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cahnSo for anyone who is reading this and would like to learn more about Frederick the Great and his contemporaries, but who doesn't want to wade through 500k (600k?) words worth of comments and an increasingly sprawling comment section:
We now have a community,![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
rheinsberg, that has quite a lot of the interesting historical content (and more coming regularly), organized nicely with lots of lovely tags so if there's any subject you are interested in it is easy to find :D
We now have a community,
rheinsberg, that has quite a lot of the interesting historical content (and more coming regularly), organized nicely with lots of lovely tags so if there's any subject you are interested in it is easy to find :D
But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-01 12:24 pm (UTC)"(...)because it would make your state now happier, and would save you from many future worries, because when we see that You have no lineage, we will marry your brother William, and then the scheming and plotting will be inevitable" .
Junior agreed to all this; "But", he said, "I can't embrace my wife with passion, and when I sleep with her, I do it rather out of duty than by inclination."
Mantteuffel points out that the earth would be barren if the only children born were born to couples who loved each other, and hey, gird your loins, I hear she's got at least a nice exterior?
Junior: ,, This is true, her form is very pretty; but i have never been in love with her. However, I should be the last man, in the world if I didn't esteem her: because she has a very sweet nature, a more docile woman one cannot imagine, she's excessively compliant, and hastens to do everything she believes can please me. Also, she can't complain that I'm not sleeping with her. I truly don't know why there isn't a child there already."
In case Seckendorff Jr. is slow on the uptake, Manteuffel has a literary hint for him:
The Devil makes me read the Roman History of Des Echarts and points out the character of Junior, who is the same as that of Emperor Hadrian.
On December 1st (still 1736), FW is not a fan of Suhm: Upon hearing of the appointment of Suhm as envoy to the court of Petersburg, the King says: "He's an arch villain, and I'm sorry I didn't hang him while I had him here."
In early 1737, Seckendorff is not impressed with teenage AW: Prince William had a weak spell yesterday at the parade; however he was obliged to dine with us, where he cut a sad figure.
On the other hand, he has a soft spot for coming menace Ferdinand, when it's Ferdinand's turn to dine with Dad and his smoking chums:
Little Prince Ferdinand did not contribute much, other than his kindness to keep the king in good spirits. But above all, this kind child deserves to be reported because, wanting to have something of Biberius, who was sitting next to him, he uses the expression: Your excellence, be as gracious as to give me something of this." To which Bberius replied: "I can't dole out graces; the King alone is capable of providing grace." To which the prince replied: "OH yes, your excellency, but you are Field Marshall now, so you will be able to act gracefully." Biberius couldn't help but show his amusement. The King smiled; but the Beard" - La Barbe, the Beard, is der alte Dessauer, Prince Leopold of Anhalt-Dessau - behaved with the air of a Hercules in his fury.
(Because Grumbkow has been made a Field Marshal.)
Seckendorff Jr. has the bad luck that Original Seckendorff, the Field Marshall, temporarily falls from grace back home in Vienna and has been arrested and imprisoned in Graz, where he'll stay until MT ascends to the throne. (She'll release him.) This means Seckendorff the nephew is called back from Prussia. In Vienna, he first tries to make good weather for uncle and also shares gossip with people bitching about MT's new husband. Remember, they all think Franzl is the future ruler, nobody considers MT will rule, and they aren't impressed by his lack of military prowess. Also, he's a foreigner from Lorraince, so basically half French, and everyone hates the French. So Seckendorff Jr. notes:
Dissension at home. The Duke of Lorraine has all Austrians as enemies. He is at odds with his parents-in-law and they are displeased with him; the archduchess alone stands by her husband. The Duke is very annoyed with Bartenstein and has cause to be. He's only told of the May decisions after his return to the army. Bartenstein has told him to his face that after the Emperor has done him the honor of giving him his inheriting daughter, he was to submit himself to the Emperor's will in everything.
Like I said: Franzl's early life in Vienna was one long humiliation conga. (With the important exception of MT standing by him, as he would stand by her in the years to come.)
On page 206, Seckendorff the nephew is asked to give his assessment on the topic: Fritz: Hot or not? Well, he also has to say whether or not he thinks FW is still trustworthy, but we have our priorities here, don't we?
About the feelings of the King. Myself: "The King has a good heart, he is at his core imperially minded and remembers the dinner in Prague with enoyment." Himself: "Ah, if only his actions would fit with this supposed good heart!" Myself: "One has to bind him by solid and mutually beneficial conditions." Himself: "One has to see how that could be accomplished."
