After an interruption, I've continued with my Nicolai browsing, and volume 6 contains several jewels. cahn, there are a lot of Quanz stories, including the one which made it into many a fiction, of FW nearly surprising Fritz and Quanz playing the flute, when in comes Katte to warn them, and Quanz hiding just in time, but also one from Fritz' time as King, which is very Fritzian. Background: Quanz only said "Bravo" when Fritz' play was good enough (though otoh he did not, Nicolai emphatically says, say "rubbish" or grimace when it was bad, he just withheld the applause). The anecdote goes thusly: Quanz makes a new flute for Fritz, Fritz plays but makes mistakes, promptly blames the flute, Quanz checks the flute again and says no, the flute is good, Fritz says it's not true and shouts, they don't talk for a week during which Quanz withholds applause and approval, after eight days, Fritz caves and says okay, yes, it was him, not the flute, Quanz is "okay, then let's practice". Also, Quanz - whom Nicolai knew, and who is his source for all these stories, once said ruefully about Fritz as a person and why despite their ups and downs he can't bring himself to leave him, that he'd miss him if he left: Ich hätte nicht gedacht,dass mir der Mensch so nötig wäre. ("I wouldn't have thought that I need this man so much.")
mildred_of_midgard, apparently until the early 1790s, the most common spread story about the escape attempt was that Fritz and Katte were both arrested at the same time, at Wesel. Nicolai corrects this and says he's had it from a son of a former Gens d'Armes comrade of Katte's that Katte was in Berlin, and that the plan had been for Katte to escape separately, and then tells the "you're still here?" story that subsequently is told everywhere else. There's one detail that I haven't seen in later versions, and that is that when Katte is moved form his original arrest place, the officer in charge of the transport is optimistic that he'll be released once it's all cleared up, and Katte replies "Non, mon ami, le tyran demande du sang". I can see why this story didn't make it into other accounts, though, because unlike Nicolai, we've seen the interrogation protocols and Katte's petitions for his life etc., and I don't think it occured to Katte this early that the death penalty (as opposed to imprisonment and possibly physical punishment) was where this was going. Still, I thought you'd like the quote.
Nicolai's version is also the one where Peter gets the "sauvez-vous" warning note from Fritz and therefore hightails it out of Wesel, which was we now doesn't work, date wise. He (N) says his source isn't sure whether Peter then initially took refuge with the French or English ambassador in Holland (we know it was with the Brits, but with Chesterfield's staff rather than Chesterfield himself), and has him directly interact with the unnamed envoy, but the trajectory of Peter's flight otherwise is correct, as is Peter's later career, and Nicolai says his source's dad knew Peter personally as well. This supposed former comrade of Katte's and friend of Peter's whose son is Nicolai's source is called von Hertefeld.
Aaand then I saw Nicolai has yet another version of the Glasow story in the offering, which is far too good not to give you verbatim, which I shall do in another comment (it's that long).
Love the Quantz stories, and from Fritz' letters to Wilhelmine, I remember that there were ups and downs even during the crown prince years. Also, Quantz' direct quote is lovely, particularly the German phrasing. It keeps being interesting that Fritz could have that effect on people. (Even Heinrich, kind of. :P)
"Non, mon ami, le tyran demande du sang" - seeing the context in your other comment, i.e. not coming back soon, one could interpret this as him speaking metaphorically, about imprisonment/physical punishment? Possibly?
I was going to hold off on clearing that up, but quickly:
No, it's a matter of chronological confusion on Selena's part (probably from reading fast). She originally wrote, "I don't think it occured to Katte this early," but then the full translation (thank you!) says:
When Katte was transported to Küstrin
Now, that was November 3. By then, Katte knew he was on his way to his execution, had written his pleas for pardon in vain, and all but the faintest shred of hope was lost. This is the point at which he's giving away all his books. :(
What Mildred said re: hastily made mistake which I then when translating every word recognized as such.
Quantz' direct quote is lovely, particularly the German phrasing.
Isn't it just? Sadly I can't get across the flavour of Mensch in English, since it's man just as if he'd said Mann. Human being sounds clumsily. And "Mensch" in Yiddish means something slightly different. And the passive construction of "mir nötig" also can't be repeated in English.
Nicolai, btw, is a big Quantz admirer, regrets that his work hardly gets played anymore at the time of writing (because musical taste moves on) and defends him against the accusation of his flute pieces being repetitive by saying that many of these were composed explicitly for Fritz who hated completely new stuff, so there had to be something familiar in each one.
See, Fritz, that's why MT and later Joseph get Gluck and later Mozart respectively, aka the musical innovators of the age. His taste in everything really was frozen somewhere in the 1730s.
I actually very much appreciate these notes on the German, because now I know enough to distinguish Mensch from Mann (I don't imagine I get the nuances, but at least I know enough to know there is a nuance) and I can at least see the passive construction. But I would never have gotten this on my own of course!
Nicolai, btw, is a big Quantz admirer, regrets that his work hardly gets played anymore at the time of writing (because musical taste moves on) and defends him against the accusation of his flute pieces being repetitive by saying that many of these were composed explicitly for Fritz who hated completely new stuff, so there had to be something familiar in each one.
Oh wow, that's really interesting actually. I wonder how Quantz felt about that. (Does Nicolai say?)
See, Fritz, that's why MT and later Joseph get Gluck and later Mozart respectively, aka the musical innovators of the age. His taste in everything really was frozen somewhere in the 1730s.
Ha, yeah. I'm imagining ghost!Fritz (maybe mildred's reincarnated Fritz?) visiting the present day and being extremely indignant that it's those young whippersnappers who are remembered... Like so much, you bring it on yourself, Fritz!
I wonder how Quantz felt about that. (Does Nicolai say?)
No, he doesn't. The entire passage where this is brought up reads: It is not a little task to create that many concerts for a single lover of the art, and even more so for a lover of the art who is King. Therefore, it is a proof of Quantz' richness of musical inspiration. Every single one of these concerts has a unique character; the uniformity lies only those passages where Quantz had to appease the King who did not wish for something completely new.
However, he also adds just a few paragraphs later that Quantz could be a musical dictator in company himself, brooking no opinion but his. So I suspect that if Quantz' style felt outfashioned at the point where Nicolai is writing, it's also due to Quantz himself not wanting to change with the times. Which, fair enough; there aren't many composers who keep open for experimentation in their old age. (Good old Verdi being one; even laywoman me learned that you can tell in "Falstaff" and "Aida" that Wagner happened.)
