cahn | Historical Characters, Including Frederick the Great, Discussion Post 45

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Unfortunately, there was then at Berlin a King who pursued one policy only, who deceived his enemies, but not his servants, and who lied without scruple, but never without necessity.

(from The King's Secret - by Duke de Broglie, grand-nephew of the subject of the book, Comte de Broglie, and grandfather of the physicist) )

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From:

luzula

OMG, that really is losing the PR war! Re: this bit: “he would spend his days cutting out bits of paper with a pair of scissors”, it reminds me of similar phrasing in Mrs Calderwood's journal that I reported on here. She said it of the son of Colonel Townley, when she wanted to imply that he was feminine and without much initiative. Hmm.

From:

mildred_of_midgard

OMG, that really is losing the PR war!

Right?

Re: this bit: “he would spend his days cutting out bits of paper with a pair of scissors”, it reminds me of similar phrasing in Mrs Calderwood's journal that I reported on here. She said it of the son of Colonel Townley, when she wanted to imply that he was feminine and without much initiative. Hmm.

Oh, that's interesting! Do you have a sense of whether that was a literal 18th century hobby, or if it was a trope used to insult people?

ETA: I should remind everyone, though, of the take on August III that

cahn liked. It's from a more modern book, Liberty's Folly, by Jerzy Lukowski (whose other books I am also reading), that's willing to consider the revisionist picture at least possible:

Polish historians have traditionally portrayed Augustus III as a cipher for the greater part of his reign in the hands of his favourite and chief minister, Heinrich Brühl, a man whose reputation for financial corruption in Poland was exceeded only by his reputation for the same in Saxony. Augustus II had given his son the best education that money could buy. Yet when Charles VI’s ministers had decided to support the new elector’s candidacy in March 1733, one of the factors in his favour was his apparent stupidity. Augustus III had been taught Polish, but was reluctant to use it. His poor grasp of Latin did not facilitate communication with his new subjects. His conversion to Catholicism in 1717 was less cynical than his father’s. The energy which Augustus II had put into sex and drink his son put into piety and gluttony. His consort, Maria Josepha, was supposedly the more actively interested in politics, at least in relations with her native Austria. Heinrich Bruhl’s extraordinary predominance was at least partly attributable to her unfailing support. By the end of the reign the initial bitter hostility which Augustus III had met had given way to a widespread affection. Clad in his ceremonial robes his corpulent body exuded a kind of majesty. He had long abandoned any effort to tamper with Golden Liberty. He had become what the szlachta wanted in a king.

It is not yet possible to say whether a more complex reality underlay this obvious stereotype. At the very least, the patron of Johann Sebastian Bach must have had some positive qualities.

When I first mentioned this (not quoted in full),

cahn replied: "AHAHAHA I love the 'J.S. Bach: yea or nay?' approach to history!"

If you're wondering if Algarotti shows up in the Staszewski bio, he does not, but he does show up in Fellmann's bio of Brühl, which, alas, I only got about 100 pages into before getting distracted (per my usual procedure). Not sure when I'm going to pick it back up; I'm trying to finish Stollberg-Rilinger, and Duchhardt's "Balance of Power" und Pentarchie (the book I've been wanting but not for $100) arrived yesterday, a cheaper copy finally having appeared on the used book market, and I've at least got to check out Duchhardt's section on the First Polish Partition (but actually half the book looks good), so...the Royal Detective approach to reading is a bit ADHD and unpredictable. :D (It's weird because I don't actually have ADHD, but staying focused on a single book is usually like pulling teeth for me.)

Edited Date: 2023-10-17 06:51 pm (UTC)

From:

luzula

Oh, that's interesting! Do you have a sense of whether that was a literal 18th century hobby, or if it was a trope used to insult people?
An Internet search gave me these two examples of women doing papercut art at roughly the right time period! So it seems like it was actually a thing--and it looks like it was taken seriously as an art form, too.

From:

mildred_of_midgard

Oh, neat!

Those look really nice, let the men make pretty things, people!

(See my new question about Danish archives and your travel plans. :'D)

From:

cahn

When I first mentioned this (not quoted in full), [personal profile] cahn replied: "AHAHAHA I love the 'J.S. Bach: yea or nay?' approach to history!"

Lol, my reaction this time too; at least I'm consistent!

Many years ago I bought a hilarious book called Bluff Your Way in Music when I was in the UK; it's part of a series. (I also bought Bluff Your Way in the Classics, but I never did read that all the way through and probably won't unless/until we do Classics salon; as you can imagine, these books are much funnier when you actually know the subject they're talking about!) Under Bach: "Fortunately there is only one remark that is necessary in normal conversation and that is 'Ah... Bach!'"

(It's weird because I don't actually have ADHD, but staying focused on a single book is usually like pulling teeth for me.)

Heh. I don't have ADHD but I do usually have at least 3-4 books (usually fiction) lying around in different states of completion. I do generally have a pretty short attention span, though!