Oster trusting Catt is your explanation for four years old Heinrich being declared FW's fave by him; Catt, remember, claims he was.
Oh, right! I'd forgotten that, but yes. Okay, that makes sense.
So unless Oster provides a different source citation for the anecdote - say, an ambassadorial report (by Guy Dickens or Hotham the older, presumably), I'm going with my "faith in Catt strikes again" guess.
I...I can't tell. Here's the passage:
In dieser Atmosphäre konnte es sogar Wilhelmine wagen, ihrem Vater wieder unter die Augen zu treten, nachdem ihr Brief dessen Zorn bereits hatte erweichen lassen. Auch diese Szene hat der braunschweigische Gesandte am 4. März geschildert: »Wie sie nun ... hereingerufen, habe sich die älteste Prinzessin zu des Königs Füßen geworfen und selbe umfasset; da sie der König bei die Hand genommen und aufstehen heißen. Als sie aber dem König die Hand küssen wollte, war ihr solches resusiret [verwehrt], die Königin ihr darauf einen Wink gebend, war sie [Wilhelmine] dem Könige um den Hals gefallen und ihn geküsset, dabei sagend: ›Papa hat eine Ungnade auf mich geworfen, so mir länger unerträglich fällt. Ich bitte kindlich, Papa lasse mir doch die vorige Gnade wieder verspüren‹; welche Worte die Prinzessin bei Vergießung vieler Tränen hervorgebracht ... Der König habe darauf wieder versetzet: ›Es ist nun alles gut, Wilhelmine, du bist allemal meine liebe Tochter.‹« Friedrich Wilhelms gute Laune ging an diesem Tag sogar so weit, daß er Wilhelmine auftrug, während Sophie Dorothea im Wochen bett lag, für ihren Bruder Heinrich zu sorgen, der damals sein Liebling war. »Hieraus nun will man schließen, daß die Versöhnung zwischen dem Könige und der Prinzessin ihre Richtigkeit habe.«
The bit about taking care of Heinrich and Heinrich being the favorite aren't in the direct quote. But if they're from Catt and not the envoy, then the "Hieraus" is very misleading, to say the least. So the taking care of Heinrich story looks like it must come from the Brunswick envoy, even if the "he was the favorite" could possibly be an addendum from Catt.
Brunswick envoy on March 4: "Touching reconciliation between Wilhelmine and FW, everybody cries," in direct quote from the envoy report.
End direct quote.
Oster adds that FW is in such a good mood that he tells Wilhelmine, while SD is in childbed, to take care of Heinrich, who at the time was his favorite.
Resume Brunswick envoy direct quote: "From this, we can [or "we'd like to"?] conclude that the reconciliation between the King and Princess is real." [I'm taking "ihre Richtigkeit habe" to mean "has veracity," i.e. "is real," and the context to be the fact that just in the last month, the envoys have been writing home, "Is FW really being nice to Fritz, or is this just a show for our benefit?"]
So while I don't remember this anecdote from the memoirs, to answer selenak's question, the anecdote itself seems to be real, though I can't tell whether the envoy vouches for Heinrich being the favorite that year. (If he was, I really want to know what happened to make AW lose that spot temporarily.)
I also don't remember this anecdote from Catt, which is not to say it's not there, though I do remember Heinrich being the favorite, now that I'm reminded.
[ETA: Though I should add that I do remember, if my memory isn't faulty, a very similar episode earlier in the memoirs in which Wilhelmine was given charge of a different younger sibling or siblings. I will need to look that up.]
say, an ambassadorial report (by Guy Dickens or Hotham the older, presumably)
Oster actually quotes a lot from Stratemann, the Brunswick envoy, whom I didn't know about. As I said, there's a lot of good, new-to-me information in this book, and I'm glad I'm reading it!
At any event: why would Wilhelmine need to supervise Heinrich during SD's labor and ensueing lying-in anyway? That's what the staff is for. Heinrich having joined AW's household as of his fourth birthday in January, he wasn't even staying with his mother's household anymore.
Honorary position just to show that she's in favor again? I'm not sure, I was wondering this myself. And yes, I did wonder how this worked with him being in AW's household now.
Good question!
Magdeburgers: would have to look it up.
Please do, when you get the chance (I know you're traveling), and let me know where you find it, if you do. I'm interested in this sort of thing, and my admittedly cursory Google didn't turn anything up. If I have time, I might do a more thorough Googling.
On the one hand, yes, on the other there's the Fritz letter from Dresden to Wilhelmine which gives her a "hot or not?" report on August the Strong.
Oh, right! I'm so glad there are two of us: I remember the things you forget, and you remember the things I forget. :D
Maybe it wasn't as serious a possibility as she presents it in her memoirs, but what I do think is possible that Grumbkow, who was after all the FW/August liason, put it out there in some drunken rounds, and FW didn't immediately say no, which would have been enough for rumors to start and filter through to Wilhelmine and Fritz.
This makes total sense.
And Amelia/Emily comes across as way more strong willed than EC, too.
Right? I mean, most people who aren't Louise do, but seriously. Powder keg, lit fuse...disaster waiting to happen.
Mind you, her own experience with royal marriage would have been with Caroline managing G2 by pretending to worship to the ground he tread on but manipulating him into accepting all her ideas as his.
Sadly, as much as Fritz has a praise kink, I have my doubts about her chances of success.