*nods* Yes, this was my impression of Salieri as well when I listened to a bunch of his operas a while back (and why he isn't remembered the way Mozart is). Ha, I watched a less-than-engaging version of Aida and I still need to watch Falstaff. I really need to find some good performances, and I'll keep that in mind! (I have watched a good performance of Otello, which was amazing.)
Fritz plays but makes mistakes, promptly blames the flute, Quanz checks the flute again and says no, the flute is good, Fritz says it's not true and shouts, they don't talk for a week during which Quanz withholds applause and approval, after eight days, Fritz caves and says okay, yes, it was him, not the flute, Quanz is "okay, then let's practice".
Oh, man, that is SO Fritz. That is so very Fritz.
Also, Quanz - whom Nicolai knew, and who is his source for all these stories, once said ruefully about Fritz as a person and why despite their ups and downs he can't bring himself to leave him, that he'd miss him if he left: Ich hätte nicht gedacht,dass mir der Mensch so nötig wäre. ("I wouldn't have thought that I need this man so much.")
Woooow. That is the effect Fritz has on people, no doubt!
mildred_of_midgard, apparently until the early 1790s, the most common spread story about the escape attempt was that Fritz and Katte were both arrested at the same time, at Wesel.
Oooh, I did not know this. Interesting! Given how complicated the actual story is (Fritz in Sinsheim, Keith in Wesel, Katte in Berlin, I can see why it got simplified over time).
and then tells the "you're still here?" story that subsequently is told everywhere else.
Ooh, nice, good to know where that comes from.
Nicolai's version is also the one where Peter gets the "sauvez-vous" warning note from Fritz and therefore hightails it out of Wesel, which was we now doesn't work, date wise.
Not unless my speculation about backdating is true, and that's really extreeeemely speculative. It's possible the Mylius report to FW would also have to contain some falsehoods? Not sure, would have to reread. Ah, yes, Mylius also says Peter left on the 6th.
Unless there is a big successful coverup here, I have to assume Nicolai, Peter Keith's son, Wilhelmine, and Catt are all wrong, and that a story was going around to the effect that Peter was warned. After all, it's possible Fritz did send the letter; it's just that Peter was already gone when he did.
(we know it was with the Brits, but with Chesterfield's staff rather than Chesterfield himself)
We know a lot of oddly specific things in salon! I'm proud of us. :D
Nicolai says his source's dad knew Peter personally as well. This supposed former comrade of Katte's and friend of Peter's whose son is Nicolai's source is called von Hertefeld.
Huh. Cool, will keep an eye out for him. There's a Frau von Hertefeld mentioned in Lehndorff's diary in 1752 (a very sophisticated woman), but that's all my searches of our salon give me. I may do detective work at some point if felis doesn't beat me to it, but not tonight.
...Is it possible Peter told the story this way? To make it look like, "I only left because Fritz said to! To save my life!"
I just checked and Voltaire and Catt diverge in one respect, interestingly: Voltaire has Keith getting arrested and then escaping. I'm betting he's confusing the two brothers (another way in which, if you heard this story orally, you would simplify, because wow this story is so confusing I never understood it fully until we'd been in salon for a some time). It's still just possible Catt has his story from Fritz, who remembered writing the letter to Peter but not the exact date Peter left Wesel.
Oooh, I did not know this. Interesting! Given how complicated the actual story is (Fritz in Sinsheim, Keith in Wesel, Katte in Berlin, I can see why it got simplified over time).
Same here, especially given how much of the retelling must have been by word of mouth, and without any ability to look up sources.
Unless there is a big successful coverup here, I have to assume Nicolai, Peter Keith's son, Wilhelmine, and Catt are all wrong, and that a story was going around to the effect that Peter was warned. After all, it's possible Fritz did send the letter; it's just that Peter was already gone when he did..
The fascinating thing is that they must have at least two different sources.
Nicolai: v. Hertefeld, who has it from his father, who says he has it from Peter. Keith Jr: Peter (and/or his mother, given he was a boy when Peter died, so possibly like with the Hertefelds a retelling of a retelling.
Wilhelmine: Can't be Peter, certainly not in a document written from 1739 - 1744, thus must be Fritz, possibly also Pöllnitz providing court gossip.
Catt: probably Fritz. Though possibly also other people, see his habit of putting stories into Fritz' mouth he heard elsewhere.
Voltaire: most likely Fritz, possibly also some gossip among his fellow table-rounders, and yes, I'm sure you're right and he's confusing the two Keith brothers recalling the story decades later. (Am also reminded how the "Sachsens Glanz und Preußens Gloria" scriptwriters and/or their nineteenth century Polish novel source simplified their lives by making Katte and both Keith brothers into the same character.)
I don't believe in a massive cover-up for the simple reason that Mylius must know that FW is on his way to Wesel and will be there in furious person, and it's just too risky. What if random soldier X mentions Lieutenant Keith left on a different date?
Is it possible Peter told the story this way? To make it look like, "I only left because Fritz said to! To save my life!"
Very plausible, since he was likely feeling defensive for not having become a dead lion, but that doesn't explain Wilhelmine whom he certainly hasn't talked to at the point of her writing since the late 1720s. (If they talked then at all.)
Current speculation: Fritz did write a note, and since Peter managed to escaped, he naturally assumed this note saved Peter's life, was glad about it, and mentioned this in his own retellings to Wilhelmine etc. By the time Peter returned to Berlin, the story was firmly established, and he was both touched that Fritz wrote to begin with (since that proved at least in the past, Fritz had cared), and wise enough not to contradict the King, especially if he was also feeling defensive due to the implicit Katte comparison everyone must have been making. So he included the note into his own version.
I don't believe in a massive cover-up for the simple reason that Mylius must know that FW is on his way to Wesel and will be there in furious person, and it's just too risky. What if random soldier X mentions Lieutenant Keith left on a different date?
Exactly my thinking.
Am also reminded how the "Sachsens Glanz und Preußens Gloria" scriptwriters and/or their nineteenth century Polish novel source simplified their lives by making Katte and both Keith brothers into the same character.
Yep, I was thinking of that too. It's a pretty complex story. (I still want to know where the name Robert for the brother originated. felis? ;) )
Keith Jr: Peter (and/or his mother, given he was a boy when Peter died, so possibly like with the Hertefelds a retelling of a retelling.
Agreed, I've always assumed that even if Peter told the story when the kids were young, their actual memories of it (in 1820!) were based on variants they heard later. It's a PITY a certain Academy secretary felt the need to gloss over the account in the memoirs!
