* Oh, man, AW starts to feel a little better, and laments how his strong constitution is binding his soul to his body. Knowing how this is going to end... :-((((
* FRITZ. THOSE LETTERS.
* Es ist bewundernswert, wie es dem Prinzen aus Rücksicht au seine Verwandten und Freunde gelang, sie über sein körperliches und seelisches Elend zu täuschen.
Google translates "bewundernswert" as "admirable." Is it "admirable," or would "impressive" or "remarkable" or something like that be better? Because "admirable" to me means, "This was the right thing to do," whereas "impressive" or "remarkable" would mean, "Doing this highlighted many of AW's good qualities."
Because while you certainly have the right not to tell people about your health, I would take issue with saying that doing it to protect them is necessarily admirable, even if it's impressive. Like maybe Lehndorff would have liked to get there in time to say goodbye.
Now, if AW didn't tell people because he didn't want nonstop pressure to see doctors and he didn't want to deal with everyone else's emotions, *that* I could get behind. I've read too many accounts by terminally ill or potentially terminally ill people about how they were expected to perform emotional labor for everyone else at the absolute nadir of their own mental health. AW is definitely making a very unpopular decision here, and I could see him not wanting to defend it against all comers.
* "Egerer Brunnen" -- this is mineral water from Eger?
* The opium they gave AW to slow the bleeding probably caused his death to be more painful than it would have been. See, this is why on the one hand, the stress from the Fritz situation probably weakened AW's immune system in addition to his will to live, and thereby his chances of survival, but on the other, refusing to see doctors, as much as it might have been caused by a death wish, might actually not have hurt his chances that much.
Ugh. Everything sucks so much.
* cahn, what Google translates as "blow flow", Schlagfluss, is a stroke.
* OMG, I didn't realize Lehndorff arrived the same day AW died, but too late. :-(
Then he drives the first nail into the coffin. :'-(((
"No, you don't die from pain. I am proof of that."
</33 POOR LEHNDORFF
* WOW, Google, this may be the best mistranslation ever, even surpassing the "cheap warehouse in rubbish soaps" or "Cape Stallion":
When AW in his will is decreeing that Louise doesn't get to take (zu sich nehmen) the kids...Google translates this as, "She shouldn't eat my daughter."
Not that that phrase doesn't mean that, but major context fail, Google. On the other hand, that's one way to translate the will so that AW looks like the good guy!
AW: really just misunderstood this whole time. :P
More seriously, I know children belonged to their fathers, legally, for a super long time, but "She shouldn't take my daughter" is just one of those ugh moments.
* "But if she does go and live in my house in Berlin, against my will, instead of in that place FW would have liked out in the middle of nowhere, the kids should live elsewhere." AW! This is why cahn wanted to read about your horrible undeserved treatment before reading about your wife's horrible undeserved treatment.
* Continuing with this theme: Apparently it wasn't customary for women to take part in the burial of their husbands.
I mean, it keeps you from having to fake grief in cases like this, but what about those actually happy marriages? Was this just for royal funerals, military funerals, or what? Because Ariane will be at Peter's funeral, FIGHT ME. :P
I want to believe FW2 invited EC to Fritz's funeral just because. :P
* Fritz kept his word to be a second father to the kids! Wilhelmine and Henricus Minor are proof of that!
FW2: *crickets*
Fritz: Do you by chance know what "father" means in this family?
* Louise getting to see her mother for the first time in ages alleviates her grief over the loss of her husband. Either she's really an angel, or the word we're looking for here is "stress."
* And EC gets to see her husband's palace for the first time. The Potsdam City Palace? Because I thought 1760 was when she saw Sanssouci and MT's portrait for the first time, per Lehndorff's oft-quoted comment.
* Alas, poor Karl Emil, we hardly knew ye.
And, that's it for me. I finished AW! Sons and Wives next. Reading group continues to be the best!
I'd translate "bewunderswert" in this specific context as "remarkable" as well, though in other circumstances as admirable.
