See, this is why I'm loving the apocryphal story about Elisabeth's reaction to a similar Fritz command so much. (And am without pity for George Keith, if it was him who brought the command.)
Sorry, I'm lost -- remind me?
Yeah. :/ Unfortunately, unlike (parts of) his bad condolence letters, I don't think the part that [personal profile] cahn reacted to was just lack of emotional intelligence: I suspect this one was very deliberate.
Yes, I think it must have been deliberate; the condolence letters do read to me like someone who was just thinking of himself rather than others, but Fritz wasn't emotionally stupid, and there is no way he could have missed how this was going to come off to AW. WOW.
The one fascinating exception I can think of is Richelieu...
Most other men (and a few women) of power, though, seem to have suffered from that syndrome described in Robert Graves' "I, Claudius", where successive emperors are absolutely on board with appointing someone they know to be worse as their successor because it'll make them look better in the eyes of posterity instead of them being outshone.
Wow, this is really interesting! Both that it's such a common problem and that Richelieu was the exception (which I didn't know). We're nominating him for Yuletide, right? Do you have any thoughts on why he was an exception?
Also I need to read I, Claudius again. I read it in... high school or college? A really long time ago, and have forgotten everything about it.
Apocryphal story: So Elisabeth and future FW2, while both interested in sex, are not at all interested in sex with each other. Fritz, in a stunning combination of sudden feminist view and double standard, will later write both to Elisabeth's mother Charlotte and in one of his histories that he blames future FW2 for the failure of the Elisabeth/FW2 marriage, since future FW2 was "neglecting the charms" of his wife, and the neglected princess then looked for consolation elsewhere. But this is after the scandal. Supposedly, before everything became public but after it was already apparant what a failure that marriage was, Fritz sent an older trusted official (according to legend George Keith, Lord Marishal) to Elisabeth to tell her that he'll turn a blind eye if she's discreet and chooses some one of impeccable old nobility to father an heir to the throne (as soon as possible, please).
To which Elisabeth supposedly said to old George Keith: "Well, if it is my duty to fuck on the King's command, how about you and me, then, right here, right now?"
Whereaupon George Keith, veteran of Jacobite uprisings and life with Fritz, ran away and told Fritz it was hopeless.
Do you have any thoughts on why he was an exception?
For starters, he had lived through a time when France was badly governed, he did care about the future of the realm, and he never took anything for granted. Richelieu was born Armand du Plessis, third son to very provincial nobility; his mother even came from non-noble stock. (And was tough as nails in adversity, as it turned out.) Even worse, the du Plessis family had various unstable members. Richelieu's father and oldest brother died in a duel, and his favourite sister and second brother had nervous breakdowns and became insane, though that happened after he'd already become powerful. Back to young Armand, of whom not much is expected, other than make his way as an officer in the King's service, probably (the job for provincial nobles without an estate of heir own). His oldest brother is in line to inherit the title (of Marquis du Plessis - "Richelieu" didn't come until much, much later), of course, and brother No.2. ,Alphonse, is as second brother's do supposed to make a career in the church (and contribute to the family income via being the bishop of Lucon, to which the du Plessis have an inherited claim).
Then Dad dies in a duel, and Alphonse wants to become a priest, alright, but a monk without any worldly possessions, because he takes this vow of poverty thing seriously. He absolutely refuses to become Bishop of Lucon. Which is when Mom, Suzanne the ex-middle class girl who married a provincial noble, decides fifteen years old Armand isn't going to become a soldier, he'll study theology now and become bishop of Lucon, thus securing the family income.
Young Armand may have had other ideas about his future, but he's the type to go "if I do something, I'll do it well, dammit!" So he studies theology in record time. But now there's been some reforms in the Church following the Council of Trent, which means no longer can youngsters be made bishops without special dispensation by the Pope himself. And Armand is still only 20. So Armand goes to Rome, charms the Pope (who is a bit distrustful of France right now, what with the current king, Henri "Paris is worth a mass" IV., survivor of the St. Barholomew's Massacre and son-in-law to Catherine de' Medici, being an ex-Protestant who already changed religion twice, but Armand makes a convincing case to the Pope says "Henricus armandus armando" and gives young Armand the necessary special dispensation.
