when Stratemann starts to write?
Indeed! Scanning that entry with my limited German and blackletter handicap, it seems to be "Bacchus reigned, everyone had a great time, the wine flowed; the feast was celebrated early* because Seckendorff has to leave for Saxony, oh, and there are about to be some executions of officers in Magdeburg soon..."
* I have been wondering about the date of Suhm's letter not matching the feast day, not even a little bit, for a year now! Thanks, Stratemann. :D
Because I have this vision of Stratemann going “hey, Suhm, you were at the hunting, want to share some adorable stories about how the King is such great father to his children?”
Ahahahahaaaaa *lolsob*. This is why I think Johnn, after Katte's execution, grabbed him by force and said, "LOOK. This Disney king of yours is Scar, not Mufasa." To which Stratemann wrote in his report, "Well, it could have been much worse, all sounds very just and noble to me..."
Also, re Suhm, let's remember it's not just Suhm's friend Fritz FW has been whaling on, but Suhm had grabbed his family and fled the country from FW's death threats just a year and a half earlier.
ETA: OMG.It just occured to me - the Hohenzollern as described by Stratemann was what EC thought she was marrying into.
OMG, you're right! :( At least Louise would have known what she was getting into...though I guess she married AW shortly after the happy Rheinsberg years, so we'll say she had at least an inkling. Though Ziebura, if I'm remembering correctly, says EC for a long time thought that things would go back to normal after Fritz was done with his glorious conquests...
Stratemann, see what you did with your Disney AU!
he had been in Italy, remember, meeting Lady Mary during her years there and writing home disgustedly he heard about her menstruating so that she bled through to the bed of the inn, and this at her age, how disgusting, and she DANCED, too, etc, etc.
Oh, right, that was him! It's hard to keep track of all the misogyny. :P
(I.e. it was a “no one talks trash about Davy but me” thing.)
Funnily enough, that's exactly how Damrosch introduces this anecdote:
Whatever tensions existed between Johnson and Garrick, everyone noticed that Johnson wouldn’t allow Garrick to be criticized by anyone but himself. When Boswell tried to get a rise out of him by suggesting that Garrick was too vain about his reputation, Johnson retorted, “Sir, it is wonderful how little Garrick assumes..."
Re: Stratemann
Date: 2020-10-07 05:42 pm (UTC)Seckendorff to the other envoys: And this, kids, is why you are all amateurs compared with me. Did FW or Fritz rearrange their funtime schedule for your benefit, eh? I'm telling you, that man loved me.
"Well, it could have been much worse, all sounds very just and noble to me..."
Richard Wolff (editor): This is why the Stratemann gives us the real FW, not the unlovingly and harshly drawn distortion the Margravine as a bad daughter drew in her memoirs.
Stratemann, see what you did with your Disney AU!
He conveniently died in 1739, so he never got to know King Fritz. Or the kind of Queen EC ended up as being.
Though Ziebura, if I'm remembering correctly, says EC for a long time thought that things would go back to normal after Fritz was done with his glorious conquests...
Well, given that she kept expecting him to send for her as late as the 7 Years War, I don't doubt it. In 1740, she probably told herself "Well, he's busy with all this new workload, but once that's settled with...", and when the first Silesian War kicked off in the December, she could tell herself "well, of course he's busy with his glorious conquests, but once he comes back..."
I mean, EC might have been the sole person who hadn't heard Fritz pre marriage had dragged his feet as long as he could and had not wanted her on any level, let alone that he told Grumbkow the marriage would be over once he was King. They had lived together in Rheinsberg, he'd been happy, and had written kind, considerate letters to her, praising her, even, when he was elsewhere. Yes, they probably did not have much of a sex life, if any, but she had no reason to assume they wouldn't continue living like this once he was King.
Then again: if her father did show her some of Stratemann's reports to prepare her for her new family, she must have figured out these were, err, just an aspect of the truth as soon as she met her future in-laws and SD and the sisters started sniggering. No wonder she hardly said a word.
It's also how Boswell introduces this anecdote in "Life of Johnson". Incidentally, I just realised that the same Mr. Croker who proudly censored the already censored Lord Hervey's memoirs some more in his edition also published the edition of Boswell's Life that Macauly pours much scorn on (only some of which is for Boswell himself) for not only censoring Boswell's Georgian frankness but interpolating Boswell's text with other Johnson biographies. Croker: the Henri de Catt of Victorian editors, clearly. It's a good thing Boswell's diaries weren't published until the 20th century.