"Egerer Brunnen" -- this is mineral water from Eger?
Yes. Same as Cothenius prescribes for Heinrich later.
AW! This is why [personal profile] cahn wanted to read about your horrible undeserved treatment before reading about your wife's horrible undeserved treatment.
You can imagine I had a strange sense of deja vue when I got the the end of the Hervey biography. His political career is in tatters, his relationship with Stephen Fox ditto, his bff Lady Mary is in Italy; Hervey is majorly depressed, and writing famously bitchy secret memoirs evidently is not enough to vent, because (oh, Lord Bristol is his father, who outlived Hervey):
A week later he decided to draw up his will.Not strong enough to write , he dictated it, and then read it over twice to correct the spelling. Most of its provisions were conventional enough : his eldest son to be sole heir and executor, annuities to all his children , dowries of £ 5,000 for his eldest unmarried daughter, Mary , and £ 4,000 each to the two other girls, annuities to his housekeeper and to his valet. But the bequest to his wife was astonishing: she could have only what he was obliged to leave her by the terms of their marriage contract, and nothing more ; and while she could dispose of some things at her death , she must give security for all the money, silver , and jewels , and bequeath them to one of her children born during wedlock .
The same day that he dictated and corrected his will he wrote a brief letter (evidently in his own hand) addressed to Mrs. Strangways Horner. 'Dear Madam ,' it runs, 'If you have a mind to shew any Regard to my Memory fullfill this my last Request & take my Daughter Miss Mary Hervey to live with You. She is very well disposed & will continue so living with one of your excellent Principles & real honest worth . I love and honour You. Adieu .'He gave the letter to his daughter with instructions that she deliver it to Mrs. Horner after his death . That event was not far off . By mid-July he was dangerously ill, and on 5 August he died . His father showed his love for him even at the burial a week later in the Ickworth church , for instead of a woollen shroud to clothe the corpse, as the law required , Lord Bristol chose another cloth (probably linen ) and paid a fine of £ s. The only other member of the Hervey family who enjoyed this posthumous luxury was Lord Bristol bimself. (...)
His will was the chief topic of conversation in London , particularly its provisions for Lady Hervey. No one knew why he had treated her in such a way; and it was said that he had refused to see her for many weeks before he died . Because of her modest jointure - only £ 300 a year — she would have to live with Lord Bristol, no great hardship since they were devoted to each other . Then, after the will had been read , early in September Mrs. Horner was startled by a visit from Mary Hervey with a letter from her late father. When Mrs. Horner overcame her surprise she sent a copy of the letter to Lady Hervey, assuring her that she was an ‘utter Stranger to the Purport ' before she was informed of it by Miss Hervey, and that for many reasons she could not comply with its request. Lady Hervey displayed impeccable tact in thanking Mrs. Horner for her considerate letter : 'I am not surpriz'd at any proof of Esteem given you by My Dear late Lord ,knowing the great Friendship he had for you, Madam ; and I am as little so at the very right Manner in which you have acted on this Occasion .' Lady Hervey remained the most considerate of wives.
Keep in mind Lady Hervey, formerly Maria "Molly" Lepel, had not been an arranged marriage, she'd been Hervey's choice, a love match. She also had done all a wife of their time was expected to; befriended his friends, supported him through think and thin; she even, during an earlier crisis in his relationship with Stephen Fox, had invited Stephen for the summer to their country seat, then discreetly withdrew and went elsewhere so they could be alone together and work it out. And if she in turn ever cheated on Hervey, no one ever knew. And yet.
"When feeling miserable, there's always your wife to punch down to" seems to be an 18th century maxim. Ugh.
EC and Sanssouci: the Lehndorff entry and EC's first and only visit were in 1757, actually, during the first court evacuation from Berlin. The relevant Lehndorff's diary entry is dated 23. October 1757, if you want to look it up in your copy. So not quite a year before AW's death. Though of course the court did evacuate in 1758 as well, just not with a stop in Sanssouci.