Now Mom didn't expect him to actually be bishop, just titular bishop, and get the revenues. After all, Lucon had been adminstred by local clergy during all those years with a vacant bishop seat. But Armand has other ideas. He goes to little boring Lucon, gives everyone a kick in the behind and reorganizes everything, because he's a life long workoholic and this is his first job. Still, after a few years he might have a model bishopry, but it's in the provinces, and his restless energies no longr have a target. Luckily for young Armand if not for France, this is when Henri IV. gets assassinated, leaving behind his kid son Louis XIII., his second wife Marie de' Medici (not to be confused with Catherine by any means), second son Gaston and several daughters. Which means a French General Assembly is called for - the last, in fact, before the years just before the French Revolution - in which young Armand gets to represent the clergy of his province in Paris. This assembly is his chance to make an impression on the new Regent, Marie de' Medici, and her lover Concinci, the power behind the throne. And he does.
Concini and his wife Leonora (who started out as Marie de' Medici's dwarf) basically see their position as the chance to plunder the realm. Armand sees it as a chance to make a career. Young Louis XIII hates his mother's lover, and also is painfully aware Mom likes his second brother Gaston much better. He doesn't think much of anyone connected to Concini, which means that for now, he dislikes Armand du Plessis along with the rest of them. When Louis' falconer de Luynes organizes a coup against Concini, Louis is all for it. This ends very bloodily; Concini is literally torn apart by the mob, which Armand witnesses and never forgets as an education in what can happen to even the most powerful man of the realm. Anyone connected to Concini is banished, which means Armand ends up in Avignon in exile for a while, thinking hard. Alas, he's not alone there; his family is supposed to go with him. This includes his oldest brother Henri, the Marquis du Richelieu, whose wife is pregnant. Henri petitions the King to let his wife give birth first and not risk her life. No dice. Dead baby, dead wife, Henri gets into a stupid duel and gets himself killed, and Armand decides duels are an infuriatingly stupid habit and plague on the land. For now, he's writing a pamphlet against them; later, he will forbid them, which makes him even more unpopular with a lot of young nobles and provides Dumas with a plot point in "The Three Musketeers".
Armand's brooding in Avignon is practical in nature, as in: how do I get out of this? He takes up corespondance with Luynes. For starters, he offers himself as a middle man between Louis and his estranged mother Marie de' Medici. This gets accepted. When Armand works out a deal and the Queen Mother's return to Paris, he (and his family) gets to come back as well. Luynes' nephew marries Richelieu's favourite niece (Marie-Madelaine, for now Madame de Combalet, later Duchesse D'Aguillon in her own right; if Richelieu truly loved another person, it will be said, it is her). By the time Luynes dies, Richelieu is well established in the administration. So well that when a Cardinal's hat gets free (France at that time got to have two cardinals), he makes a succesful play for it, at which he gains a new title and becames Monsieur le Cardinal de Richelieu.
Relations with Louis himself have also improved, though they are never easy. Louis continues to have male favourites, though unlike his younger son Philippe d'Orleans he's very repressed about this and probably did not have sex with any of them. (Post Luysnes, they also did not have political power, because that was Richelieu's job.) For now, he's son-less, which is important, because his marriage to Anne of Austria goes from bad to worse, and his scheming brother, Gaston d'Orleans, really really REALLY wants to become King himself. Does it help to have Richelieu in your corner? Yes, it does. Louis and Richelieu form a partnership which is maintained for the rest of their lives, despite several crisis, including the infamous "Day of Dupes". At this point the Queen Mother, who'd imagined Richelieu would be her creature, after finding herself rudely disillusioned in this regard took against him, and put an "him or me" ultimatum to Louis. Now, before that, she'd verbally abused Richelieu's niece Madame de Combalet and then triumphantly swept into her son's cabinet to put said ultimatum. Madame de Combalet races to notify her uncle what's going on, Richelieu knows a secret door to the cabinet and shows up just in time to make his case.
By now, the courtiers are alert to something major going on, but they think the Queen Mother will win, and when everyone leaves the cabinet, Richelieu with a downcast look, they act accordingly. Big mistake, and the reason why this is called "The Day of the Dupes". Because Louis' reply to "him or me" had actually been "bye, Mom".