Re: Stratemann
Date: 2020-10-07 11:39 pm (UTC)Suhm: Fritz gave up sleep to read my translation of Wolff! Which led him to recommend Wolff to AW, and, lo and behold, 6 months later, your guy FW is reading Wolff.
Mitchell: Probably, but
Lord Marischal: I know I technically don't count as an envoy *to* Fritz, but let's remember: you and I were both foreigners who met our respective kings and became BFFs *first*, then you were sent to Prussia as envoy *because* the king liked you. And I was sent as envoy by Fritz (G2 was hardly about to use me as envoy!) to France. So I say it counts that Fritz used to walk down the hill to eat with me at the Chinese Tea House instead of making me walk up the hill to Sanssouci.
Richard Wolff (editor): This is why the Stratemann gives us the real FW, not the unlovingly and harshly drawn distortion the Margravine as a bad daughter drew in her memoirs.
I don't know whether I want to say GAAHHH or GRRRR to this. Both. :P
He conveniently died in 1739, so he never got to know King Fritz. Or the kind of Queen EC ended up as being.
Stratemann and Grumbkow really picked a good year to die.
I mean, EC might have been the sole person who hadn't heard Fritz pre marriage had dragged his feet as long as he could and had not wanted her on any level, let alone that he told Grumbkow the marriage would be over once he was King.
Oof, you're right. This plus Polyanna Stratemann would explain a lot about her falling in love and holding out hope for so long. Even if you arrive and realize the family is dysfunctional, the guy *did* agree to marry you, and he is being nice to you, if distant...
Ouch.
It's also how Boswell introduces this anecdote in "Life of Johnson".
Well, that explains the coincidence, then. :)
Croker: the Henri de Catt of Victorian editors, clearly.
ZOMG. Oh, remember the 19th century Thiebault editor fleshing out the actual memoirs with passages from Wilhelmine, thus leading us down a garden path for a long time?
STOP IT.
Re: Stratemann
Date: 2020-10-08 07:02 am (UTC)Poniatowski: Did any of you get deflowered by the sexiest monarch of Europe, Catherine the Great? You did not. Nor did you end up on a throne as a result, however tragically this ended up being. This isn't even a competition, people.
Re: Stratemann
Date: 2020-10-09 02:09 am (UTC)Re: Stratemann
Date: 2020-10-09 06:31 am (UTC)Re: Stratemann
Date: 2020-10-13 12:07 am (UTC)As I recall from my lodgings in Magdeburg...I am the very model of a major envoy general.
Mitchell: You contradict yourself, sir. :P You got your country to pour money into Fritz's pockets, and what did you get out of it? An invasion of your richest province and an imprisonment of your person. We gave Fritz money and actually kept him from invading our province.
did Fritz do anything for Great Britain?
Mitchell: He sent us Ferdinand of Brunswick?
I am the very model of a major envoy general.
Mildred: I laughed!
Re: Stratemann
Date: 2020-10-16 07:31 pm (UTC)*chokes with laughter*
Re: Stratemann
Date: 2020-10-09 04:18 am (UTC)That is pretty impressive.
I managed to be friendly with him and Heinrich at the same time without either one getting paranoid on me, and that I didn't have to waste lots of bribery money on this.
That is even more impressive! Mitchell for the win!
Did any of you get deflowered by the sexiest monarch of Europe, Catherine the Great? You did not.
HAHAHAHAHAHA omg okay this made me laugh SO HARD :D
Re: Stratemann
Date: 2020-10-08 05:03 am (UTC)Oh noooooo. Poor EC. Though like you guys say downthread, Fritz did seem to treat her OK until he became king...
This informed their relationship in both good and bad ways, depending on whether Johnson thought Garrick needed to be defended or was overly praised. (I.e. it was a “no one talks trash about Davy but me” thing.)
hee :)
Stratemann - Küstrin poetry
Date: 2020-10-11 03:15 pm (UTC)You think his passion is music, I wish to God it were so! But he has a stronger inclination: he wants to write verse and become a poet. While he hasn’t a clue whether his ancestors won Magdeburg in a game of cards or whatever, he can count out Aristotle’s poetic rules on his fingers, and for the last two days he has been torturing himself to render into French some German verses that the idiot Wilke* has given him.
And Wilke is footnoted as a civil servant.
The citation for this letter is Volz, who footnotes Wilke as "Geheimer Kriegs- und Domänenrat." Which, as I recall, is the way Stratemann presents the author of the poem. Now, previously, Hille, the director of the Kriegs- und Domänenrat, was the only person we (or I) knew to be affiliated with that, but--I checked Stratemann more closely.