Current speculation: Fritz did write a note, and since Peter managed to escaped, he naturally assumed this note saved Peter's life, was glad about it, and mentioned this in his own retellings to Wilhelmine etc.
This has been my theory for a long time (it might even be in the Rheinsberg textual criticism posts), and this...
By the time Peter returned to Berlin, the story was firmly established, and he was both touched that Fritz wrote to begin with (since that proved at least in the past, Fritz had cared), and wise enough not to contradict the King, especially if he was also feeling defensive due to the implicit Katte comparison everyone must have been making. So he included the note into his own version.
...is a perfect explanation for the rest! SOLD. :)
ETA: Fritz did write a note, and since Peter managed to escaped, he naturally assumed this note saved Peter's life, was glad about it, and mentioned this in his own retellings to Wilhelmine etc.
It occurs to me that Fritz might have spent 10 years believing his note saved Peter, telling everyone that, only found out otherwise in 1740 when he went through the archives, and didn't want to change his story.
Speaking of people being only human, I've always assumed that even if Peter was just following Fritz's orders when he deserted, and even if Fritz *didn't* want him executed in addition to, or even instead of, Katte, Fritz would only be human if he had some resentment after hearing about Peter living for ten years in freedom (even with FW after him) while he was put through the Küstrin regimen and Katte was killed. Of course, I think the bigger problem is Fritz drank the Prussian kool-aid in the 1730s, but I think we have to assume everyone resents everyone at least a little in this story. :(
It's a PITY a certain Academy secretary felt the need to gloss over the account in the memoirs!
It's a pity we don't have the memoirs themselves. Along with a print out of AW's account of his youthful life. :)
It occurs to me that Fritz might have spent 10 years believing his note saved Peter, telling everyone that, only found out otherwise in 1740 when he went through the archives, and didn't want to change his story.
Two words: Quintus Icilius.
I think we have to assume everyone resents everyone at least a little in this story.
Well, yes. Which is why I nominated them at [Bad username or unknown identity: unsent letters]; letters are good for venting. :) More seriously, it must have been extra hard on them because having mixed feelings about a loved one was so not the done thing in this era. It's funny if it's contemporaries wondering how Voltaire and Fritz can cure and praise each other within two breaths, but it's heartbreaking if it's Fritz and Wilhelmine, or Fritz and Peter Keith, unable to to admit that they have these particular resentments. (I think that's why Wilhelmine pounces so on the "he doesn't love me anymore!" theory in her memoirs. That, she can complain about. "I resent that he was able to leave me in hell with Mom and Dad", otoh? Not so much. And Fritz can complain about Erlangen journalists, Austrian marriages for female Marwitzes and lunch with MT, but he can't say "you should have supported my wish to escape, you who knew better than anyone how terrible every day there was for me". As for Peter, he has the additional problem that he's a subject and Fritz is a King and he can't say anything to anyone other than his wife without having to be aware it could get back to Fritz sooner or later.
And poor Katte is dead, so he can't resent or not resent anyone, and while he was alive he evidently tried to repress resentment sensations by falling back on the faith of his childhood and by telling himself at least Fritz would live. But if FW hadn't intervened and he had spent those ten years in prison, well....
It's a pity we don't have the memoirs themselves. Along with a print out of AW's account of his youthful life. :)
Well, yes! But the second one we still might get someday, and the first one is presumably lost forever...but Formey's work survives and the author made a choice for which I reserve the right to hold a grudge!
So one thing that occurs to me is that I've been assuming Peter's memoirs disappeared before 1820 and the son didn't have access to them. I *think* Koser also comments that this letter is not worth anything as evidence, and I suspect he's thinking primarily of the "Sauvez-vous" part, since he calls that out in his text as a oft-repeated historical impossibility. Yeah, he calls it "unerheblich"--insignificant, unimportant.
But...what if Peter stuck to the "Sauvez-vous" story even in his memoirs?
Oh, no, wait, son says Peter was warned that Fritz had been arrested, nothing about a note from Fritz. That's also the story in Wilhelmine: specifically that a page from the house of Anhalt (wonder where she got that detail) warned Peter. Nothing about a note. Hmm. Fritz warning Peter is in Nicolai (via Hertefeld) and Catt (via who knows).
So you know what I'm thinking? I'm thinking we have another simplification here. See, after Peter spent several days in the Hague, someone must have warned him that FW was after him, and that was when he fled to Chesterfield's house. Yeah, Seckendorff, writing August 30, says Peter first went to the guy who used to be an envoy to Berlin (someone Peter presumably knew when the guy was stationed in Berlin), and then Peter got a report that the Prussians were after him, and then he fled to Chesterfield. And I think Wilhelmine and the son are conflating that story with his escape from Wesel, and having him go straight from Wesel to Chesterfield.
So possibly the memoirs are still lost by 1820, but there is a story going around, possibly put forth by Peter himself, according to which Peter left Prussia only because he was warned that someone was after him. And his son and Wilhelmine might have conflated the two escapes (interestingly, she doesn't mention her brother's role in warning him, suggesting that maybe he *didn't* tell her this story after all, and thus maybe not Catt).
Btw, Wilhelmine has Peter pretending to go after a deserter; the son has him trying out his new horse. Nicolai's story of a leisurely ride matches Peter's son's more closely, so maybe that was the story Peter told, and Wilhelmine misremembered or got a slightly different variant.
Okay, so I had been wondering when Seckendorff reports Peter missing. On August 14, Seckendorf's in Wesel with FW, and he has a several-page write-up in Forster (volume 3. starting on page 1) that I don't have time to plod through, but he mentions "Katt und Keith" as accomplices, and says--and this is odd--that of the "letzteren" know one knows anything about where he might be, but the "der erste" has gone to Nijmegen and Colonel Moulin has been sent after him to try to arrest him. Now Wilhelmine, Peter's son, *and* the official Mylius report to FW during the trial (the most reliable of all sources) all say Moulin went after Peter in the Hague, thus causing him to flee to Chesterfield. And Nijmegen is just across the Dutch border from Wesel (man, I am learning so much geography in this fandom). So Seckendorff must be swapping Katt and Keith (and remember, cahn, that these would have been pronounced much more similarly in German of the time: both one-syllable words ending in a 't' sound).
So I still don't know where Wilhelmine and Catt got their stories, but while they agree on Peter being warned, they don't agree on Fritz warning him; that's Nicolai and Catt.