And Fritz of Prussia would have done him the favor of always talking in French when insulting the Hannover clan, too.
![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
Re: Oster Wilhelmine readthrough - marriage negotiations
Date: 2020-09-27 02:44 pm (UTC)Oh, right! I'd forgotten that, but yes. Okay, that makes sense.
So unless Oster provides a different source citation for the anecdote - say, an ambassadorial report (by Guy Dickens or Hotham the older, presumably), I'm going with my "faith in Catt strikes again" guess.
I...I can't tell. Here's the passage:
In dieser Atmosphäre konnte es sogar Wilhelmine wagen, ihrem Vater wieder unter die Augen zu treten, nachdem ihr Brief dessen Zorn bereits hatte erweichen lassen. Auch diese Szene hat der braunschweigische Gesandte am 4. März geschildert: »Wie sie nun ... hereingerufen, habe sich die älteste Prinzessin zu des Königs Füßen geworfen und selbe umfasset; da sie der König bei die Hand genommen und aufstehen heißen. Als sie aber dem König die Hand küssen wollte, war ihr solches resusiret [verwehrt], die Königin ihr darauf einen Wink gebend, war sie [Wilhelmine] dem Könige um den Hals gefallen und ihn geküsset, dabei sagend: ›Papa hat eine Ungnade auf mich geworfen, so mir länger unerträglich fällt. Ich bitte kindlich, Papa lasse mir doch die vorige Gnade wieder verspüren‹; welche Worte die Prinzessin bei Vergießung vieler Tränen hervorgebracht ... Der König habe darauf wieder versetzet: ›Es ist nun alles gut, Wilhelmine, du bist allemal meine liebe Tochter.‹« Friedrich Wilhelms gute Laune ging an diesem Tag sogar so weit, daß er Wilhelmine auftrug, während Sophie Dorothea im Wochen bett lag, für ihren Bruder Heinrich zu sorgen, der damals sein Liebling war. »Hieraus nun will man schließen, daß die Versöhnung zwischen dem Könige und der Prinzessin ihre Richtigkeit habe.«
The bit about taking care of Heinrich and Heinrich being the favorite aren't in the direct quote. But if they're from Catt and not the envoy, then the "Hieraus" is very misleading, to say the least. So the taking care of Heinrich story looks like it must come from the Brunswick envoy, even if the "he was the favorite" could possibly be an addendum from Catt.
Brunswick envoy on March 4: "Touching reconciliation between Wilhelmine and FW, everybody cries," in direct quote from the envoy report.
End direct quote.
Oster adds that FW is in such a good mood that he tells Wilhelmine, while SD is in childbed, to take care of Heinrich, who at the time was his favorite.
Resume Brunswick envoy direct quote: "From this, we can [or "we'd like to"?] conclude that the reconciliation between the King and Princess is real." [I'm taking "ihre Richtigkeit habe" to mean "has veracity," i.e. "is real," and the context to be the fact that just in the last month, the envoys have been writing home, "Is FW really being nice to Fritz, or is this just a show for our benefit?"]
So while I don't remember this anecdote from the memoirs, to answer
I also don't remember this anecdote from Catt, which is not to say it's not there, though I do remember Heinrich being the favorite, now that I'm reminded.
[ETA: Though I should add that I do remember, if my memory isn't faulty, a very similar episode earlier in the memoirs in which Wilhelmine was given charge of a different younger sibling or siblings. I will need to look that up.]
say, an ambassadorial report (by Guy Dickens or Hotham the older, presumably)
Oster actually quotes a lot from Stratemann, the Brunswick envoy, whom I didn't know about. As I said, there's a lot of good, new-to-me information in this book, and I'm glad I'm reading it!
At any event: why would Wilhelmine need to supervise Heinrich during SD's labor and ensueing lying-in anyway? That's what the staff is for. Heinrich having joined AW's household as of his fourth birthday in January, he wasn't even staying with his mother's household anymore.
Honorary position just to show that she's in favor again? I'm not sure, I was wondering this myself. And yes, I did wonder how this worked with him being in AW's household now.
Good question!
Magdeburgers: would have to look it up.
Please do, when you get the chance (I know you're traveling), and let me know where you find it, if you do. I'm interested in this sort of thing, and my admittedly cursory Google didn't turn anything up. If I have time, I might do a more thorough Googling.
On the one hand, yes, on the other there's the Fritz letter from Dresden to Wilhelmine which gives her a "hot or not?" report on August the Strong.
Oh, right! I'm so glad there are two of us: I remember the things you forget, and you remember the things I forget. :D
Maybe it wasn't as serious a possibility as she presents it in her memoirs, but what I do think is possible that Grumbkow, who was after all the FW/August liason, put it out there in some drunken rounds, and FW didn't immediately say no, which would have been enough for rumors to start and filter through to Wilhelmine and Fritz.
This makes total sense.
And Amelia/Emily comes across as way more strong willed than EC, too.
Right? I mean, most people who aren't Louise do, but seriously. Powder keg, lit fuse...disaster waiting to happen.
Mind you, her own experience with royal marriage would have been with Caroline managing G2 by pretending to worship to the ground he tread on but manipulating him into accepting all her ideas as his.
Sadly, as much as Fritz has a praise kink, I have my doubts about her chances of success.
And Fritz of Prussia would have done him the favor of always talking in French when insulting the Hannover clan, too.
*snort*