Richelieu is now the most poweful and best hated man of France, and will remain so for the rest of his life, though several conspiracies and uprisings, oh, and wars. The relationship with Louis is perhaps best epitomized by this anecdote:
Louis (after a long day and evening, when they're done with the work, tersely): Go ahead.(I.e. leave the room first.) You are the true King anyway, aren't you?
Richelieu is now in a binder: if he does this, it's an insult to the king, if he says "no", it's an insult as well. What does he do?
Richelieu *taking up candle, assuming the position of lowly servant, but does leave the cabinet first*: Just to illuminate the way for your majesty.
Wow, this is amazing. And yeah, I guess I can see how all of this would make Richelieu, well, exceptional. Especially which Armand witnesses and never forgets as an education in what can happen to even the most powerful man of the realm. , holy cow.
Concini and his wife Leonora (who started out as Marie de' Medici's dwarf)
...really??
Also, I super love how Madame de Combalet becomes an important character/plot point! :D Go Madame de Combalet!
Richelieu *taking up candle, assuming the position of lowly servant, but does leave the cabinet first*: Just to illuminate the way for your majesty.
Madame de Combalet's husband died fairly early; she then essentially became Richelieu's Fredersdorf, managing her uncle's daiy-to-day life. (Which given he was the PM demanded considerable organizational skills.) Rather than arrange antoher marriage for her, he got Louis to make her a Duchess in her own right (hence her becoming the Duchesse d'Aiguillon, when there was no Duc de Aiguillon), which was highly unusual. She also became an important patron of the arts; Corneille dedicated his great play Le Cid to her. Richelieu telling her he'd loved her on his deathbed was basically the last thing he said.
On a less sentimental note, another quote from Richelieu on his deathbed is so very him that it ends up said by very much alive Richelieu in many historical fictions starring him, to wit:
"Does your Eminence forgive your enemies? "My enemies? I never had enemies but the enemies of the state."
The Richard Lester directed two part film version of "The Three Musketeers", which, despite all the 1960s slapstick, is actually by far the most book faithful, especially compared to more resent US ones, is also the only movie version incorporating this, in this case when our hero D'Artagnan gets a job offer from Richelieu - who, as a reminder, is one of the two main antagonists of the films - and virtuously declines, adding he counts it as an honor to be regarded as Richelieu's enemy. Then the scene goes:
Richelieu (amused): My enemy? Dear boy, I have no enemies but the enemies of the state.
Richelieu is played by Charlton Heston, cast against type; for my money it's one of his best roles and shows that acting outside his comfort range was something he could actually do.)
Leonora: indeed. After her husband got killed and torn apart by the mob, she got a show trial and as accused of having used magic to dominate the Queen Mother. Said Leonora, scornfully: "I used no power but that which is given to a strong mind over a weak one."
Said an admiring 19th century historian who overwise was pretty much misogniystic: This statement alone justifies her existence to history. I mean, Leonora got executed anyway, but it was a classic burn.
:D I'm so glad Madame de Combalet got not only a good story, but a good relationship and a good life (especially after hearing about Emma :( and Leonora :( )
I didn't realize that forgiving one's enemies was one of the things one was asked in deathbed confessions until, uh, quite recent reading. :P That is fantastic.
Clearly I am going to have to put Three Musketeers on my list (which maybe someday I will actually make any headway on?? this year has been the Worst for processing any video) (and also reread the book, as I remember basically zero about it)
My icon is from the Lester movies, using a quote about Richelieu. As for a lot of other movie versions, here is the entry in which I make fun of one basic problem modern scriptwriters all seem to share when it comes to the Cardinal.
I didn't realize that forgiving one's enemies was one of the things one was asked in deathbed confessions until, uh, quite recent reading. :P That is fantastic.
Reading Macaulay recently reminded me of this anecdote of FW on his deathbed (or a sickbed that he ended up recovering from, not sure):
Roloff: And then there is forgiveness of enemies; Your Majesty is bound to forgive all men, or how can you ask to be forgiven? FW: Well, I will; I do. You Feekin [his wife, Queen Sophie], write to your brother (unforgiveablest of beings), after I am dead, that I forgave him, died in peace with him. Roloff: Better Her Majesty should write at once. FW: No, after I am dead, that will be safer!