Well, yes. Which is why I nominated them at [Bad username or unknown identity: unsent letters]; letters are good for venting. :)
Indeed, and I'm sorry no one is in a position to join you and request them! What can I say, we can't keep up with you. ;)
It's funny if it's contemporaries wondering how Voltaire and Fritz can cure and praise each other within two breaths, but it's heartbreaking if it's Fritz and Wilhelmine, or Fritz and Peter Keith, unable to to admit that they have these particular resentments.
I knooooow.
while he was alive he evidently tried to repress resentment sensations by falling back on the faith of his childhood
Yeah, it's so clear from the write-up that he's clinging to religion as a way of managing his emotions (fear as much as resentment) that even when I was headcanoning it as a display for FW's benefit, I was assuming he was getting *some* emotional comfort from it. Even if just the hymn-singing and something to focus on that wasn't imminent death.
But if FW hadn't intervened and he had spent those ten years in prison, well....
Yeeahh. Especially if he then ends up with a guilt-ridden and Kool-aid-drinking Fritz who is not at all what he expected, and is also more traumatized than an equally traumatized Katte is equipped to deal with.
So you know what I'm thinking? I'm thinking we have another simplification here.
Having gone through Seckendorf's report, I'm thinking you're right. Also, the fact that Peter took the time to have lunch or dinner with Keppel (the former Dutch resident in Berlin, who, however, seems to have been a Prussian citizen*, since Seckendorff mentions later FW is pissed off with "General Keppel for aiding Keith") would indicate he's at this point not yet aware that FW is after him and he has to fear for his life.
*Like Stratemann was actually a Prussian citizen but appointed envoy by the Duke of Braunschweig nonetheless.
I'm curious what you make of other details Hertefeld-via-Nicolai gives for the escape plan, but I'll fait for your comment on this before I ask.
Argh, I know you've been waiting, and I was planning on getting to it today! But then unexpected things happened, and I got unexpectedly revved up about one of the two planned meetings, and if I want to sleep, I think I have to put this off until tomorrow. But tomorrow if all goes well!
Uggggh. Yeah, I think even in this day and age where mixed feelings about people are a lot more acceptable and talked about, it's often hard to personally verbalize/admit to those sorts of mixed feelings about someone one really loves, especially if one is a person who hasn't had a lot of practice in self-analysis in general. Then add in an era where it really wasn't acceptable or talked about, and...
That makes a lot of sense about Fritz and Wilhelmine :(
Okay, so I think Nicolai's source is Friedrich Leopold von Hertefeld, son of Ludwig Casimir von Hertefeld. Who doesn't have wiki entry of his own, but Fontane is helpful in this case, see these excerpts, which cover Ludwig Casimir. Most important bit translated:
Ludwig Casimir was born in 1709 and joined the Gensdarmes regiment in 1728, so he was a regimental comrade of Hans Hermann von Katte for two more years. In 1743, after having participated in the First Silesian War, he resigned from the service. Again seven years later, in 1750, he became chamberlain to the widowed Queen Sophie Dorothee, mother of Frederick the Great, and remained in this position until her death in 1757.
Fontane also says he was into books and built a library building on his Liebenberg estate. He went back to Boetzlaer (near Xanten and Kleve) in 1777 and died in 1790.
So I strongly suspect that he got to know Peter while he was chamberlain for SD.
Lehndorff by the way? Not impressed:
April 15th, 1753. I get up at three to go to Potsdam; a journey I would dislike if I wouldn't find my dear Prince Heinrich there. My travelling companion is Herr v. Hertefeld, chamberlain of the queen-mother, a very unpleasant man and a babbler ["Schwätzer"] like a woman.
and:
April 4th, 1756. [...] He is a guy who is judged unfavourably by people. He left service during the war und spent six years living quietly on his estate. Finally the queen-mother chose him for chamberlain on recommendation of Chancellor [Cocceji]'s wife, who is his wife's sister, an excellent, witty, and amiable woman, only her voice has something from a dragoon.
Von Hertefeld's wife = Susanne von Bechefer (see this wiki article about v. Hertefeld's father Samuel, who himself held a couple of positions during FW's time). I think Lehndorff is still talking about Cocceji's wife with his description, it's a bit ambiguous even in German, but he definitely likes v. Hertefeld's wife a lot more than the guy, see also this entry from September the same year: Hertefeld with his special gift to bore his listeners only likes those who have the patience to listen to him. and again in December: the man is as unpleasant as his wife is the opposite. One of their daughters seems to have been lady-in-waiting with EC, Lehndorff mentions her quite a lot. Fontane says that's the only daughter they had, so I'm not sure how and if they are also related to the young lady who was with Amalie and died young of tuberculosis, which apparently inspired Fritz to write a poem to Amalie in 1770. ETA: Oh, I just realized that Fontane said they only had one daughter by the time Luwdig Casimir died, so I guess the woman who died in 1770 might have been his daughter as well.
Lehndorff also lists v. Hertefeld as one of the guys who carried AW's coffin.
Good old Fontane! I bow to your brilliance in checking there.
Lehndorff by the way? Not impressed:
LOL. I must admit, it never fails to amuse me that there are two things you can rely on when reading Lehndorff:
a) sooner or later, Heinrich will be mentioned, and
b) If Lehndorff comes into contact with someone who theoretically could tell him interesting stories about Hans Herrmann von Katte, he will dislike this person.
I mean: - cousin Ludolf: terrible husband to The One Who Got Away - cousin Wartensleben: miser, sugar hoarder, pouncer on chambermaids when younger and spy when old - Staatsminister von Katte: boo, hiss, evil redhead - and now: Hertefeld, former regiment comrade, experienced the arrest first hand, has books from Katte: what a bore!
It's as if he's postumously determined to frustrate Mildred, verily. Lehndorff being Team Keith all the way might make up for it, though?
Aw, I can't take the credit for that - I found the (grand)father's wiki page first, took an educated guess which of the three sons might be the one in question, and when I googled his full name, Fontane was basically the first thing that came up. But it was a nice reminder indeed that he put some research in when it comes to Brandenburg and its history.
Love your take-away from the Lehndorff quotes, hee.
- cousin Ludolf: terrible husband to The One Who Got Away
I mean, judging by your Wust historian, he apparently was! In that she left Wust as soon as he died, took the remaining kid(s), and never looked back.
- cousin Wartensleben: miser, sugar hoarder, pouncer on chambermaids when younger and spy when old
Nitpick: this is another cousin-aged uncle, 3 years younger than Katte. Grandpa Wartensleben was *really* of the "go forth and multiply" persuasion, with 13 kids who made it to adulthood, with a 32-year spread between the first and last. Thus brother to the 6 most loved guy who was on the Strasbourg trip and a suspect for a Manteuffel informer.