I'd translate "bewunderswert" in this specific context as "remarkable" as well, though in other circumstances as admirable.
Perfect, thank you! I have strong feelings about "admirable" in this context, but "remarkable", yes, it was, definitely.
You can imagine I had a strange sense of deja vue when I got the the end of the Hervey biography.
Hervey did what?!
Keep in mind Lady Hervey, formerly Maria "Molly" Lepel, had not been an arranged marriage, she'd been Hervey's choice, a love match.
That's even worse. I mean, a marriage that starts in love doesn't have to end better than an arranged one (this is why I believe in no-fault divorce), but that's no reason to take the kids away!
She also had done all a wife of their time was expected to; befriended his friends, supported him through think and thin; she even, during an earlier crisis in his relationship with Stephen Fox, had invited Stephen for the summer to their country seat, then discreetly withdrew and went elsewhere so they could be alone together and work it out.
Wow. That's some devotion right there. At least the executors and beneficiaries of these wills are right there WTFing with us?
Ugh indeed.
EC and Sanssouci: the Lehndorff entry and EC's first and only visit were in 1757, actually
This is what I get for going from memory. Thank you! (And you'd even think after recent reading and discussion I'd remember better, but no go. ;) )
Wow I am SO BEHIND HERE. Maybe I can catch up on comments by the end of the weekend...
what Google translates as "blow flow", Schlagfluss, is a stroke.
Ah, thank you! I figured it had to be something like that, but there are so many random things it could have been :P
"No, you don't die from pain. I am proof of that."
THIS
When AW in his will is decreeing that Louise doesn't get to take (zu sich nehmen) the kids...Google translates this as, "She shouldn't eat my daughter."
Not that that phrase doesn't mean that, but major context fail, Google.
LOL, see, that one I was like "...bwuh? I know what that word means!" I didn't realize it was an idiom that Google was helpfully putting in! LOL, yes.
![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
timeasmymeasure
AW readthrough - the final year
Date: 2020-09-08 01:49 am (UTC)* FRITZ. THOSE LETTERS.
* Es ist bewundernswert, wie es dem Prinzen aus Rücksicht au seine Verwandten und Freunde gelang, sie über sein körperliches und seelisches Elend zu täuschen.
Google translates "bewundernswert" as "admirable." Is it "admirable," or would "impressive" or "remarkable" or something like that be better? Because "admirable" to me means, "This was the right thing to do," whereas "impressive" or "remarkable" would mean, "Doing this highlighted many of AW's good qualities."
Because while you certainly have the right not to tell people about your health, I would take issue with saying that doing it to protect them is necessarily admirable, even if it's impressive. Like maybe Lehndorff would have liked to get there in time to say goodbye.
Now, if AW didn't tell people because he didn't want nonstop pressure to see doctors and he didn't want to deal with everyone else's emotions, *that* I could get behind. I've read too many accounts by terminally ill or potentially terminally ill people about how they were expected to perform emotional labor for everyone else at the absolute nadir of their own mental health. AW is definitely making a very unpopular decision here, and I could see him not wanting to defend it against all comers.
* "Egerer Brunnen" -- this is mineral water from Eger?
* The opium they gave AW to slow the bleeding probably caused his death to be more painful than it would have been. See, this is why on the one hand, the stress from the Fritz situation probably weakened AW's immune system in addition to his will to live, and thereby his chances of survival, but on the other, refusing to see doctors, as much as it might have been caused by a death wish, might actually not have hurt his chances that much.
Ugh. Everything sucks so much.
*
* OMG, I didn't realize Lehndorff arrived the same day AW died, but too late. :-(
Then he drives the first nail into the coffin. :'-(((
"No, you don't die from pain. I am proof of that."
</33 POOR LEHNDORFF
* WOW, Google, this may be the best mistranslation ever, even surpassing the "cheap warehouse in rubbish soaps" or "Cape Stallion":
When AW in his will is decreeing that Louise doesn't get to take (zu sich nehmen) the kids...Google translates this as, "She shouldn't eat my daughter."
