Frederick the Great discussion post 11
Feb. 7th, 2020 09:43 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
cahnIn our last installment, our heroes found that Henri de Catt's memoirs, a major source for current biographers of Frederick the Great, are not to be trusted!!
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rheinsberg
rheinsbergcahn
The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-25 05:31 pm (UTC)My guy says that after all the time he spent editing that poetry into a readable form, it's his poetry as well. Of course, a deal could be made. - CGV. (Charles-Guy de Valory.) P.S. Look, Mike, I'm a reasonable guy. These two aren't good for each other. Let's get this over with as painlessly and quickly as possible, okay? I'm willing to do my bit if you do yours.
Handing over my guy's poetry should be painless unless he resists arrest. - MGF
WTF, Mike? Frankfurt isn't even Prussian territory! Do you want an international incident? What the hell has gotten into you? - CGV. P.S. Now we're going to demand complete compensation for any damaged goods and for my client's psychological distress. And my client's niece is going to sue your man for sexual molestation.
Charles, I admit we've gone a bit over the top, but you've got to understand my situation here. Himself has been hell t o live with ever since your guy did his level best to put him into that mood. I just want it to be over. Now,we have the poetry back, which was the main issue. As for Madame Denis suing, I wouldn't advise it. For starters, there's still the matter of that anonymous blog post making all kinds of damaging and privacy invading claims about my guy's sex life. We can trace IDs, you know. - MGF
To think I always thought you were the nice one. Fine. You want to talk about hard work situations? Imaging having to represent someone who can make verbal mincemeat ouf you in front of a mass audience at the drop of a hat. - CGV.
I don't have to imagine. - MGF. P.S. Nice people don't last a minute in any one of my jobs. P.P.S. I don't believe this. Does your guy actually have the audacity of claiming royalties from the ongoing performances of his works at the Prussian court?
That's not audacity, Mike, that's international copyright. My guy knows it by heart. Can't say I disagree with him there. - CGV. P.S. Of course, if your guy would just stop staging my guy's works for a while, we'd have no problem.
WTF, Charles? When your guy started here, I made him sign a non-disclosure agreement, and now he's not even posting his trashing of my guy anonymously anymore? If you want to talk international law, we have an extradition agreement with your government in cases of attempted regicide. - MGF.
Attempted what? - CGV.
My guy's feelings were wounded to the core. He'll never recover from this. - MGF.
Is that why my guy got a letter from him today? Seriously, Mike, I thought you knew better than letting him put anything on paper at this point. You haven't exactly given me reason to treat you gently if I get my hands on anything incriminatory. - CGV.
Charles - I'm taking a leave of absence in order to marry. Any further correspondance regarding the matter of V. may be adressed to WMB. - MGF
Dear Charles, I magine MGF has notified you I'm now representing my brother in this whole sorry matter. Look, what this situation needs are adults. You don't want having to represent dear V. for the rest of eternity, you want everything settled decently, am I right? Then let's do that. And please, do tell your client he's welcome to have lunch with me if he passes through. - WMB
I'm all for adulthood, especially if it takes this matter off my hands. Though I would have to advise my guy to stay far away from anything resembling Prussia-friendly territory for the immediate future.
Given I'd also advise him not to return to France after all he's said about our government, that admittedly leaves him with limited options.BTW, did Mike seriously marry? Mike?!? And was your brother okay with this? Enquiring minds want to know - CGV.Excellent. Here's what I propose: no visitation rights for either party, but unlimited correspondance as couple therapy. And no more financial exchanges of any kind. Trust me, this will work. - WMB. P.S. No comment on the marriage, which did take place. Mind you, it might just work: Mike seriously was in need of a holiday.
Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-25 05:58 pm (UTC)I love how "Mike" (I laughed so much) keeps playing hardball.
P.S. Look, Mike, I'm a reasonable guy. These two aren't good for each other.
Handing over my guy's poetry should be painless unless he resists arrest. - MGF
And lol, I had the same reaction Mike did to this:
Imaging having to represent someone who can make verbal mincemeat ouf you in front of a mass audience at the drop of a hat. - CGV.
I don't have to imagine. - MGF.
"Imagine"??? What do you mean, "imagine"??
And please, do tell your client he's welcome to have lunch with me if he passes through. - WMB
Just remember to sue Richter for slander. "Hopelessly smitten" my foot.