It's as if he's postumously determined to frustrate Mildred, verily.
LEHNDORFF!! *shakes fist*
More seriously, I laughed when I read this. Admittedly I was a little distracted from reading on my phone while multitasking at work, but I hadn't actually noticed that this pattern was striking again! I'm touched that you were so alert on my behalf. ;)
Lehndorff being Team Keith all the way might make up for it, though?
You know, it kinda does. We know increasingly more and more about Katte (thanks largely to you!) and very little about Keith, and it *is* good to have Lehndorff's input. Especially the part about Keith being a Lehndorff's idea of a role model for young people; that means something coming from Lehndorff in his diary in a way that Formey's encomia don't.
So I am grateful for Lehndorff's different perspective.
Still! Lehndorff, it's possible to be Team Katte and Team Keith; look at me! (I even got Mobster AU author to ship them for me!)
Thank you! Just as salon came around just at the right time when I needed a distraction from medical woes, you came around just at the right time when they're starting to let up and I'm working again and have less time to play detective! Salon would clearly have lost a lot of momentum without me and cahn to play off the ever active selenak, but you've been doing a bang-up job of helping her keep it going so the rest of us can have something to enjoy and to participate in when we have time. :D <3
So I strongly suspect that he got to know Peter while he was chamberlain for SD.
Agreed, and in 1750, Hanway says Fritz put Peter near the Queen Mother when he returned to Berlin (I suspect his Hofstallmeister position was at her court). Even if ten years later, he's not any more because he has other duties, that might still have been something that led to them having many contacts in common and getting to know each other, added to liking books and having 1730 in common (if from opposite sides, as it were).
Peter getting to know someone who was friends with Katte and who was responsible for guarding him under arrest...that must have been a trip akin to Fritz reading the archives.
Do we know if Hertefeld was an Academy member? That was one of the things I was going to look into if I had time.
re: Academy - he wasn't. The site with the Academy records also has a name index for everyone ever mentioned in those records and he doesn't show up once, not even as a guest.
Hertefeld with his special gift to bore his listeners only likes those who have the patience to listen to him.
Heh! Lehndorff can certainly paint a word-portrait in a sentence :)
That poem is pretty long :P And I didn't read it carefully (and stuck it into google translate, because I am way too short on time this week :( ) but although it could certainly be a lot worse (*cough*Heinrich *cough*EC) I still feel like Fritz could use a refresher on the ring theory of grief, and find myself wondering how Amalie took it...
Thank you for the info about Quantz, which was awesome! Aw man Fritz, and go Quantz :D (Quantz's style in that story reminds me of a couple of teachers I've known.)
![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
no subject
Nicolai's version is also the one where Peter gets the "sauvez-vous" warning note from Fritz and therefore hightails it out of Wesel, which was we now doesn't work, date wise. He (N) says his source isn't sure whether Peter then initially took refuge with the French or English ambassador in Holland (we know it was with the Brits, but with Chesterfield's staff rather than Chesterfield himself), and has him directly interact with the unnamed envoy, but the trajectory of Peter's flight otherwise is correct, as is Peter's later career, and Nicolai says his source's dad knew Peter personally as well. This supposed former comrade of Katte's and friend of Peter's whose son is Nicolai's source is called von Hertefeld.
Aaand then I saw Nicolai has yet another version of the Glasow story in the offering, which is far too good not to give you verbatim, which I shall do in another comment (it's that long).
Nicolai Vol. 6
"Non, mon ami, le tyran demande du sang" - seeing the context in your other comment, i.e. not coming back soon, one could interpret this as him speaking metaphorically, about imprisonment/physical punishment? Possibly?
Re: Nicolai Vol. 6
No, it's a matter of chronological confusion on Selena's part (probably from reading fast). She originally wrote, "I don't think it occured to Katte this early," but then the full translation (thank you!) says:
When Katte was transported to Küstrin
Now, that was November 3. By then, Katte knew he was on his way to his execution, had written his pleas for pardon in vain, and all but the faintest shred of hope was lost. This is the point at which he's giving away all his books. :(
Re: Nicolai Vol. 6
Quantz' direct quote is lovely, particularly the German phrasing.
Isn't it just? Sadly I can't get across the flavour of Mensch in English, since it's man just as if he'd said Mann. Human being sounds clumsily. And "Mensch" in Yiddish means something slightly different. And the passive construction of "mir nötig" also can't be repeated in English.
Nicolai, btw, is a big Quantz admirer, regrets that his work hardly gets played anymore at the time of writing (because musical taste moves on) and defends him against the accusation of his flute pieces being repetitive by saying that many of these were composed explicitly for Fritz who hated completely new stuff, so there had to be something familiar in each one.
See, Fritz, that's why MT and later Joseph get Gluck and later Mozart respectively, aka the musical innovators of the age. His taste in everything really was frozen somewhere in the 1730s.
Re: Nicolai Vol. 6
Nicolai, btw, is a big Quantz admirer, regrets that his work hardly gets played anymore at the time of writing (because musical taste moves on) and defends him against the accusation of his flute pieces being repetitive by saying that many of these were composed explicitly for Fritz who hated completely new stuff, so there had to be something familiar in each one.
Oh wow, that's really interesting actually. I wonder how Quantz felt about that. (Does Nicolai say?)
See, Fritz, that's why MT and later Joseph get Gluck and later Mozart respectively, aka the musical innovators of the age. His taste in everything really was frozen somewhere in the 1730s.
Ha, yeah. I'm imagining ghost!Fritz (maybe mildred's reincarnated Fritz?) visiting the present day and being extremely indignant that it's those young whippersnappers who are remembered... Like so much, you bring it on yourself, Fritz!
Re: Nicolai Vol. 6
No, he doesn't. The entire passage where this is brought up reads: It is not a little task to create that many concerts for a single lover of the art, and even more so for a lover of the art who is King. Therefore, it is a proof of Quantz' richness of musical inspiration. Every single one of these concerts has a unique character; the uniformity lies only those passages where Quantz had to appease the King who did not wish for something completely new.
However, he also adds just a few paragraphs later that Quantz could be a musical dictator in company himself, brooking no opinion but his. So I suspect that if Quantz' style felt outfashioned at the point where Nicolai is writing, it's also due to Quantz himself not wanting to change with the times. Which, fair enough; there aren't many composers who keep open for experimentation in their old age. (Good old Verdi being one; even laywoman me learned that you can tell in "Falstaff" and "Aida" that Wagner happened.)
Re: Nicolai Vol. 6
no subject
Oh, man, that is SO Fritz. That is so very Fritz.