The footnote to the poem says to see page 198.
Page 198 says,
Wie Se. Königl. Hoheit zum ersten mahl in die dasige Cammer kommen, hat der 2. Secretarius, als ein fertiger Poet, Dieselbe mit einigen Versen bewillkommnet, worauf der Prinz auf gleiche Weise gar kurz geantwortet hat.
"2. Secretarius" I think *can't* be Hille, as he's the director. I think it must be Wilke, who's the "accomplished poet," and this is the poem Fritz was "torturing himself to render into French" given to him by "that idiot Wilke." And Stratemann writes that the poem is from the Kriegs- und Domänenrat (or apparently Kriegs und Dom. Cammer-Canzley, which, same diff) because it was formally presented to Fritz by the committee upon his first meeting attendance.
This makes more sense of Hille!
There's more, which I will report later as the weak flesh allows, but for now, I think we've identified our author.
Re: Stratemann - Küstrin poetry
Date: 2020-10-11 03:47 pm (UTC)Re: Stratemann - Küstrin poetry
Date: 2020-10-13 06:13 pm (UTC)But the random acts of kindness were definitely responsible for him not turning out worse than he did, so kudos to everyone who did their best in a sucky situation.
Re: Molière - Küstrin poetry
Date: 2020-10-17 11:41 pm (UTC)Royal Detective reporting for duty!
So, Volz gives the complete (afaict) letter from Hille to Grumbkow, and immediately after the whole "idiot Wilkes" passage, Hille continues:
Bis zur Erschlaffung sage ich ihm die Verse aus Molieres „Misanthrope“ über Oronte her. Er sagt sie seien wundervoll, und läßt sich nicht abbringen. Der Teufel hole seinen verwünschten Lehrer, der weiter nichts verstand, als ihm dergleichen seichtes Zeug in den Kopf zu setzen.
I [Hille] recited him the verses on Oronte from Molière's "Misanthrope" until I was exhausted. He said they were wonderful, and nothing could convince him otherwise. The devil take his cursed tutor [Duhan], who didn't know any better than to put this kind of shallow stuff into his head. [Translation mine; German speakers feel free to correct.]
The last sentence I'd seen quoted, but not the first two. And first I was surprised that Hille was trying to talk Fritz out of poetry by reading him Molière.
So I went and researched this play a bit, and wooooow, this is so much better than I realized.
Our protagonist [Alceste] is a guy who believes all of humanity is just full of empty flattery, he's not impressed with Baroque declarations of undying friendship to mere acquaintances, and he spends the first scene of Act I saying you shouldn't pretend feelings you don't have, you shouldn't tell white lies, and you definitely shouldn't flatter. Whether it's someone's personality, appearance, or painting, if you don't like it, you should tell them to their face. The guy he's talking to takes the stance that some politeness is called for in life.
Scene II: in comes a third party, Oronte. He's just written a poem and wants criticism on it.
Me at this point: Okay, I see why this was the first thing to come to mind for Hille.
But it gets better!
Our protagonist Alceste says he's way too blunt to give feedback, and Oronte is like, "No, no, that's exactly what I want! Bring on the honesty."
So Alceste agrees to hear the poem and give his honest opinion.
Oronte reads a bad poem, which he says he dashed off in 15 minutes. And Alceste gives a speech about how some people just aren't meant to be poets. And if you read this exchange with the mindset that Hille read it aloud to Fritz, and knowing what the rest of Fritz's life is going to be like...I died laughing.
Here goes.
First, the poem:
Hope, it is true, may bring relief
And rock to sleep awhile our pain;
But, Phyllis, what small gain and brief,
If nothing follow in its train!
You showed me some benevolence,
But should have shown me less, or none,
Nor put yourself to such expense
To give me hope, and hope alone.
I can dig up the French, but since none of us are fluent in French, the English will do just as well for now.
Now, Alceste gives his feedback.
ALCESTE
This is a ticklish subject always, sir;
We’re fond of being flattered for our wit.
But I was saying, just the other day,
To some one—I won't mention any names—
On hearing certain verses he had written,
That any gentleman should always keep
In stern control this writing itch we’re seized with;
That he must hold in check the great impatience
We feel to give the world these idle pastimes;
For, through this eagerness to show our works,
'Tis likely we shall cut a foolish figure.
ORONTE
And do you mean to intimate by this,
That I am wrong to wish . . . ?