About the person of the Crown Prince. His figure: handsome, looks like a Hannover, wears his own hair, looks pretty masculine, if flabby." "Does he love horses and hunting?" "No, he is a terrible rider and hunter; he loves reading, music, magnificence and "la bonne chère"."
"The good dear? Is this code for something? Anyway, the obvious question is asked: how reconciled are father and son, really?
His relationship with the King his father. "In public, things are well. But there are still needling phrases. Besides, the Prince in his heart has never forgotten his arrest in Wesel, and he hates with an eternal hatred all which contributed, i.e. Derschauer." Himself: "But not Grumbkow?" "No. Biberius is corresponding with him; he sits at his table and drinks from his wine."
His relationship with the Crown Princess. "Good; she's pretty, compliant; they sleep together."
His religion: "That of an honest man; God; all confessed will be forgiven." The Crown Prince loves pomp and grandeur; he'll reestablish all the court offices; he wants to have princes and counts at his court.
See, Seckendorff Jr., with that kind of intelligence it's not surprising poor MT was caught unawares. If she even had time to read the files before he invaded. It's on page 206 ff if you want to read it for yourself.
Anyway: Once it's apparant Uncle Seckendorff isn't going to get out of Graz any time soon, Seckendorff the nephew decides that his career in Austrian services is doomed for now, and requests to be allowed to transfer to Anhalt. Where he'll continue to work for Fritz' brother-in-law, one of the two odious ones. Which is how this volume concludes.
Re: But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-02 01:40 am (UTC)Oh, that's where that quote's from! And the rest of it I recognize too.
On December 1st (still 1736), FW is not a fan of Suhm: Upon hearing of the appointment of Suhm as envoy to the court of Petersburg, the King says: "He's an arch villain, and I'm sorry I didn't hang him while I had him here."
Ha. While I was tracking down other Seckendorf's diary yesterday, I ran across the episode where FW threatened to hang Suhm while he did have him there, in Carlyle.
As usual, a diplomatic incident starts with FW's recruiters of tall men recruiting men they weren't supposed to, and this time the Saxon officials chased them onto Brandenburg territory, captured them, and imprisoned them. Tracking down Carlyle's source tells me this took place in 1727, and that Mauvillon is writing no later than 1741! And Mauvillon cites the letters between August and FW, so we have primary sources for this episode. Anyway, here's Carlyle:
"Captain Natzmer to swing on the gallows? Taken on Brandenburg territory too, and not the least notice given me?" Friedrich Wilhelm blazes into flaming whirlwind; sends an Official Gentleman, one Katsch, to his Excellenz Baron von Suhm (the Crown-Prince's cultivated friend), with this appalling message: "If Natzmer be hanged, for certain I will use reprisals; you yourself shall swing!" Whereupon Suhm, in panic, fled over the marches to his Master; who bullied him for his pusillanimous terrors; and applied to Friedrich Wilhelm, in fine frenzy of indignant astonishment, "What, in Heaven's name, such meditated outrage on the law of nations, and flat insult to the Majesty of Kings, can have meant?" Friedrich Wilhelm, the first fury being spent, sees that he is quite out of square; disavows the reprisals upon Suhm. "Message misdelivered by my Official Gentleman, that stupid Katsch; never did intend to hang Suhm; oh, no;" with much other correspondence; [In Mauvillon (ii. 189-195) more of it than any one will read.]— and is very angry at himself, and at the Natzmer affair, which has brought him into this bad pass. Into open impropriety; into danger of an utter rupture, had King August been of quarrelsome turn. But King August was not quarrelsome; and then Seckendorf and the Tobacco-Parliament,— on the Kaiser's score, who wants Pragmatic Sanction and much else out of these two Kings, and can at no rate have them quarrel in the present juncture,— were eager to quench the fire. King August let Natzmer go; Suhm returned to his post; [Pollnitz, ii. 254.] and things hustled themselves into some uneasy posture of silence again;— uneasy to the sensitive fancy of Friedrich Wilhelm above all. This is his worst collision with his Neighbor of Saxony; and springing from one's Hobby again!—
I am amused by "more of it than anyone will ever read." Carlyle is fond of stating that the Fritz/Suhm correspondence is boring and no one will ever read it.
That [Wolff] is the staple of the famous Suhm correspondence; staple which nobody could now bear to be concerned with.