The passage ends: "At parting he said to Roloff, 'You (Er, He) do not spare me; it is right. You do your duty like an honest Christian man.'"
You better believe this anecdote was not reported by Macaulay, hater of FW. This is the 1882 editor chiding Macaulay for his one-sided portrayal of FW and trying to show FW in a better light, for which the editor quotes at length a passage from Carlyle.
Allow me to add that the correct German spelling for the Sophie nickname is "Fieke". Also, LOL about George II being the most unforgivable of all beings. See, dead and alive Fritz boyfriends, there's someone he resents more!
To clarify for cahn, I'm taking "unforgiveablest of beings" as a Carlyle addendum, not a direct FW quote, but the fact that it's George II he feels the most need to forgive (but not a moment before he has to!) *is* very telling.
We're nominating him for Yuletide, right? Do you have any thoughts on why he was an exception?
Different Richelieu, alas! Richelieu the 17th century power behind the throne, THE Richelieu, was Cardinal Richelieu (1585-1642). Our 18th century Enlightenment Yuletide prospect Richelieu, lover of Émilie and friend of Voltaire, is the Cardinal's great-greatnephew, the Duc de Richelieu (1696-1788).
*facepalm* My complete inability to do dates strikes again. I did know that Cardinal Richelieu predated the Sun King, so you would have thought that I would have realized that this necessarily meant he would have to predate Émilie. Lol, I am so glad this is a nonjudgmental space, that is really embarrassing.
Maybe someone else will nominate him for Yuletide! :)
If it's a comfort, I suspect Fritz at least once intermingled the two in his head as well. Keep in mind here that in addition to being Voltaire's bff, Enlightenment!Richelieu was also one of the 7 Years War Campaign leaders against Fritz, and not one he personally defeated on the field. So, when during their later years history and philosophy letters, Heinrich and Fritz have this exchange:
Heinrich: Richelieu was cool. Fritz: He was not! He was a bad, bad man who estranged Louis XIII from his mother! *now follows a literal Fritz quote* Richelieu was haughty and vengeful, I insist on it, and I refuse him the title of great in all his wickedness.
...I can't help but wonder whether he's projecting some anger over the other other man in Voltaire's life here on the Cardinal. I mean, Enlightenment!Richelieu also contributed by far the most money to the nude statue, too.:)
Very likely - he opens his anti Richelieu suada with I see, my dear brother, that, at whatever cost, you want to raise our species. And very Fritzian, he closes it with: I only grant him the title of enlightened minister when he unites with the Swedes to demean Austrian despotism in Germany.
That's one way of describing Richelieu, PM of Catholic France and himself a Cardinal, making an alliance with Protestant Gustav Adolf of Sweden in the middle of the 30 Years War (supposedly a war of religion) against the Catholic HRE Emperor. On Richelieu's part, this was Realpolitik, and mostly about the France/Spain feud, since Spain at that time was still ruled by the Habsburgs (cousins to the Emperor). Fritz: projecting like mad. Also pointedly not mentioning whom the Swedes teamed up with in the most recent war...
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timeasmymeasure
Replies from last post
Date: 2020-09-03 05:09 am (UTC)Sorry, I'm lost -- remind me?
Yeah. :/ Unfortunately, unlike (parts of) his bad condolence letters, I don't think the part that [personal profile] cahn reacted to was just lack of emotional intelligence: I suspect this one was very deliberate.
Yes, I think it must have been deliberate; the condolence letters do read to me like someone who was just thinking of himself rather than others, but Fritz wasn't emotionally stupid, and there is no way he could have missed how this was going to come off to AW. WOW.
The one fascinating exception I can think of is Richelieu...
Most other men (and a few women) of power, though, seem to have suffered from that syndrome described in Robert Graves' "I, Claudius", where successive emperors are absolutely on board with appointing someone they know to be worse as their successor because it'll make them look better in the eyes of posterity instead of them being outshone.
Wow, this is really interesting! Both that it's such a common problem and that Richelieu was the exception (which I didn't know). We're nominating him for Yuletide, right? Do you have any thoughts on why he was an exception?
Also I need to read I, Claudius again. I read it in... high school or college? A really long time ago, and have forgotten everything about it.
Richelieu
Date: 2020-09-03 07:38 am (UTC)To which Elisabeth supposedly said to old George Keith: "Well, if it is my duty to fuck on the King's command, how about you and me, then, right here, right now?"
