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Frederick the Great, Discussion Post 22 (or: Yuletide 2020 edition)
ETA: Whoops, I missed my cue -- this might as well be the next discussion post, I guess! :)
This is about the fic I didn't author (I have another reveals post for the fics I did author).
So my goal this Yuletide was NOT to write any historical fandom (because hard!) and just enjoy the excellent stuff that other people wrote. And... that sort of happened? I didn't end up authoring anything history-intensive? Buuuuut I ended up spending a lot more time than I did on any of my own fics working with![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
mildred_of_midgard on her fic, which she was worried about being able to pull off because she had had this completely insane idea to write a long casefic about Frederick the Great that every time I turned around had another twist put in :P :) She supplied me with what we called a "rough opal in matrix" bus pass casefic, and I cut away the matrix that remained and in some cases carved the opal -- that is to say, writing additional text for some of the scenes, what we liked to call "putting in feels," and in at least two cases entirely rewriting and/or restructuring the scene she'd written. She didn't always keep what I wrote (which we'd agreed upon in the beginning), but when she did (which was most of the time :) ) she then went in and rewrote/restructured what I put in to wordsmith (some of the words I gave her were really rough) and match her style, adding even more scenes -- that is, polishing it up and adding some gold and diamonds -- and voila, a beautiful pendant, I mean, story :)
I'm really proud of it and also it was really fun and also what I could handle this year, especially because mildred did all the parts I thought were hard and also wrote all the parts involving actual history or subtle AU before I was brought in so I didn't actually have to know historical stuff (though I guess I will never forget the battle of Leuthen now), and took full responsibility for how the whole thing turned out, so all I had to do was be like "Here, I'll write some rough feels for you for this scene!" The funny part was that I would often then write a paragraph justifying why I *had* to write the scene the way I did, and more likely than not mildred would be like, "yeah, I was sure you would do that, of course it should be written like that." (The most glaring example of this was where I inserted the Letter of Doom at the climax. I was worried there was some reason she didn't want it there, but she said, no, she just didn't have time to put it in herself and was just trusting me to do that :) ) She started jokingly calling me her "other self," to which I replied that it was with 1000% less angst and frustration -- as Frederick the Great's brother was his "other self" (which actually comes up in the fic) that he could trust to do all kinds of competent things, but they had a relationship that was, um, fraught? radioactive? Whereas this was just fun :)
Mildred did so much more than I did (we estimated a 90%/10% word ratio, not even counting the part where she wordsmithed a lot of my text) that I felt very uncomfortable being listed as a co-author, but hey, ~3000 words is a respectable Yuletide fic length :)
Yet They Grind Exceedingly Small (30384 words) by mildred_of_midgard
Chapters: 5/5
Fandom: 18th Century CE RPF, Historical RPF
Rating: Teen And Up Audiences
Warnings: Major Character Death
Relationships: Anna Amalie von Preußen & Wilhelmine von Preußen, Anna Amalie von Preußen & Friedrich Heinrich Ludwig von Preußen, Wilhelmine von Preußen & Elisabeth Friederike Sophie von Brandenburg-Bayreuth, Friedrich II von Preußen | Frederick the Great & Wilhelmine von Preußen | Wilhelmine of Prussia
Characters: Anna Amalie von Preußen (1723-1787), Wilhelmine von Preußen | Wilhelmine of Prussia (1709-1758), Friedrich Heinrich Ludwig von Preußen | Henry of Prussia (1726-1802), Elisabeth Friederike Sophie von Brandenburg-Bayreuth (1732-1780), Wilhelmine von Hesse-Kassel (1726-1808), August Wilhelm von Preußen | Augustus William of Prussia (1722-1758), Alcmene 1 | Frederick the Great's Italian Greyhound, Voltaire (Writer), Friedrich II von Preußen | Frederick the Great
Additional Tags: Alternate Universe - Canon Divergence, Dysfunctional Family, Suicide, Alternate Universe - Dark, Siblings, Canon-Typical Violence, Mystery, Tide of History Challenge
Summary:
This is about the fic I didn't author (I have another reveals post for the fics I did author).