Also, Quanz - whom Nicolai knew, and who is his source for all these stories, once said ruefully about Fritz as a person and why despite their ups and downs he can't bring himself to leave him, that he'd miss him if he left: Ich hätte nicht gedacht,dass mir der Mensch so nötig wäre. ("I wouldn't have thought that I need this man so much.")
Woooow. That is the effect Fritz has on people, no doubt!
mildred_of_midgard, apparently until the early 1790s, the most common spread story about the escape attempt was that Fritz and Katte were both arrested at the same time, at Wesel.
Oooh, I did not know this. Interesting! Given how complicated the actual story is (Fritz in Sinsheim, Keith in Wesel, Katte in Berlin, I can see why it got simplified over time).
and then tells the "you're still here?" story that subsequently is told everywhere else.
Ooh, nice, good to know where that comes from.
Nicolai's version is also the one where Peter gets the "sauvez-vous" warning note from Fritz and therefore hightails it out of Wesel, which was we now doesn't work, date wise.
Not unless my speculation about backdating is true, and that's really extreeeemely speculative. It's possible the Mylius report to FW would also have to contain some falsehoods? Not sure, would have to reread. Ah, yes, Mylius also says Peter left on the 6th.
Unless there is a big successful coverup here, I have to assume Nicolai, Peter Keith's son, Wilhelmine, and Catt are all wrong, and that a story was going around to the effect that Peter was warned. After all, it's possible Fritz did send the letter; it's just that Peter was already gone when he did.
(we know it was with the Brits, but with Chesterfield's staff rather than Chesterfield himself)
We know a lot of oddly specific things in salon! I'm proud of us. :D
Nicolai says his source's dad knew Peter personally as well. This supposed former comrade of Katte's and friend of Peter's whose son is Nicolai's source is called von Hertefeld.
Huh. Cool, will keep an eye out for him. There's a Frau von Hertefeld mentioned in Lehndorff's diary in 1752 (a very sophisticated woman), but that's all my searches of our salon give me. I may do detective work at some point if
...Is it possible Peter told the story this way? To make it look like, "I only left because Fritz said to! To save my life!"
I just checked and Voltaire and Catt diverge in one respect, interestingly: Voltaire has Keith getting arrested and then escaping. I'm betting he's confusing the two brothers (another way in which, if you heard this story orally, you would simplify, because wow this story is so confusing I never understood it fully until we'd been in salon for a some time). It's still just possible Catt has his story from Fritz, who remembered writing the letter to Peter but not the exact date Peter left Wesel.
Sauvez-Vous!
Same here, especially given how much of the retelling must have been by word of mouth, and without any ability to look up sources.
Unless there is a big successful coverup here, I have to assume Nicolai, Peter Keith's son, Wilhelmine, and Catt are all wrong, and that a story was going around to the effect that Peter was warned. After all, it's possible Fritz did send the letter; it's just that Peter was already gone when he did..
The fascinating thing is that they must have at least two different sources.
Nicolai: v. Hertefeld, who has it from his father, who says he has it from Peter.
Keith Jr: Peter (and/or his mother, given he was a boy when Peter died, so possibly like with the Hertefelds a retelling of a retelling.
Wilhelmine: Can't be Peter, certainly not in a document written from 1739 - 1744, thus must be Fritz, possibly also Pöllnitz providing court gossip.
Catt: probably Fritz. Though possibly also other people, see his habit of putting stories into Fritz' mouth he heard elsewhere.
Voltaire: most likely Fritz, possibly also some gossip among his fellow table-rounders, and yes, I'm sure you're right and he's confusing the two Keith brothers recalling the story decades later. (Am also reminded how the "Sachsens Glanz und Preußens Gloria" scriptwriters and/or their nineteenth century Polish novel source simplified their lives by making Katte and both Keith brothers into the same character.)
I don't believe in a massive cover-up for the simple reason that Mylius must know that FW is on his way to Wesel and will be there in furious person, and it's just too risky. What if random soldier X mentions Lieutenant Keith left on a different date?
Is it possible Peter told the story this way? To make it look like, "I only left because Fritz said to! To save my life!"
Very plausible, since he was likely feeling defensive for not having become a dead lion, but that doesn't explain Wilhelmine whom he certainly hasn't talked to at the point of her writing since the late 1720s. (If they talked then at all.)
Current speculation: Fritz did write a note, and since Peter managed to escaped, he naturally assumed this note saved Peter's life, was glad about it, and mentioned this in his own retellings to Wilhelmine etc. By the time Peter returned to Berlin, the story was firmly established, and he was both touched that Fritz wrote to begin with (since that proved at least in the past, Fritz had cared), and wise enough not to contradict the King, especially if he was also feeling defensive due to the implicit Katte comparison everyone must have been making. So he included the note into his own version.
Re: Sauvez-Vous!
Exactly my thinking.
Am also reminded how the "Sachsens Glanz und Preußens Gloria" scriptwriters and/or their nineteenth century Polish novel source simplified their lives by making Katte and both Keith brothers into the same character.
Yep, I was thinking of that too. It's a pretty complex story. (I still want to know where the name Robert for the brother originated.
Keith Jr: Peter (and/or his mother, given he was a boy when Peter died, so possibly like with the Hertefelds a retelling of a retelling.
Agreed, I've always assumed that even if Peter told the story when the kids were young, their actual memories of it (in 1820!) were based on variants they heard later. It's a PITY a certain Academy secretary felt the need to gloss over the account in the memoirs!
Current speculation: Fritz did write a note, and since Peter managed to escaped, he naturally assumed this note saved Peter's life, was glad about it, and mentioned this in his own retellings to Wilhelmine etc.
This has been my theory for a long time (it might even be in the Rheinsberg textual criticism posts), and this...
By the time Peter returned to Berlin, the story was firmly established, and he was both touched that Fritz wrote to begin with (since that proved at least in the past, Fritz had cared), and wise enough not to contradict the King, especially if he was also feeling defensive due to the implicit Katte comparison everyone must have been making. So he included the note into his own version.
...is a perfect explanation for the rest! SOLD. :)
ETA: Fritz did write a note, and since Peter managed to escaped, he naturally assumed this note saved Peter's life, was glad about it, and mentioned this in his own retellings to Wilhelmine etc.
It occurs to me that Fritz might have spent 10 years believing his note saved Peter, telling everyone that, only found out otherwise in 1740 when he went through the archives, and didn't want to change his story.