Whereaupon George Keith, veteran of Jacobite uprisings and life with Fritz, ran away and told Fritz it was hopeless.
Do you have any thoughts on why he was an exception?
For starters, he had lived through a time when France was badly governed, he did care about the future of the realm, and he never took anything for granted. Richelieu was born Armand du Plessis, third son to very provincial nobility; his mother even came from non-noble stock. (And was tough as nails in adversity, as it turned out.) Even worse, the du Plessis family had various unstable members. Richelieu's father and oldest brother died in a duel, and his favourite sister and second brother had nervous breakdowns and became insane, though that happened after he'd already become powerful. Back to young Armand, of whom not much is expected, other than make his way as an officer in the King's service, probably (the job for provincial nobles without an estate of heir own). His oldest brother is in line to inherit the title (of Marquis du Plessis - "Richelieu" didn't come until much, much later), of course, and brother No.2. ,Alphonse, is as second brother's do supposed to make a career in the church (and contribute to the family income via being the bishop of Lucon, to which the du Plessis have an inherited claim).
Then Dad dies in a duel, and Alphonse wants to become a priest, alright, but a monk without any worldly possessions, because he takes this vow of poverty thing seriously. He absolutely refuses to become Bishop of Lucon. Which is when Mom, Suzanne the ex-middle class girl who married a provincial noble, decides fifteen years old Armand isn't going to become a soldier, he'll study theology now and become bishop of Lucon, thus securing the family income.
Young Armand may have had other ideas about his future, but he's the type to go "if I do something, I'll do it well, dammit!" So he studies theology in record time. But now there's been some reforms in the Church following the Council of Trent, which means no longer can youngsters be made bishops without special dispensation by the Pope himself. And Armand is still only 20. So Armand goes to Rome, charms the Pope (who is a bit distrustful of France right now, what with the current king, Henri "Paris is worth a mass" IV., survivor of the St. Barholomew's Massacre and son-in-law to Catherine de' Medici, being an ex-Protestant who already changed religion twice, but Armand makes a convincing case to the Pope says "Henricus armandus armando" and gives young Armand the necessary special dispensation.
Now Mom didn't expect him to actually be bishop, just titular bishop, and get the revenues. After all, Lucon had been adminstred by local clergy during all those years with a vacant bishop seat. But Armand has other ideas. He goes to little boring Lucon, gives everyone a kick in the behind and reorganizes everything, because he's a life long workoholic and this is his first job. Still, after a few years he might have a model bishopry, but it's in the provinces, and his restless energies no longr have a target. Luckily for young Armand if not for France, this is when Henri IV. gets assassinated, leaving behind his kid son Louis XIII., his second wife Marie de' Medici (not to be confused with Catherine by any means), second son Gaston and several daughters. Which means a French General Assembly is called for - the last, in fact, before the years just before the French Revolution - in which young Armand gets to represent the clergy of his province in Paris. This assembly is his chance to make an impression on the new Regent, Marie de' Medici, and her lover Concinci, the power behind the throne. And he does.
Concini and his wife Leonora (who started out as Marie de' Medici's dwarf) basically see their position as the chance to plunder the realm. Armand sees it as a chance to make a career. Young Louis XIII hates his mother's lover, and also is painfully aware Mom likes his second brother Gaston much better. He doesn't think much of anyone connected to Concini, which means that for now, he dislikes Armand du Plessis along with the rest of them. When Louis' falconer de Luynes organizes a coup against Concini, Louis is all for it. This ends very bloodily; Concini is literally torn apart by the mob, which Armand witnesses and never forgets as an education in what can happen to even the most powerful man of the realm. Anyone connected to Concini is banished, which means Armand ends up in Avignon in exile for a while, thinking hard. Alas, he's not alone there; his family is supposed to go with him. This includes his oldest brother Henri, the Marquis du Richelieu, whose wife is pregnant. Henri petitions the King to let his wife give birth first and not risk her life. No dice. Dead baby, dead wife, Henri gets into a stupid duel and gets himself killed, and Armand decides duels are an infuriatingly stupid habit and plague on the land. For now, he's writing a pamphlet against them; later, he will forbid them, which makes him even more unpopular with a lot of young nobles and provides Dumas with a plot point in "The Three Musketeers".