So my goal this Yuletide was NOT to write any historical fandom (because hard!) and just enjoy the excellent stuff that other people wrote. And... that sort of happened? I didn't end up authoring anything history-intensive? Buuuuut I ended up spending a lot more time than I did on any of my own fics working with
mildred_of_midgard on her fic, which she was worried about being able to pull off because she had had this completely insane idea to write a long casefic about Frederick the Great that every time I turned around had another twist put in :P :) She supplied me with what we called a "rough opal in matrix" bus pass casefic, and I cut away the matrix that remained and in some cases carved the opal -- that is to say, writing additional text for some of the scenes, what we liked to call "putting in feels," and in at least two cases entirely rewriting and/or restructuring the scene she'd written. She didn't always keep what I wrote (which we'd agreed upon in the beginning), but when she did (which was most of the time :) ) she then went in and rewrote/restructured what I put in to wordsmith (some of the words I gave her were really rough) and match her style, adding even more scenes -- that is, polishing it up and adding some gold and diamonds -- and voila, a beautiful pendant, I mean, story :)I'm really proud of it and also it was really fun and also what I could handle this year, especially because mildred did all the parts I thought were hard and also wrote all the parts involving actual history or subtle AU before I was brought in so I didn't actually have to know historical stuff (though I guess I will never forget the battle of Leuthen now), and took full responsibility for how the whole thing turned out, so all I had to do was be like "Here, I'll write some rough feels for you for this scene!" The funny part was that I would often then write a paragraph justifying why I *had* to write the scene the way I did, and more likely than not mildred would be like, "yeah, I was sure you would do that, of course it should be written like that." (The most glaring example of this was where I inserted the Letter of Doom at the climax. I was worried there was some reason she didn't want it there, but she said, no, she just didn't have time to put it in herself and was just trusting me to do that :) ) She started jokingly calling me her "other self," to which I replied that it was with 1000% less angst and frustration -- as Frederick the Great's brother was his "other self" (which actually comes up in the fic) that he could trust to do all kinds of competent things, but they had a relationship that was, um, fraught? radioactive? Whereas this was just fun :)
Mildred did so much more than I did (we estimated a 90%/10% word ratio, not even counting the part where she wordsmithed a lot of my text) that I felt very uncomfortable being listed as a co-author, but hey, ~3000 words is a respectable Yuletide fic length :)
Yet They Grind Exceedingly Small (30384 words) by mildred_of_midgard
Chapters: 5/5
Fandom: 18th Century CE RPF, Historical RPF
Rating: Teen And Up Audiences
Warnings: Major Character Death
Relationships: Anna Amalie von Preußen & Wilhelmine von Preußen, Anna Amalie von Preußen & Friedrich Heinrich Ludwig von Preußen, Wilhelmine von Preußen & Elisabeth Friederike Sophie von Brandenburg-Bayreuth, Friedrich II von Preußen | Frederick the Great & Wilhelmine von Preußen | Wilhelmine of Prussia
Characters: Anna Amalie von Preußen (1723-1787), Wilhelmine von Preußen | Wilhelmine of Prussia (1709-1758), Friedrich Heinrich Ludwig von Preußen | Henry of Prussia (1726-1802), Elisabeth Friederike Sophie von Brandenburg-Bayreuth (1732-1780), Wilhelmine von Hesse-Kassel (1726-1808), August Wilhelm von Preußen | Augustus William of Prussia (1722-1758), Alcmene 1 | Frederick the Great's Italian Greyhound, Voltaire (Writer), Friedrich II von Preußen | Frederick the Great
Additional Tags: Alternate Universe - Canon Divergence, Dysfunctional Family, Suicide, Alternate Universe - Dark, Siblings, Canon-Typical Violence, Mystery, Tide of History Challenge
Summary:
January 1758. Prince William is dead, some say of a broken heart. Frederick wants to absolve himself of blame for William's death. Henry schemes to end the Third Silesian War on his terms. Amalie and Wilhelmine team up to find out what really happened to their brother. Alcmene just wants to be told she's a good dog.
Re: The Adventure of the Time-Traveling Valet - and Heinrich/Grind
Re: The Adventure of the Time-Traveling Valet - and Heinrich/Grind
It's been too long since I read this: how much does the ghost have to talk vs. just squire him around? Can one of his dogs be the ghost of Christmas present?
Victorious Napoleon visiting Fritz' tomb - the one Fritz didn't want to lie in, next to Dad in a church! - is a sight sure to shock Fritz the way his tomb shocked Scrooge!
OMG yes. I'm torn between whether this makes Fritz realize the moral of the story is to be *nicer* to his nephew, versus confirming him in this belief that his nephew is The Worst. I mean, realistically the latter, 100%, but we *are* talking A Christmas Carol remake here...
that portrait of hers which Fritz kept in his study is going to talk to him.
I like it!