ALCESTE
I don't say that.
But I was telling him, a frigid piece
Of writing, bores to death; and this one weakness
Is quite enough to damn a man, no matter
What sterling qualities he have withal;
For men are judged most often by their foibles.
ORONTE
Then do you think my sonnet bad?
ALCESTE
I don't say that.
But still, as reason for not writing,
I tried to make him see how, right among us,
This lust for ink has spoiled most worthy men.
ORONTE
Do I write badly then? D' ye mean I'm like 'em?
ALCESTE
I don't say that. But still (said I to him)
What is your urgent need of making verses?
And who the deuce should drive you into print?
Only poor creatures writing for a living
Can ever be excused for publishing
A wretched book. Come, come, resist temptation,
Conceal this sort of business from the public,
And don't, for anything, go and abandon
Your reputation as a gentleman
To get in place on't, from a greedy printer,
That of ridiculous and wretched scribe.
That's what I tried to make him understand.
...
ORONTE
And I maintain my lines are excellent.
ALCESTE
You have your reasons, sir, for thinking so;
But you must grant me reasons of my own,
And not expect that mine shall bow to yours.
ORONTE
I’m satisfied to find that others prize them.
ALCESTE
They have the art of feigning. I have not.
ORONTE
D' ye think you are endowed with all the brains?
ALCESTE
Did I but praise your rhymes, you'd grant me more.
ORONTE
I'll get along quite well without your praise.
ALCESTE
You'll have to get along without it, please.
ORONTE
I'd like to have you write, in your own style,
Some verses on the subject, just to see.
ALCESTE
I might, by bad luck, write as wretched ones;
But I'd be mighty careful not to show 'em.
Wooooow. Can you imagine Hille reading this out loud to 18-yo Fritz? I love it extra because just as Alceste is telling Oronte indirectly that he was telling someone else to stop writing bad poetry--but not telling Oronte directly that his poetry was bad or that he should stop writing!--Hille is reading aloud from a renowned French dramatist a piece explaining why Fritz should stop writing poetry or at the very least stop showing it to people.
Voltaire, Catt, Mitchell, Lucchesini: *lolsob*
Fredersdorf: Je ne parle pas français!
I also love that Fritz never, ever, ever backed down, even knowing that he wasn't a good poet (and that he never stopped wanting to become one).
Related, around the same time, I stumbled across this passage in his letters to Voltaire (1737, so shortly after they started corresponding). The first part we've seen in the big debate over whether it referred to Wreech, Orzelska, or someone else (Doris Ritter?), but the second paragraph was new to me, and it struck me in the context of those verses Hille read him:
A kind person inspired me in the flower of my young years two passions at the same time; you can well imagine that one was love, and the other
poetry. This little miracle of nature, with all possible graces, had taste and delicacy. She wanted to communicate them to me. I succeed quite well in love, but badly in poetry. Since that time, I have been in love quite often, and always a poet.
If you know some secret to cure men of this mania, you will really do Christian work to communicate it to me; otherwise I condemn you to teach me the rules of this enchanting art that you have embellished, and which, in turn, does you so much honor.
I'm convinced this is the context in which Fritz says, "I could have made something of myself if Voltaire had stuck around in Prussia." I really think he's talking about poetry, his major unfulfilled goal in life.
Meanwhile, <3 Wilke for welcoming poor traumatized Fritz to the domain chamber with a poem. And major <333 for Duhan, the guy who got the identical "come quickly!" message that Algarotti got.
Re: Molière - Küstrin poetry
Date: 2020-10-18 11:20 am (UTC)Many years ago, I saw a modern adaption of The Misanthrope, starring Damian Lewis as Alceste, no less, but while I still remember the general outline, I'd forgotten the details, including how applicable the scene with Oronte is to the Hille and Fritz situation. It's really perfect, and btw, it says something about just how deeply steeped into French culture an 18th century German noble was if even an FW approved official like Hille knows his Moliere well enough to have the correct allusion ready. (BTW, given Fritz at this stage was just to read theology, I wonder what Dad would have said to the lengthy Moliere quotation?)
As for Wilke, I shall honor him by trying my hand at a verse translation again.
Most noble Prince! Your purple here will shine,
where there's a portrait of the founder of your line,
Both eyes and shield across our borders was he,
and justly called a wise Prince across Germany.
Oh Lord! Will you indulge us with a gaze
of brightness, such as your mind otherwise
produces in abundance, and like our sun's rays
warm your good servant, whose devotion never lies.
