Good lord, the melodrama. My sympathies are with Mom, Tido.
Re: the Bavarian army, and who got him a job there - this is also interesting because unless I‘m misremembering, the supreme commander of the Bavarian army in Silesia 2 was….drumroll… Seckendorff. Remember: in the final years of MT‘s Dad‘s reign, he‘d been locked up supposedly for fucking up in the war against the Turks, then MT released him when she took over, but evidently didn‘t offer him the command of her armies, then Seckendorff was pissed off about that and took the job offer from the Bavarians, i.e. the newly elected Karl Albrecht of Wittelsbach, now the second and last Wittelsbach Emperor of the HRE. (Much entertaining stuff about the first Wittelsbach Emperor, Ludwig the Bavarian, in Dirk‘s podcast.) Now given Seckendorff‘s most notable job in recent decades had been when he was envoy at FW‘s court, so I wouldn‘t be surprised if Frau von Knyphausen knew him from that time. (I mean, Peter evidently must have known of him, but being a friend of Fritz, I very much doubt he socialized with him.)
Anyway, Silesia 2 was of course when the Bavarians didn‘t succeed gloriously at all but found MT’s army (including Austrian Trenck) occupying Bavaria and Karl Albrecht kicked out of his own home country and remaining kicked out until he died and the chastened electors voted for MT Franz Stephan. So I‘m not surprised Tido would rather have been with the French (who didn‘t cover themselves with glory, either, but at least didn‘t get their country occupied) and had a miserable time of it. Notable Bavarian curse to this day: „Saupreuß!“
(The Rhinelanders weren’t the only ones who really really really did not like the Prussians very much.)
No, I had forgotten! Damn, good memory, Selena! Yeah, that explains why the Baroness had contacts in Bavaria.
Now given Seckendorff‘s most notable job in recent decades had been when he was envoy at FW‘s court, so I wouldn‘t be surprised if Frau von Knyphausen knew him from that time. (I mean, Peter evidently must have known of him, but being a friend of Fritz, I very much doubt he socialized with him.)
No, I don't at all think Peter was getting him a job with the *Bavarians*. That's obviously Mom. The question is: is Tido attributing Mom's willingness to do that to Peter? Or is he just commenting on how he assumes his new Bavarian job comes from Mom? I would think the second one is so obvious as not to require comment, but it's possible that that's what he's saying.
(I mean, Peter evidently must have known of him, but being a friend of Fritz, I very much doubt he socialized with him.)
Though keep in mind, Peter's job as page is to stay on FW's good side so he can spy, and Wilhelmine says he was a great favorite with FW. I doubt his desertion left him with any social capital with Seckendorff, though. (Though late Knyphausen, Sr., was also dismissed in 1730 on suspicion of helping Fritz, and evidently his wife still has some strings to pull.)
(The Rhinelanders weren’t the only ones who really really really did not like the Prussians very much.)
No, they weren't. The Prussians, by which I mean the actual Prussians, from East Prussia, where Lehndorff's from, didn't like the Prussians, by which I mean the Brandenburg-based Hohenzollerns, very much either. They were quite happy to be conquered by the Russians with the intention of handing them back to Poland after the war. Fritz never forgave them, and never went there on his annual visit again.
...I feel like the Saxons have to hate the Prussians too, right?
They certainly do after Fritz takes over. :) Mind you, in the later 19th century there‘s also a weird masochistic „it was all for the best in the end, because only under the glorious House of Hohenzollern could Germany be unified, and we needed the discipline after our spendthrift days“ Saxon fannishness. Of course, NOW Saxony is, alas, one of the centres for right wing extremism, and there‘s vilifying of Berlin for entirely different reasons. :(
Yikes. All I remembered was that in the later 19th century is when the Saxons finally got around to defending themselves against Fritz's charge that they were totally part of the alliance to dismember Prussia and thus that invading them in 1756 was justified, and thus that the glorious House of Hohenzollern should *not* be unifying Germany. Until then, they had not bothered to counter his PR move.
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timeasmymeasure
Re: A Knyphausen Vagabond - Part 2
Date: 2025-01-14 04:24 pm (UTC)Re: the Bavarian army, and who got him a job there - this is also interesting because unless I‘m misremembering, the supreme commander of the Bavarian army in Silesia 2 was….drumroll… Seckendorff. Remember: in the final years of MT‘s Dad‘s reign, he‘d been locked up supposedly for fucking up in the war against the Turks, then MT released him when she took over, but evidently didn‘t offer him the command of her armies, then Seckendorff was pissed off about that and took the job offer from the Bavarians, i.e. the newly elected Karl Albrecht of Wittelsbach, now the second and last Wittelsbach Emperor of the HRE. (Much entertaining stuff about the first Wittelsbach Emperor, Ludwig the Bavarian, in Dirk‘s podcast.) Now given Seckendorff‘s most notable job in recent decades had been when he was envoy at FW‘s court, so I wouldn‘t be surprised if Frau von Knyphausen knew him from that time. (I mean, Peter evidently must have known of him, but being a friend of Fritz, I very much doubt he socialized with him.)
Anyway, Silesia 2 was of course when the Bavarians didn‘t succeed gloriously at all but found MT’s army (including Austrian Trenck) occupying Bavaria and Karl Albrecht kicked out of his own home country and remaining kicked out until he died and the chastened electors voted for
MTFranz Stephan. So I‘m not surprised Tido would rather have been with the French (who didn‘t cover themselves with glory, either, but at least didn‘t get their country occupied) and had a miserable time of it. Notable Bavarian curse to this day: „Saupreuß!“(The Rhinelanders weren’t the only ones who really really really did not like the Prussians very much.)
Re: A Knyphausen Vagabond - Part 2
Date: 2025-01-14 04:43 pm (UTC)Now given Seckendorff‘s most notable job in recent decades had been when he was envoy at FW‘s court, so I wouldn‘t be surprised if Frau von Knyphausen knew him from that time. (I mean, Peter evidently must have known of him, but being a friend of Fritz, I very much doubt he socialized with him.)
No, I don't at all think Peter was getting him a job with the *Bavarians*. That's obviously Mom. The question is: is Tido attributing Mom's willingness to do that to Peter? Or is he just commenting on how he assumes his new Bavarian job comes from Mom? I would think the second one is so obvious as not to require comment, but it's possible that that's what he's saying.
(I mean, Peter evidently must have known of him, but being a friend of Fritz, I very much doubt he socialized with him.)
Though keep in mind, Peter's job as page is to stay on FW's good side so he can spy, and Wilhelmine says he was a great favorite with FW. I doubt his desertion left him with any social capital with Seckendorff, though. (Though late Knyphausen, Sr., was also dismissed in 1730 on suspicion of helping Fritz, and evidently his wife still has some strings to pull.)
(The Rhinelanders weren’t the only ones who really really really did not like the Prussians very much.)
No, they weren't. The Prussians, by which I mean the actual Prussians, from East Prussia, where Lehndorff's from, didn't like the Prussians, by which I mean the Brandenburg-based Hohenzollerns, very much either. They were quite happy to be conquered by the Russians with the intention of handing them back to Poland after the war. Fritz never forgave them, and never went there on his annual visit again.
...I feel like the Saxons have to hate the Prussians too, right?
Re: A Knyphausen Vagabond - Part 2
Date: 2025-01-16 09:17 am (UTC)Re: A Knyphausen Vagabond - Part 2
Date: 2025-01-16 09:50 am (UTC)