Speaking of people being only human, I've always assumed that even if Peter was just following Fritz's orders when he deserted, and even if Fritz *didn't* want him executed in addition to, or even instead of, Katte, Fritz would only be human if he had some resentment after hearing about Peter living for ten years in freedom (even with FW after him) while he was put through the Küstrin regimen and Katte was killed. Of course, I think the bigger problem is Fritz drank the Prussian kool-aid in the 1730s, but I think we have to assume everyone resents everyone at least a little in this story. :(
Re: Sauvez-Vous!
It's a pity we don't have the memoirs themselves. Along with a print out of AW's account of his youthful life. :)
It occurs to me that Fritz might have spent 10 years believing his note saved Peter, telling everyone that, only found out otherwise in 1740 when he went through the archives, and didn't want to change his story.
Two words: Quintus Icilius.
I think we have to assume everyone resents everyone at least a little in this story.
Well, yes. Which is why I nominated them at [Bad username or unknown identity: unsent letters]; letters are good for venting. :) More seriously, it must have been extra hard on them because having mixed feelings about a loved one was so not the done thing in this era. It's funny if it's contemporaries wondering how Voltaire and Fritz can cure and praise each other within two breaths, but it's heartbreaking if it's Fritz and Wilhelmine, or Fritz and Peter Keith, unable to to admit that they have these particular resentments. (I think that's why Wilhelmine pounces so on the "he doesn't love me anymore!" theory in her memoirs. That, she can complain about. "I resent that he was able to leave me in hell with Mom and Dad", otoh? Not so much. And Fritz can complain about Erlangen journalists, Austrian marriages for female Marwitzes and lunch with MT, but he can't say "you should have supported my wish to escape, you who knew better than anyone how terrible every day there was for me". As for Peter, he has the additional problem that he's a subject and Fritz is a King and he can't say anything to anyone other than his wife without having to be aware it could get back to Fritz sooner or later.
And poor Katte is dead, so he can't resent or not resent anyone, and while he was alive he evidently tried to repress resentment sensations by falling back on the faith of his childhood and by telling himself at least Fritz would live. But if FW hadn't intervened and he had spent those ten years in prison, well....
Re: Sauvez-Vous!
Well, yes! But the second one we still might get someday, and the first one is presumably lost forever...but Formey's work survives and the author made a choice for which I reserve the right to hold a grudge!
So one thing that occurs to me is that I've been assuming Peter's memoirs disappeared before 1820 and the son didn't have access to them. I *think* Koser also comments that this letter is not worth anything as evidence, and I suspect he's thinking primarily of the "Sauvez-vous" part, since he calls that out in his text as a oft-repeated historical impossibility. Yeah, he calls it "unerheblich"--insignificant, unimportant.
But...what if Peter stuck to the "Sauvez-vous" story even in his memoirs?
Oh, no, wait, son says Peter was warned that Fritz had been arrested, nothing about a note from Fritz. That's also the story in Wilhelmine: specifically that a page from the house of Anhalt (wonder where she got that detail) warned Peter. Nothing about a note. Hmm. Fritz warning Peter is in Nicolai (via Hertefeld) and Catt (via who knows).
So you know what I'm thinking? I'm thinking we have another simplification here. See, after Peter spent several days in the Hague, someone must have warned him that FW was after him, and that was when he fled to Chesterfield's house. Yeah, Seckendorff, writing August 30, says Peter first went to the guy who used to be an envoy to Berlin (someone Peter presumably knew when the guy was stationed in Berlin), and then Peter got a report that the Prussians were after him, and then he fled to Chesterfield. And I think Wilhelmine and the son are conflating that story with his escape from Wesel, and having him go straight from Wesel to Chesterfield.
So possibly the memoirs are still lost by 1820, but there is a story going around, possibly put forth by Peter himself, according to which Peter left Prussia only because he was warned that someone was after him. And his son and Wilhelmine might have conflated the two escapes (interestingly, she doesn't mention her brother's role in warning him, suggesting that maybe he *didn't* tell her this story after all, and thus maybe not Catt).
Btw, Wilhelmine has Peter pretending to go after a deserter; the son has him trying out his new horse. Nicolai's story of a leisurely ride matches Peter's son's more closely, so maybe that was the story Peter told, and Wilhelmine misremembered or got a slightly different variant.
Okay, so I had been wondering when Seckendorff reports Peter missing. On August 14, Seckendorf's in Wesel with FW, and he has a several-page write-up in Forster (volume 3. starting on page 1) that I don't have time to plod through, but he mentions "Katt und Keith" as accomplices, and says--and this is odd--that of the "letzteren" know one knows anything about where he might be, but the "der erste" has gone to Nijmegen and Colonel Moulin has been sent after him to try to arrest him. Now Wilhelmine, Peter's son, *and* the official Mylius report to FW during the trial (the most reliable of all sources) all say Moulin went after Peter in the Hague, thus causing him to flee to Chesterfield. And Nijmegen is just across the Dutch border from Wesel (man, I am learning so much geography in this fandom). So Seckendorff must be swapping Katt and Keith (and remember,
So I still don't know where Wilhelmine and Catt got their stories, but while they agree on Peter being warned, they don't agree on Fritz warning him; that's Nicolai and Catt.
Two words: Quintus Icilius.
I died.
Well, yes. Which is why I nominated them at [Bad username or unknown identity: unsent letters]; letters are good for venting. :)
Indeed, and I'm sorry no one is in a position to join you and request them! What can I say, we can't keep up with you. ;)
It's funny if it's contemporaries wondering how Voltaire and Fritz can cure and praise each other within two breaths, but it's heartbreaking if it's Fritz and Wilhelmine, or Fritz and Peter Keith, unable to to admit that they have these particular resentments.
I knooooow.
while he was alive he evidently tried to repress resentment sensations by falling back on the faith of his childhood
Yeah, it's so clear from the write-up that he's clinging to religion as a way of managing his emotions (fear as much as resentment) that even when I was headcanoning it as a display for FW's benefit, I was assuming he was getting *some* emotional comfort from it. Even if just the hymn-singing and something to focus on that wasn't imminent death.
But if FW hadn't intervened and he had spent those ten years in prison, well....
Yeeahh. Especially if he then ends up with a guilt-ridden and Kool-aid-drinking Fritz who is not at all what he expected, and is also more traumatized than an equally traumatized Katte is equipped to deal with.
FIX-IT FOR EVERYONE.
Re: Sauvez-Vous!