Please let us kiss your hand in due humility,
and pledge our hearts to you forevermore,
and do excuse the probability
that, noble Prince, in obedience they were yours before.
Your glamor dazzles us and makes us now retreat,
and our humbleness must hem our tongue,
but praying for you shall be an easy feat,
for you, dear Prince, and also for the throne.
Fritz' short German reply poem:
The Prince is grateful for the effort made,
and gracefully accepts poetry's fruit;
If your loyality and duty do not fade,
he will reward such service, and such good.
Re: Molière - Küstrin poetry
Date: 2020-10-18 08:59 pm (UTC)Exactly what I was thinking!
BTW, given Fritz at this stage was just to read theology, I wonder what Dad would have said to the lengthy Moliere quotation?
Ooh, good point.
Hille: Your Majesty, it was for a good cause, I swear!
Lol, I remember you coming up with this exchange when we discovered Fritz's plan to marry into the Hapsburgs:
here's how I imagine things went down in Potsdam:
Grumpkow: Your Majesty, the crown prince is now very devout, praying with Pastor Muller.
FW: Good.
G: He's sworn of the English marriage project.
FW: He'd better.
G:...and wants to marry an Austrian arch duchess, convert to Chatholicism and move to Vienna.
FW: WTF?!!!!!
G: Just a suggestion, maybe allow him to play the flute again? Just as an alternative to Catholicism, of course.
Wilke thanks you for the honor you do him by translating his poems for us to appreciate. :)
Re: Molière - Küstrin poetry
Date: 2020-10-20 03:31 am (UTC)I don't know anything about Moliere's life story, but I'm going to go out on a limb and speculate that, like Voltaire, he probably got asked to beta read bad to mediocre poetry by rich people a lot. ;)
Re: Molière - Küstrin poetry
Date: 2020-10-20 06:20 am (UTC)(Also, another thing he had in common with Voltaire was that since he was an actor who got in trouble with the church a couple of times (notoriously, because of Tartuffe, the play in which he makes fun of a religious hypocrites), he nearly hadn't gotten a Christian burial; it needed the personal intervention of Louis XIV. for it to happen.
Re: Molière - Küstrin poetry
Date: 2020-10-18 01:53 pm (UTC)One thing that came to mind while thinking about the translation of the Hille quote, though:
... for the last two days he has been torturing himself to render into French some German verses that the idiot Wilke* has given him. I recited him the verses on Oronte from Molière's "Misanthrope" until I was exhausted. He said they were wonderful, and nothing could convince him otherwise. The devil take his cursed tutor [Duhan], who didn't know any better than to put this kind of shallow stuff into his head.
If this is all one paragraph - which is what it looks like in the original - then I'd suspect that the bolded they ["sie" originally, not any more clear on what it's referring to, so not a translation problem] might mean Wilke's verses, not Moliere's, and that Fritz might have understood Hille's Moliere reference to mean mostly Wilke and not himself, therefore seeing himself in the position of Alceste more than Oronte here?
Either way, I'm delighted that Hille basically accomplished the opposite of what he wanted.
Re: Fritz' passion for poetry, I really liked the recurring "I don't want your flattery, I know my poetry isn't that great, I rather want you to correct me and tell me what I'm doing wrong, because I want to learn" theme in Fritz' letters to Voltaire.
Re: Molière - Küstrin poetry
Date: 2020-10-18 03:22 pm (UTC)Yeah, I went back and forth on what "they" was, and finally settled on "probably Wilke's verses", but it *is* really confusing having "sie" refer to not the most recent applicable plural noun, but the one before it. I should have said something, but I just translated it literally and waited to see what the German speakers thought. :)
Either way, I'm delighted that Hille basically accomplished the opposite of what he wanted.
Fritz at the end of his life: So, Dad and Hille, I still write verses like I'm running out of time, and also I still believe in predestination. Hah!
Re: Fritz' passion for poetry, I really liked the recurring "I don't want your flattery, I know my poetry isn't that great, I rather want you to correct me and tell me what I'm doing wrong, because I want to learn" theme in Fritz' letters to Voltaire.
Yeah, that is great. People not Voltaire were still in a dicey position when asked to offer feedback, but fortunately Mitchell was a professional diplomat and managed to couch his such that Fritz accepted criticism (which, without any data, I'm going to guess was partly to Fritz's credit, partly to Mitchell's).
Re: Molière - Küstrin poetry
Date: 2020-10-20 05:31 am (UTC)Man, I haven't read any Molière but one of these days...