Armand's brooding in Avignon is practical in nature, as in: how do I get out of this? He takes up corespondance with Luynes. For starters, he offers himself as a middle man between Louis and his estranged mother Marie de' Medici. This gets accepted. When Armand works out a deal and the Queen Mother's return to Paris, he (and his family) gets to come back as well. Luynes' nephew marries Richelieu's favourite niece (Marie-Madelaine, for now Madame de Combalet, later Duchesse D'Aguillon in her own right; if Richelieu truly loved another person, it will be said, it is her). By the time Luynes dies, Richelieu is well established in the administration. So well that when a Cardinal's hat gets free (France at that time got to have two cardinals), he makes a succesful play for it, at which he gains a new title and becames Monsieur le Cardinal de Richelieu.
Relations with Louis himself have also improved, though they are never easy. Louis continues to have male favourites, though unlike his younger son Philippe d'Orleans he's very repressed about this and probably did not have sex with any of them. (Post Luysnes, they also did not have political power, because that was Richelieu's job.) For now, he's son-less, which is important, because his marriage to Anne of Austria goes from bad to worse, and his scheming brother, Gaston d'Orleans, really really REALLY wants to become King himself. Does it help to have Richelieu in your corner? Yes, it does. Louis and Richelieu form a partnership which is maintained for the rest of their lives, despite several crisis, including the infamous "Day of Dupes". At this point the Queen Mother, who'd imagined Richelieu would be her creature, after finding herself rudely disillusioned in this regard took against him, and put an "him or me" ultimatum to Louis. Now, before that, she'd verbally abused Richelieu's niece Madame de Combalet and then triumphantly swept into her son's cabinet to put said ultimatum. Madame de Combalet races to notify her uncle what's going on, Richelieu knows a secret door to the cabinet and shows up just in time to make his case.
By now, the courtiers are alert to something major going on, but they think the Queen Mother will win, and when everyone leaves the cabinet, Richelieu with a downcast look, they act accordingly. Big mistake, and the reason why this is called "The Day of the Dupes". Because Louis' reply to "him or me" had actually been "bye, Mom".
Richelieu is now the most poweful and best hated man of France, and will remain so for the rest of his life, though several conspiracies and uprisings, oh, and wars. The relationship with Louis is perhaps best epitomized by this anecdote:
Louis (after a long day and evening, when they're done with the work, tersely): Go ahead.(I.e. leave the room first.) You are the true King anyway, aren't you?
Richelieu is now in a binder: if he does this, it's an insult to the king, if he says "no", it's an insult as well. What does he do?
Richelieu *taking up candle, assuming the position of lowly servant, but does leave the cabinet first*: Just to illuminate the way for your majesty.
Re: Richelieu
Date: 2020-09-04 01:15 am (UTC)Re: Richelieu
Date: 2020-09-04 05:33 am (UTC)Concini and his wife Leonora (who started out as Marie de' Medici's dwarf)
...really??
Also, I super love how Madame de Combalet becomes an important character/plot point! :D Go Madame de Combalet!
Richelieu *taking up candle, assuming the position of lowly servant, but does leave the cabinet first*: Just to illuminate the way for your majesty.
Woooooow, this guy!
Re: Richelieu
Date: 2020-09-04 05:51 am (UTC)On a less sentimental note, another quote from Richelieu on his deathbed is so very him that it ends up said by very much alive Richelieu in many historical fictions starring him, to wit:
"Does your Eminence forgive your enemies?
"My enemies? I never had enemies but the enemies of the state."
The Richard Lester directed two part film version of "The Three Musketeers", which, despite all the 1960s slapstick, is actually by far the most book faithful, especially compared to more resent US ones, is also the only movie version incorporating this, in this case when our hero D'Artagnan gets a job offer from Richelieu - who, as a reminder, is one of the two main antagonists of the films - and virtuously declines, adding he counts it as an honor to be regarded as Richelieu's enemy. Then the scene goes:
Richelieu (amused): My enemy? Dear boy, I have no enemies but the enemies of the state.
Richelieu is played by Charlton Heston, cast against type; for my money it's one of his best roles and shows that acting outside his comfort range was something he could actually do.)