Not that that phrase doesn't mean that, but major context fail, Google. On the other hand, that's one way to translate the will so that AW looks like the good guy!
AW: really just misunderstood this whole time. :P
More seriously, I know children belonged to their fathers, legally, for a super long time, but "She shouldn't take my daughter" is just one of those ugh moments.
* "But if she does go and live in my house in Berlin, against my will, instead of in that place FW would have liked out in the middle of nowhere, the kids should live elsewhere." AW! This is why
* Continuing with this theme: Apparently it wasn't customary for women to take part in the burial of their husbands.
I mean, it keeps you from having to fake grief in cases like this, but what about those actually happy marriages? Was this just for royal funerals, military funerals, or what? Because Ariane will be at Peter's funeral, FIGHT ME. :P
I want to believe FW2 invited EC to Fritz's funeral just because. :P
* Fritz kept his word to be a second father to the kids! Wilhelmine and Henricus Minor are proof of that!
FW2: *crickets*
Fritz: Do you by chance know what "father" means in this family?
* Louise getting to see her mother for the first time in ages alleviates her grief over the loss of her husband. Either she's really an angel, or the word we're looking for here is "stress."
* And EC gets to see her husband's palace for the first time. The Potsdam City Palace? Because I thought 1760 was when she saw Sanssouci
and MT's portraitfor the first time, per Lehndorff's oft-quoted comment.* Alas, poor Karl Emil, we hardly knew ye.
And, that's it for me. I finished AW! Sons and Wives next. Reading group continues to be the best!
Re: AW readthrough - the final year
Date: 2020-09-08 07:00 am (UTC)"Egerer Brunnen" -- this is mineral water from Eger?
Yes. Same as Cothenius prescribes for Heinrich later.
AW! This is why [personal profile] cahn wanted to read about your horrible undeserved treatment before reading about your wife's horrible undeserved treatment.
You can imagine I had a strange sense of deja vue when I got the the end of the Hervey biography. His political career is in tatters, his relationship with Stephen Fox ditto, his bff Lady Mary is in Italy; Hervey is majorly depressed, and writing famously bitchy secret memoirs evidently is not enough to vent, because (oh, Lord Bristol is his father, who outlived Hervey):
A week later he decided to draw up his will.Not strong enough to write , he dictated it, and then read it over twice to correct the spelling. Most of its provisions were conventional enough : his eldest son to be sole heir and executor, annuities to all his children , dowries of £ 5,000 for his eldest unmarried daughter, Mary , and £ 4,000 each to the two other girls, annuities to his housekeeper and to his valet. But the bequest to his wife was astonishing: she could have only what he was obliged to leave her by the terms of their marriage contract, and nothing more ; and while she could dispose of some things at her death , she must give security for all the money, silver , and jewels , and bequeath them to one of her
children born during wedlock .
The same day that he dictated and corrected his will he wrote a brief letter (evidently in his own hand) addressed to Mrs.
Strangways Horner. 'Dear Madam ,' it runs, 'If you have a mind to shew any Regard to my Memory fullfill this my last Request & take my Daughter Miss Mary Hervey to live with You. She is very well disposed & will continue so living with one of your excellent Principles & real honest worth . I love and honour You. Adieu .'He gave the letter to his daughter with instructions that she deliver it to Mrs. Horner after his death . That event was not far off . By mid-July he was dangerously ill, and on 5 August he died . His father showed his love for him even at the burial a week later in the Ickworth church , for instead of a woollen shroud to clothe the corpse, as the law required , Lord Bristol chose another cloth (probably linen ) and paid a fine of £ s. The only other member of the Hervey family who enjoyed this
posthumous luxury was Lord Bristol bimself. (...)