BTW, did Mike seriously marry? Mike?!? And was your brother okay with this? Enquiring minds want to know
P.S. No comment on the marriage, which did take place. Mind you, it might just work: Mike seriously was in need of a holiday.
LOL FOREVER. Yeah, seriously, I can see that having a front-row seat was not good for his emotional health. And somebody's been picking up his clients' tendency toward drama queening: regicide, Mike, really? :P
no visitation rights for either party, but unlimited correspondance as couple therapy.
Perfect summary of how that went down! Judging by their final correspondence, couple therapy was very therapeutic.
(Still laughing over Fritz's delusions about UTTERLY BOTHERFREE visits.)
Forgot to mention,
Nice people don't last a minute in any one of my jobs.
was one of the best lines. It rings true, and it makes Fredersdorf, I'm sorry, Mike, feel very three-dimensional.
Fredersdorf/Mike is the consigliere, y/y?
Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-25 10:32 pm (UTC)If your guy doesn't hand over my guy's poetry, we're going to take him to the cleaners. And to prison.
...okay, Fredersdorf would totally fit into that Mafia AU, wouldn't he?! As Hagen, I guess :D (lol, looks like Mildred had the same response)
I don't have to imagine. - MGF.
HAHAHAHAHA I laughed so hard. Because true!
Does your guy actually have the audacity of claiming royalties from the ongoing performances of his works at the Prussian court?
Wait, did he?!
WTF, Charles? When your guy started here, I made him sign a non-disclosure agreement, and now he's not even posting his trashing of my guy anonymously anymore?
HAHAHAHAHA omg the NDA, I am delighted :D (Part of my delight is that I remembered it!)
Attempted what? - CGV.
My guy's feelings were wounded to the core. He'll never recover from this. - MGF.
LOLOLOL! I echo mildred: Mike, really?!
And please, do tell your client he's welcome to have lunch with me if he passes through.
Man, W, you know I love you, but didn't you learn from the last time you had lunch with someone who was passing through? :D
Here's what I propose: no visitation rights for either party, but unlimited correspondance as couple therapy. And no more financial exchanges of any kind. Trust me, this will work.
HAHAHAHAHA W you're so smart!
Mike seriously was in need of a holiday.
Yeah. <3
Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-26 08:07 pm (UTC)Royalties: weren't a thing in the 17th century. That's one of the reasons why writers needed patrons so badly, unless they were Voltaire and actually good (mostly) with money making schemes. However, in any kind of modern scenario which has computer ID royalties would be a thing, and you can bet Voltaire would have claimed his. Considering Fritz, as Lehndorff notes, kept staging his plays throughout 1753.
And hey, W this time around asked Fritz first whether she could have lunch, and he said yes. (That's why Richter, the editor of the Fredersdorf letters, is so upset she has no consideration for her brother's feelings with all the attempting to reconcile him with Voltaire and asking whether it's okay if Voltaire stops by at her place.) Not least because he's always eager for Voltaire news.
Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-26 08:18 pm (UTC);)
Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-26 08:24 pm (UTC)(BTW, about that: is Fritz or is Fritz not thinking of:
Aristotle “Love is composed of a single soul inhibiting two bodies.”
and Plato:
"“And when one of them meets with his other half, the actual half of himself, the pair are lost in an amazement of love and friendship and intimacy and one will not be out of sight of the other even for a moment”."
when he makes that statement re: Wilhelmine and himself to Heinrich?
(Note that neither Aristotle nor Plato had siblings in mind with that simile, at least as far as I dimly recall...)
Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-26 08:26 pm (UTC)Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-26 08:30 pm (UTC)Think that I was born and raised with my sister from Bayreuth, that these first attachments are indissoluble, that between us the keenest tenderness has never received the least alteration, that we have separate bodies, but that we have one soul. Think that, after having wiped away so many kinds of misfortunes capable of disgusting me with life, there is only one blow left for me to anticipate which will make life truly unbearable.
Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-26 08:39 pm (UTC)...There. Do you feel better now?
Heinrich: Only in the sense that rage has consumed 100% of my emotions, temporarily driving out grief. You know, there's *one* fraternal death I'm sure I could get over with all the speed and grace that you're looking for right now.
Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-26 10:06 pm (UTC)1.) Her three mainly quoted sources are Andrew Hamilton, sigh, Heinrich‘s early 20th century American biographer Chester Easum, and... Lehndorff. Yay to the last?
2.) Except Pangels, writing in the 1970s, is the first person, including nineteenth century people like Fontane, who gives us Heinrich the heterosexual. You read that right. Quoting Lehndorff‘s mentions of the Countess Bentinck to tell a tale of how Heinrich cheated on Mina with Bentinck, Lehndorff was the confidant of this affair, and felt very distressed when it was over and he and Heinrich weren‘t that close anymore. But, you know, in a platonic manner, just as a friend.
3.) Seriously, how anyone can read Lehndorff‘s diaries, even just the first volume, the original edition, and assume the above is beyond me.
4.) Marwitz doesn‘t exist. (Naturally, since Heinrich is straight.) Heinrich‘s early aversion to Big Bro is incomprehensible, his later hatred is warped, and for no reason other than fraternal jealousy. (AW having brought his death upon himself by his defeatism and gloom.) Sure, Heinrich advised Fritz against the Maxen disaster, and Fritz did it anyway, but Heinrich is still a know-it-all critisizing the great man with hindsight (even though she just mentioned he did it before the event itself). Heinrich‘s presumption of being as good a general as Fritz is megalomania. Treatment of civilians? Not an issue.
5.) Heinrich dies in self-caused isolation without any loved ones (naturally, since he‘s straight and there‘s no girlfriend around, and his wife is utterly estranged). But then, he never loved anyone. He was incapable. (The early Bentinck fling isn‘t presented as love, either, just as sex.) He could just hate. Why Fritz the eternally chill and forgiving kept trying is a mystery. Well, okay, he was a good uncle to Ferdinand‘s kids, and okay, Ferdinand and he got along, and yeah, some French people in France and out of it liked him, too, and Lehndorff seems to have done (still yearning for the days where he was a confidant to the Heinrich/Bentinck affair), but other than that.
6.) Heinrich liked the French Revolution because he liked anything French, i.e. Pangels quotes Hamilton on this. Okay, he also seems to have had a warped bias against kings.
7.) I‘m still not over Heinrich the heterosexual and Lehndorff the Heinrich/Bentinck shipper.
Given this, I‘m not sure I‘m up to the other chapters, but maybe she does better with the sisters...
Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-27 09:23 am (UTC)Well, thank god for Ziebura, then.
Okay, he also seems to have had a warped bias against kings.
I wonder where he and AW could have gotten the idea that unlimited monarchy has its downsides? Not from Fritz the eternally chill!
7) ME NEITHER.
maybe she does better with the sisters...
Remember MacDonogh the "The sisters had the temerity to ask Fritz to pay off their debts" guy? Don't hold your breath.
Thanks for trying! Back to ambassador reports, I guess...
Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-28 05:44 am (UTC)*blinks*
Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-27 06:36 pm (UTC)Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-26 08:34 pm (UTC)Let me dig up what I wrote...ah, there we go. About one month ago, I wrote:
his one-soul-separate-bodies* sister...
* Possibly a reference to the following quote attributed to Aristotle by Diogenes Laertius (though Diogenes was writing some 500 years later and not always good about his sources, that's never stopped anyone from using this quote or bypassing Diogenes and attributing it straight to Aristotle):
To the query "What is a friend?" his [Aristotle's] reply was, "A single soul dwelling in two bodies."
Plato's talking about sexual desire and romantic soul mates, but φίλος is the word used by Diogenes. Which I think could include siblings to Aristotle and/or Diogenes, though I wouldn't want to swear by it.
I do strongly suspect that's what our classically-educated Fritz had in mind, indeed. And if not, it's certainly what always comes to mind for me!
Re: The Very Secret Divorce Lawyer Text Messages
Date: 2020-02-27 06:37 pm (UTC)(That's why Richter, the editor of the Fredersdorf letters, is so upset she has no consideration for her brother's feelings with all the attempting to reconcile him with Voltaire and asking whether it's okay if Voltaire stops by at her place.)
Poor W can't win! If she asks, editors get upset she has no consideration for Fritz's feelings! If she doesn't ask, Fritz gets upset! Though I suppose I know which one is better for W. :P