And again,
We need not doubt the wholesome charm and blessing of so intimate a Correspondence to the Crown-Prince: and indeed his real love of the amiable Suhm, as Suhm's of him, comes beautifully to light in these Letters: but otherwise they are not now to be read without weariness, even dreariness, and have become a biographical reminiscence merely.
Why do I find this so amusing? Because in the course of my detective work, some time ago, I ran across the following preface to another bio of Fritz, by one John Abbott:
Mr. Carlyle has written the Life of Frederick the Great in six closely printed volumes of over five hundred pages each. It is a work of much ability and accuracy. There are, however, but few persons, in this busy age, who can find time to read three thousand pages of fine type, descriptive of events, many of which have lost their interest, and have ceased to possess any practical value.
In other words, "TL;DR, Carlyle, no1curr."
Right before this in his opening paragraph, Abbott also has a lovely "You couldn't make these people up!" line:
The novelist who should create such a character as that of Frederick William, or such a career as that of Frederick the Great, would be deemed guilty of great exaggeration, and yet the facts contained in this volume are beyond all contradiction.
Quoted for truth.
The Devil makes me read the Roman History of Des Echarts and points out the character of Junior, who is the same as that of Emperor Hadrian.
Ahahahaha. Let's see: Manteuffel, Fritz, Hadrian; Lichtenstein, Fritz, Alexander the Great. Fritz, your orientation is a poorly kept secret. :P
"No, he is a terrible rider and hunter; he loves reading, music, magnificence and "la bonne chère"."
"The good dear? Is this code for something?
Google tells me it means "good food." Which is definitely true of Fritz. His desire to set a good table for himself and his friends is half the reason he's chronically in debt at Rheinsberg, and as we've seen, he was still setting a good table on August 5, 1786. (
His religion: "That of an honest man; God; all confessed will be forgiven." The Crown Prince loves pomp and grandeur; he'll reestablish all the court offices; he wants to have princes and counts at his court.
See, Seckendorff Jr., with that kind of intelligence it's not surprising poor MT was caught unawares.
Hahahaha. Go Fritz. You fool those Austrians!
Which is how this volume concludes.
Volume two seems harder to turn up than volume one was, but it looks like volume one was the interesting one anyway.
Thanks for your write-ups! As usual, our strengths align: I dig things up, you read and report!
Re: But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-02 07:58 am (UTC)Yes, I've seen it multiple times, too, usually without saying where it was from. Incidentally, do we think he's bluffing (and relying on the fact EC was loyal and would never have told anyone anything to the contrary), or did he try a few times before giving up?
As usual, a diplomatic incident starts with FW's recruiters of tall men recruiting men they weren't supposed to
Am not in the slightest surprised. The Seckendorff diary covers yet another one of these, which I was also familiar with from Wilhelmine's 1730s letters, when FW's recruiters grabbed a bunch of Franconians who were from the Prince Bishop of Bamberg's territory, not from Bayreuth.
LOL about Carlysle. BTW, did FW have a particular beef with Suhm (as opposed to any Saxon envoy) beyond "evidently likes my son a lot"?
Ahahahaha. Let's see: Manteuffel, Fritz, Hadrian; Lichtenstein, Fritz, Alexander the Great. Fritz, your orientation is a poorly kept secret.
I knew you'd like that. :) BTW, if Manteuffel points to Hadrian in particular, what are the chances that Hadrian had come up when he was chatting with Fritz? Which also would argue for Fritz having had Hadrian/Antinous on the brain in the 1730s, which was, of course, when he was finally having the chance to educate himself without paternal supervision.
Never mind about volume 2, I'm not that interested in what's going in in Ansbach if it's a mixture of French and German without a single Fritz or Habsburg encounter to reward me for the effort. ;)
Re: But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-02 05:16 pm (UTC)That's what I have no idea about. I consider it 50/50 he tried vs. he knew she'd never talk. My confidence that she wouldn't talk is why I have no idea.
BTW, did FW have a particular beef with Suhm (as opposed to any Saxon envoy) beyond "evidently likes my son a lot"?
That I don't know. But I will keep my eyes out. Suhm is my new second-favorite boyfriend.
BTW, if Manteuffel points to Hadrian in particular, what are the chances that Hadrian had come up when he was chatting with Fritz? Which also would argue for Fritz having had Hadrian/Antinous on the brain in the 1730s, which was, of course, when he was finally having the chance to educate himself without paternal supervision.