His will was the chief topic of conversation in London , particularly its provisions for Lady Hervey. No one knew why he had
treated her in such a way; and it was said that he had refused to see her for many weeks before he died . Because of her modest jointure - only £ 300 a year — she would have to live with Lord Bristol, no great hardship since they were devoted to each other . Then, after the will had been read , early in September Mrs. Horner was startled by a visit from Mary Hervey with a letter from her late father. When Mrs. Horner overcame her surprise she sent a copy of the letter to Lady Hervey, assuring her that she was an ‘utter Stranger to the Purport ' before she was informed of it by Miss Hervey, and that for many reasons she could not comply with its request. Lady Hervey displayed impeccable tact in thanking
Mrs. Horner for her considerate letter : 'I am not surpriz'd at any proof of Esteem given you by My Dear late Lord ,knowing the great Friendship he had for you, Madam ; and I am as little so at the very right Manner in which you have acted on this Occasion .'
Lady Hervey remained the most considerate of wives.
Keep in mind Lady Hervey, formerly Maria "Molly" Lepel, had not been an arranged marriage, she'd been Hervey's choice, a love match. She also had done all a wife of their time was expected to; befriended his friends, supported him through think and thin; she even, during an earlier crisis in his relationship with Stephen Fox, had invited Stephen for the summer to their country seat, then discreetly withdrew and went elsewhere so they could be alone together and work it out. And if she in turn ever cheated on Hervey, no one ever knew. And yet.
"When feeling miserable, there's always your wife to punch down to" seems to be an 18th century maxim. Ugh.
EC and Sanssouci: the Lehndorff entry and EC's first and only visit were in 1757, actually, during the first court evacuation from Berlin. The relevant Lehndorff's diary entry is dated 23. October 1757, if you want to look it up in your copy. So not quite a year before AW's death. Though of course the court did evacuate in 1758 as well, just not with a stop in Sanssouci.
Re: AW readthrough - the final year
Date: 2020-09-08 09:13 pm (UTC)Perfect, thank you! I have strong feelings about "admirable" in this context, but "remarkable", yes, it was, definitely.
You can imagine I had a strange sense of deja vue when I got the the end of the Hervey biography.
Hervey did what?!
Keep in mind Lady Hervey, formerly Maria "Molly" Lepel, had not been an arranged marriage, she'd been Hervey's choice, a love match.
That's even worse. I mean, a marriage that starts in love doesn't have to end better than an arranged one (this is why I believe in no-fault divorce), but that's no reason to take the kids away!
She also had done all a wife of their time was expected to; befriended his friends, supported him through think and thin; she even, during an earlier crisis in his relationship with Stephen Fox, had invited Stephen for the summer to their country seat, then discreetly withdrew and went elsewhere so they could be alone together and work it out.
Wow. That's some devotion right there. At least the executors and beneficiaries of these wills are right there WTFing with us?
Ugh indeed.
EC and Sanssouci: the Lehndorff entry and EC's first and only visit were in 1757, actually
This is what I get for going from memory. Thank you! (And you'd even think after recent reading and discussion I'd remember better, but no go. ;) )
Re: AW readthrough - the final year
Date: 2020-09-12 05:14 am (UTC)WHY Lord Hervey????
"When feeling miserable, there's always your wife to punch down to" seems to be an 18th century maxim. Ugh.
Apparently! :(
Re: AW readthrough - the final year
Date: 2020-09-12 05:01 am (UTC)what Google translates as "blow flow", Schlagfluss, is a stroke.
Ah, thank you! I figured it had to be something like that, but there are so many random things it could have been :P
"No, you don't die from pain. I am proof of that."
THIS
When AW in his will is decreeing that Louise doesn't get to take (zu sich nehmen) the kids...Google translates this as, "She shouldn't eat my daughter."
Not that that phrase doesn't mean that, but major context fail, Google.
LOL, see, that one I was like "...bwuh? I know what that word means!" I didn't realize it was an idiom that Google was helpfully putting in! LOL, yes.
But yes, also an ugh moment :(((((