Leonora: indeed. After her husband got killed and torn apart by the mob, she got a show trial and as accused of having used magic to dominate the Queen Mother. Said Leonora, scornfully: "I used no power but that which is given to a strong mind over a weak one."
Said an admiring 19th century historian who overwise was pretty much misogniystic: This statement alone justifies her existence to history. I mean, Leonora got executed anyway, but it was a classic burn.
Re: Richelieu
Date: 2020-09-07 03:43 am (UTC)I didn't realize that forgiving one's enemies was one of the things one was asked in deathbed confessions until, uh, quite recent reading. :P That is fantastic.
Clearly I am going to have to put Three Musketeers on my list (which maybe someday I will actually make any headway on?? this year has been the Worst for processing any video) (and also reread the book, as I remember basically zero about it)
GO LEONORA.
I like your icon!
Re: Richelieu
Date: 2020-09-07 02:06 pm (UTC)Re: Richelieu
Date: 2020-09-07 06:49 pm (UTC)Reading Macaulay recently reminded me of this anecdote of FW on his deathbed (or a sickbed that he ended up recovering from, not sure):
Roloff: And then there is forgiveness of enemies; Your Majesty is bound to forgive all men, or how can you ask to be forgiven?
FW: Well, I will; I do. You Feekin [his wife, Queen Sophie], write to your brother (unforgiveablest of beings), after I am dead, that I forgave him, died in peace with him.
Roloff: Better Her Majesty should write at once.
FW: No, after I am dead, that will be safer!
The passage ends: "At parting he said to Roloff, 'You (Er, He) do not spare me; it is right. You do your duty like an honest Christian man.'"
You better believe this anecdote was not reported by Macaulay, hater of FW. This is the 1882 editor chiding Macaulay for his one-sided portrayal of FW and trying to show FW in a better light, for which the editor quotes at length a passage from Carlyle.
Re: Richelieu
Date: 2020-09-08 09:08 am (UTC)Re: Richelieu
Date: 2020-09-08 10:54 pm (UTC)Re: Richelieu
Date: 2020-09-12 05:26 am (UTC)Re: Replies from last post
Date: 2020-09-04 01:39 am (UTC)Different Richelieu, alas! Richelieu the 17th century power behind the throne, THE Richelieu, was Cardinal Richelieu (1585-1642). Our 18th century Enlightenment Yuletide prospect Richelieu, lover of Émilie and friend of Voltaire, is the Cardinal's great-greatnephew, the Duc de Richelieu (1696-1788).
Re: Replies from last post
Date: 2020-09-04 05:20 am (UTC)Maybe someone else will nominate him for Yuletide! :)
Re: Replies from last post
Date: 2020-09-04 05:59 am (UTC)Heinrich: Richelieu was cool.
Fritz: He was not! He was a bad, bad man who estranged Louis XIII from his mother! *now follows a literal Fritz quote* Richelieu was haughty and vengeful, I insist on it, and I refuse him the title of great in all his wickedness.
...I can't help but wonder whether he's projecting some anger over the other other man in Voltaire's life here on the Cardinal. I mean, Enlightenment!Richelieu also contributed by far the most money to the nude statue, too.:)
Re: Replies from last post
Date: 2020-09-07 03:54 am (UTC)I also wonder whether Fritz couldn't handle at all the thought of someone *not* the monarch having all that power?
(Heinrich: This doesn't sound nearly as bad to me!)
Re: Replies from last post
Date: 2020-09-07 06:48 am (UTC)That's one way of describing Richelieu, PM of Catholic France and himself a Cardinal, making an alliance with Protestant Gustav Adolf of Sweden in the middle of the 30 Years War (supposedly a war of religion) against the Catholic HRE Emperor. On Richelieu's part, this was Realpolitik, and mostly about the France/Spain feud, since Spain at that time was still ruled by the Habsburgs (cousins to the Emperor). Fritz: projecting like mad. Also pointedly not mentioning whom the Swedes teamed up with in the most recent war...
Re: Replies from last post
Date: 2020-09-04 03:41 pm (UTC)this necessarily meant he would have to predate Émilie
Unless he found the elixir of life
and didn't share it with Fredersdorf. ;)Maybe someone else will nominate him for Yuletide! :)
Maybe someone will!