Exactly what I was thinking! (You know I have Fritz, Hadrian, and Antinous on the brain. ;) )
Never mind about volume 2, I'm not that interested in what's going in in Ansbach if it's a mixture of French and German without a single Fritz or Habsburg encounter to reward me for the effort. ;)
That's what I figured. :)
Re: But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-03 09:09 am (UTC)That's what I have no idea about. I consider it 50/50 he tried vs. he knew she'd never talk. My confidence that she wouldn't talk is why I have no idea.
Same here. I would say this, though: Fritzian paranoia and control issues make me slightly biased in favor of "they tried a few times early on". Because:
a) As Manteuffel points out and Fritz agrees, as long as he doesn't provide an heir, AW, favourite son of Dad, remains directly after him in the succession. No matter how nice a guy Fritz truly thinks AW is, this is a threat even if you're less suspicious than our traumatized antihero. And remember, Grandpa F1 openly accused his stepmother of having poisoned his brothers, and intending to kill him to make her sons inherit the crown, and went as far as demanding hostages before agreeing to see Father Great Elector. The family tradition isn't great there. (Leaving aside other countries with a tried and true tradition of ambitious younger brothers.) Anyway, a baby would mean added security to Fritz (especially since FW bypassing him in favour of a baby is far less likely than FW bypassing him in favour of growing into teenagehood AW).
b) Can't see Fritz go for the Gustav solution. Even a discreet version of same. Because even if pious EC would be on board with having extramarital sex because her husband told her to, whether or not a threesome is involved, that would give another man really great power over him. And yes, there's a big difference to old Fritz expressing understanding for young Elisabeth and possibly okaying a fling to provide a male heir as long as she's discreet. Not just a few decades more of added cynicism. He's the monarch and the ultimate controller in the second scenario. In the first, Dad is still alive, he himself could be exposed as a voluntary cuckold, which is the very thing men love to ridicule other men for, and who the hell is this potential sperm donor supposed to be whom Fritz would trust to keep his mouth shut and never ever to blackmail him? Fredersdorff is out of the question, since he's a commoner. Suhm? He's maybe the loveliest and nicest of sugar daddies, but he's also working for another country.
Re: But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-04 02:14 am (UTC)Wrt to a), though, I would present the following data points for the sake of argument:
1) If you believe schemer Seckendorff (if!), Fritz had to be bullied by FW into joining EC on his wedding night in the first place, and he skedaddled as soon as he could. Now, that might just be common gossip and not the report from the horse's (FW) mouth, but if it's true, it suggests Fritz was willing to let the marriage go unconsummated. Might be worth checking Förster to see if he's got that Seckendorff report to Vienna, because MacDonogh cites Jessen for both this quote and the Eugene quote that turned out to be in Förster. So Förster might be Jessen's source.
2) By September 1736, when he moves into Rheinsberg and actually starts living with his wife for the first time, Fritz is already preparing everyone for the possibility that he's not going to have any heirs, and explaining how that's super not a problem. He writes to Manteuffel:
I'm very obliged to you for your wishes concerning my procreation, and I have the same destiny as the deer, which are currently rutting. In nine months, it could turn out the way you hope. I don't know if this would be a good or a bad thing for our nephews and great-nephews. Kingdoms always find successors, and there's no example of a throne that stayed empty.
So, yes, he's *claiming* he's sleeping with her, but he's basically telling everyone to stay chill if no kid shows up, which makes me side-eye his claim so hard. More to the point, he evidently doesn't mind drawing Manteuffel's attention to AW as possible future father of the heir to the kingdom, even if he doesn't want AW or Heinrich getting any money or leverage from Saxony, and even if your interpretation is correct that as late as 1739, there were rumors about FW choosing AW as the heir.
Fritz might not have felt fathering an heir was worth the added security, after all. Or, maybe in those first three years he tried, but had given up by 1736 (and was trying to set expectations correctly now that he was living with her, which he can't have enjoyed the prospect of).
Oh, btw, looking these quotes up in Blanning finally identified for me *which* Wartensleben was one of the 6 "I have loved the most": Friedrich von Wartensleben, who other Seckendorf was friendly with, whom you've referred to in the diary, and who was part of the Rheinsberg circle. Or at least narrowed it down by giving me a first name.