Having gone through Seckendorf's report, I'm thinking you're right. Also, the fact that Peter took the time to have lunch or dinner with Keppel (the former Dutch resident in Berlin, who, however, seems to have been a Prussian citizen*, since Seckendorff mentions later FW is pissed off with "General Keppel for aiding Keith") would indicate he's at this point not yet aware that FW is after him and he has to fear for his life.
*Like Stratemann was actually a Prussian citizen but appointed envoy by the Duke of Braunschweig nonetheless.
I'm curious what you make of other details Hertefeld-via-Nicolai gives for the escape plan, but I'll fait for your comment on this before I ask.
Re: Sauvez-Vous!
Re: Sauvez-Vous!
That makes a lot of sense about Fritz and Wilhelmine :(
no subject
You called? ;) I think I have indeed identified him and will post what I've found in a bit.
no subject
Hertefelds
Ludwig Casimir was born in 1709 and joined the Gensdarmes regiment in 1728, so he was a regimental comrade of Hans Hermann von Katte for two more years. In 1743, after having participated in the First Silesian War, he resigned from the service. Again seven years later, in 1750, he became chamberlain to the widowed Queen Sophie Dorothee, mother of Frederick the Great, and remained in this position until her death in 1757.
Fontane also says he was into books and built a library building on his Liebenberg estate. He went back to Boetzlaer (near Xanten and Kleve) in 1777 and died in 1790.
So I strongly suspect that he got to know Peter while he was chamberlain for SD.
Lehndorff by the way? Not impressed:
April 15th, 1753. I get up at three to go to Potsdam; a journey I would dislike if I wouldn't find my dear Prince Heinrich there. My travelling companion is Herr v. Hertefeld, chamberlain of the queen-mother, a very unpleasant man and a babbler ["Schwätzer"] like a woman.
and:
April 4th, 1756. [...] He is a guy who is judged unfavourably by people. He left service during the war und spent six years living quietly on his estate. Finally the queen-mother chose him for chamberlain on recommendation of Chancellor [Cocceji]'s wife, who is his wife's sister, an excellent, witty, and amiable woman, only her voice has something from a dragoon.
Von Hertefeld's wife = Susanne von Bechefer (see this wiki article about v. Hertefeld's father Samuel, who himself held a couple of positions during FW's time).
I think Lehndorff is still talking about Cocceji's wife with his description, it's a bit ambiguous even in German, but he definitely likes v. Hertefeld's wife a lot more than the guy, see also this entry from September the same year: Hertefeld with his special gift to bore his listeners only likes those who have the patience to listen to him. and again in December: the man is as unpleasant as his wife is the opposite. One of their daughters seems to have been lady-in-waiting with EC, Lehndorff mentions her quite a lot.
Fontane says that's the only daughter they had, so I'm not sure how and if they are also related to the young lady who was with Amalie and died young of tuberculosis, which apparently inspired Fritz to write a poem to Amalie in 1770. ETA: Oh, I just realized that Fontane said they only had one daughter by the time Luwdig Casimir died, so I guess the woman who died in 1770 might have been his daughter as well.Lehndorff also lists v. Hertefeld as one of the guys who carried AW's coffin.
Re: Hertefelds
Lehndorff by the way? Not impressed:
LOL. I must admit, it never fails to amuse me that there are two things you can rely on when reading Lehndorff:
a) sooner or later, Heinrich will be mentioned, and
b) If Lehndorff comes into contact with someone who theoretically could tell him interesting stories about Hans Herrmann von Katte, he will dislike this person.
I mean:
- cousin Ludolf: terrible husband to The One Who Got Away
- cousin Wartensleben: miser, sugar hoarder, pouncer on chambermaids when younger and spy when old
- Staatsminister von Katte: boo, hiss, evil redhead
- and now: Hertefeld, former regiment comrade, experienced the arrest first hand, has books from Katte: what a bore!
It's as if he's postumously determined to frustrate Mildred, verily. Lehndorff being Team Keith all the way might make up for it, though?
Re: Hertefelds
Love your take-away from the Lehndorff quotes, hee.
Re: Hertefelds
- cousin Ludolf: terrible husband to The One Who Got Away
I mean, judging by your Wust historian, he apparently was! In that she left Wust as soon as he died, took the remaining kid(s), and never looked back.
- cousin Wartensleben: miser, sugar hoarder, pouncer on chambermaids when younger and spy when old
Nitpick: this is another cousin-aged uncle, 3 years younger than Katte. Grandpa Wartensleben was *really* of the "go forth and multiply" persuasion, with 13 kids who made it to adulthood, with a 32-year spread between the first and last. Thus brother to the 6 most loved guy who was on the Strasbourg trip and a suspect for a Manteuffel informer.
It's as if he's postumously determined to frustrate Mildred, verily.
LEHNDORFF!! *shakes fist*
More seriously, I laughed when I read this. Admittedly I was a little distracted from reading on my phone while multitasking at work, but I hadn't actually noticed that this pattern was striking again! I'm touched that you were so alert on my behalf. ;)
Lehndorff being Team Keith all the way might make up for it, though?
You know, it kinda does. We know increasingly more and more about Katte (thanks largely to you!) and very little about Keith, and it *is* good to have Lehndorff's input. Especially the part about Keith being a Lehndorff's idea of a role model for young people; that means something coming from Lehndorff in his diary in a way that Formey's encomia don't.
So I am grateful for Lehndorff's different perspective.
Still! Lehndorff, it's possible to be Team Katte and Team Keith; look at me! (I even got Mobster AU author to ship them for me!)
Re: Hertefelds
So I strongly suspect that he got to know Peter while he was chamberlain for SD.
Agreed, and in 1750, Hanway says Fritz put Peter near the Queen Mother when he returned to Berlin (I suspect his Hofstallmeister position was at her court). Even if ten years later, he's not any more because he has other duties, that might still have been something that led to them having many contacts in common and getting to know each other, added to liking books and having 1730 in common (if from opposite sides, as it were).
Peter getting to know someone who was friends with Katte and who was responsible for guarding him under arrest...that must have been a trip akin to Fritz reading the archives.
Do we know if Hertefeld was an Academy member? That was one of the things I was going to look into if I had time.
Re: Hertefelds
Re: Hertefelds
Re: Hertefelds
Hertefeld with his special gift to bore his listeners only likes those who have the patience to listen to him.
Heh! Lehndorff can certainly paint a word-portrait in a sentence :)
That poem is pretty long :P And I didn't read it carefully (and stuck it into google translate, because I am way too short on time this week :( ) but although it could certainly be a lot worse (*cough*Heinrich *cough*EC) I still feel like Fritz could use a refresher on the ring theory of grief, and find myself wondering how Amalie took it...
no subject