Because assuming it's Grandpa Wartensleben's line, he has two sons named Friedrich, both born around the same time: 1707 and 1709, who are still alive into the 70s and 80s, and hence in 1736. I said elsewhere that Friedrich was Katte's first cousin on his mother's side, but I was wrong, he must be one of the uncles, who was actually Katte's age, because Grandpa Wartensleben was fathering some 17 kids over the course of 32 years. (Which I had noted before.)
Anyway, Friedrich Wartensleben as possible candidate for fathering the heir? He's around at the right place and time, he's Prussian, he's got the right bloodline, i.e. old prestigious noble family close to the king--I was joking about Katte's cousin and thinking of the Katte side of the family, but hey! bonus points for favoring Katte's family--he's the right age, and he's evidently trusted by Fritz. :P Trusted enough to not blackmail him, idk, I don't know the first thing about this guy, but it's a thought.
I still think it's unlikely! But without knowing anything about him, I think he's more likely than Fredersdorf (totally out of the question, I agree), or Suhm the Saxon Sugar Daddy.
Re: But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-04 05:32 am (UTC)ETA: Even if Fredersdorf weren't a commoner, I can't imagine Fritz would have wanted to share!
Re: But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-04 06:02 am (UTC)Haha! It would only work if Fredersdorf were super reluctant and only willing to make the great sacrifice for his prince. But even then, Fritz would have to propose it, and...no.
Love the mental image, though.
(am I projecting twenty-first century religiously-conservative attitudes on this??
Maybe? I'll let
Fertile SD, though, definitely an example on Fritz's mind. "I had sex with her twice! I even managed to ejaculate once. She must not be fertile and there's no point in continuing.
Yay!I mean, that's terrible. Nobody panic, though: Mom and Dad more than made up for my lackluster procreating efforts! I'm sure to have nephews and great-nephews in droves."Re: But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-04 11:06 am (UTC)Gustav: whereas I had no problem getting myself obeyed in that department. Sure, my guy put everything in writing and had it deposed to the Swedish Academy, so the entire world eventually found out, and sure, Mom hit the roof when brother Charles told her about it, but hey! An heir was had!
SD's fertility contributing to Fritz coming quickly to the conclusion that EC isn't fertile and hence he's not obliged to try anymore: Sounds very likely! And you know, they're not the Habsburgs, but the Hohenzollerns of Fritz' generation otherwise procreated quickly if they tried. Wilhelmine got pregnant in her first year of marriage, same with the other sisters, AW might have been a negligent and indifferent husband to Louise but the first two kids happened quickly, and then the later two with a gap but still, they happened. Ferdinand/his niece produced offspring, too. So Friedrich and Heinrich being the two exceptions from the "marry, multiply" rule rather points to the obvious element in common as the reason...
By which I don't mean the gayness - that never stopped Philippe D'Orleans from getting both of his wives pregnant multiple times, even though not all kids survived - but the stubborn " you can make me marry her, Dad/Fritz, but you can't make me have sex with her!" attitude.
feel like it's the act of non-procreative-and-church-authorized sex that's the problem, not the baby-making per se. I mean, masturbation is also off the table, and we have the Biblical "he who lusts in his heart after a woman is guilty of adultery" prohibition that I feel that FW totally bought into, and the idea that chasing women makes you not only a sinner but effeminate and weak and likely to spend money on them, all of which I feel were a bigger deal to FW than any inadvertent babies.
Yes. He doesn't seem to have been worried Fritz would inflict lots of bastards on the royal line even when thinking Fritz/poor Doris Ritter were an item. He had that midwife test her for virginity, not pregnancy. Also WHORES. Both FW and his son had a lot to say about men being ruled by same - meaning usually, but not exclusively Louis XV. With FW, "no whores!" is on the Opening paragraph of the Political Testament. With Fritz, of course, some of the Catt (memoirs) quotes are now suspicious, but I just read, courtesy of Mildred' algorithm, in the diary:
page 406: His Majesty was very tired. We talked about Berlin and the way of life. I let many things pass. There is a lot of coquetry, he tells me, among the great world. I say to them one day: Ladies, you do what we do everywhere; but do try a little more decency. I do not say anything. I tolerate these intrigues if they are a result of passion; but when it's out of interest, it's awful. I prefer one who pays, than one who is paid. I have often said to husbands who came to complain: You are doing something stupid, it will be disclosed.
Re: But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-05 05:00 am (UTC)Oh, I didn't mean that Fredersdorf would be reluctant to obey Fritz. I meant he'd have to make a big production out of how he was reluctant to sleep with EC and was ONLY doing it to to obey Fritz. So as to assuage Fritz's jealousies. Much like how he had to marry a NURSE to keep Fritz chill about sharing.
He had that midwife test her for virginity, not pregnancy. Also WHORES
Which reminds me, you told us that MT's sex policing banned all extramarital sex, but made an exception for illegitimate mothers, to prevent infanticide and abortion. My sense is that the major objection in the past was to unsanctioned lust, rather than the irresponsible procreation of much of today's discourse. Of course, for *women*, foisting a bastard on your husband was a huge problem with extramarital sex, but that was much much less of a problem for men who wanted to have extramarital sex.
I prefer one who pays, than one who is paid.
Says the man who was on the prowl for a sugar daddy all through the 1730s! :P I guess it doesn't count if you just flirt and don't put out? Or more to the point, it doesn't count if you're *Fritz*.
Re: But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-05 02:00 pm (UTC)Says the man who was on the prowl for a sugar daddy all through the 1730s!
But Mildred, that's the point! Of course he likes people who pay better. He always did! The ones who get paid surely are the competition!
More seriously, those 1730s activities do make that high and mightiness about the Marquise de Pompadour awfully hypocritical. Not just on Fritz' part, but on the part of many of his biographers. "The greedy mistress of Louis XV" and so forth. I do remember that letter to Wilhelmine saying "Eh, you can offer her this and that sum" (if she persuaded Louis to change alliances again), I suppose, and that Madame la Marquise turned the offer down.
Re: But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-05 08:11 pm (UTC)ROTFLOL.
Remember this?
Fritz: Suhm, please read Seneca's chapter on indifference to wealth.
Fritz: Great! Now that you don't care about money, can I have yours?
:DDD
More seriously, in a lifetime of hypocrisy, there is little that Fritz was more hypocritical about than money. If you ask me, he's trying to compensate for a deprived childhood. Anyone trying to take money that could be his is a trigger that emotionally puts him back in a place where he has to live without books and music and adequate food.
I think his obsession with good food, what he described as "disorderly cravings, like a pregnant woman," and his apparent inability to keep from bolting it (even when he had no trouble skipping meals or living on tight rations) stems from the same source.
Oh, sheesh, I think that quote may be from Catt's memoirs. ANYWAY, it's probably something Catt observed, even if Fritz wasn't as self-aware as he's made out to be. (In addition to possibly revise my opinion about his slut-shaming, I'm having to revisit the evidence for his self-awareness. Also, one wonders if Catt the devoted fan would have put "like a pregnant woman" in his hero's mouth, even after the breakup.)
And that, oddly enough, is one of the reasons I think Fritz may actually have had a low sex drive. Because once Dad was dead, and even at Rhinesberg, he should have been all over the boyfriends in an incontrovertible way.
And maybe he was, and we're viewing it through a lens of 250 years of homophobia on the part of people determined to preserve their hero's reputation. Maybe he was bedding down left and right with Marwitz and Glasow and Claus and Darget and Fredersdorf and Algarotti, and he just had to preserve some plausible deniability, by claiming his relationship with Algarotti was purely intellectual, Marwitz wasn't anything to write home about, etc.
But the fact that it remained so deniable, and the fact that he spent that much time denying it, and the fact that people like Heinrich or Algarotti leave us in no doubt about their sexual activity, and the fact that there are so few candidates and he spent relatively little time with them (even Fredersdorf and he are frequently separated after 1740), and the fact that Trenck absolutely would have talked...it kind of makes me think he'd figured out that he liked the idea of sex better than the act.
But I may revise this opinion after rereading Blanning, who spends a lot of time arguing that Fritz was homosexually active into the 1750s. I'll see how convincing his arguments are.
Re: But what is really going on here?: The Austrian Dossier (Seckendorff III)
Date: 2020-02-10 05:09 am (UTC)The Devil makes me read the Roman History of Des Echarts and points out the character of Junior, who is the same as that of Emperor Hadrian.
HAHAHAHA
Seckendorff the nephew is asked to give his assessment on the topic: Fritz: Hot or not? Well, he also has to say whether or not he thinks FW is still trustworthy, but we have our priorities here, don't we?
lol forever, I don't get tired of how "Hot or not?" is what all correspondents have to report on (and I know it's because they didn't have cameras, but still)