Re: The Adventure of the Time-Traveling Valet - and Heinrich/Grind
It's been eons since I've read it, too, but I just looked it up, and the ghost just has to identify himself as what he is. Which presumably the dog could do as Fritz has gotten good at reading his dogs. :) (Also he or rather she could wear a knitted cheery Christmas outfit!)
I'm torn between whether this makes Fritz realize the moral of the story is to be *nicer* to his nephew, versus confirming him in this belief that his nephew is The Worst. I mean, realistically the latter, 100%, but we *are* talking A Christmas Carol remake here...
Well, there's that. :) Btw, what would be the worse shock in your opinion - finding his tomb to be sans dogs and with Dad in a church, or seeing a victorious French guy who's stolen his thunder as the biggest event in 18th century military matters and beaten Prussia stroll around there? (True, he might be mollified by Napoleon's admiring tribute to him on the later count, but he wouldn't be able to hear that for the vision to work as intended.) (BTW, FW2 was already dead by then as well, so can't be blamed for the Prussian defeat.)
Fritz: But Heinrich's ex Kalckreuth was alive and one of the generals involved! Heinrich's terrible taste in boyfriends: proven once again.
Re: The Adventure of the Time-Traveling Valet - and Heinrich/Grind
Okay, yes, that's what I was thinking.
Which presumably the dog could do as Fritz has gotten good at reading his dogs. :)
Plus it helps that this isn't the first ghost, so he's at least got some context.
(Also he or rather she could wear a knitted cheery Christmas outfit!)
OMG, a dog in an 18th century Christmas sweater equivalent, that's HILARIOUS. :D
Fritz: I care about keeping my dogs warm! See also the last order I ever gave.
Btw, what would be the worse shock in your opinion - finding his tomb to be sans dogs and with Dad in a church, or seeing a victorious French guy who's stolen his thunder as the biggest event in 18th century military matters and beaten Prussia stroll around there?
Ooof. Probably the second one? He would be unhappy about the burial thing, but he didn't believe in an immortal soul, and part of the whole plan for a simple burial was "I have lived like a philosopher and I wish to be buried like a philosopher." So I think he would recognize it was more symbolic than actually significant. Not that he wouldn't be pissed off!
On the other hand. No, wait, I changed my mind. Fritz would have total schadenfreude over Prussia's defeat after his death. This is the guy who cared far more about outshining his predecessors and successors than about preparing FW2 for the sake of Prussia.
...This whole thing is just going to confirm in Fritz's mind that FW2 was the worst, and clearly FW3 (who was king during and for the decade leading up to the great defeat) was also unworthy, and only Fritz was right and should be in control of all the things.
And yes, I think Fritz would find a way to give FW2 50% of the blame for the defeat, for laying the groundwork by undoing all of Fritz's hard work. This is Fritz we're talking about. Remember, he "could complain in some regards about [Katte], and I do not believe to have wronged him," and I have an unsourced quote from a fairly reliable secondary source in which Fritz calls Katte "maladroit", presumably for screwing up the escape attempt.
And even if he left FW2 out of it, it's going to be super easy to blame FW3 and reinforce Fritz's conviction that he's always right.
Honestly, I really have a hard time seeing any of these visions convince Fritz to do anything but double down on being an autocrat. Doubling down was Fritz's specialty. The only thing I can think of that *might* work as a wake-up call a la Ebenezer Scrooge is first reminding Fritz of his "Sterbekittel" days, and then showing him the Holocaust, Nazi propaganda in his name, and how he got cancelled after 1945, before gradually being partially rehabilitated. (You could make a case for the Crown Prince days being the past, the wars he led as King being the present (even if chronologically some decades ago), and the 20th century being the future.)
And I don't know if you would feel up to writing that story and handling it sensitively, but it would definitely be tricky. Not that me finding a story beyond my skills has ever stopped you, O Great Author of our fandom. :)
Re: The Adventure of the Time-Traveling Valet - and Heinrich/Grind
However, on a more serious note I agree the shock of Nazi propaganda and the Holocaust would do it. If you want to have a look at how Nazi propaganda using Fritz looked like, check out this scene of a vile example in question if you can bear to. It's from Der Große König, aka the "keep fighting, Germans, never mind that setback in Russia!" propaganda film, directed by Veit Harlan, who was a very efficient director for melodrama who also had started a second line in propaganda movies. (Jud Süß was the other.) Harlan had good actors at his disposal (including Otto Gebühr, who was the most popular Fritz actor of his day and had been since Weimar Republic movies made him loved in the role), and the whole thing is effective propaganda because it does use just enough recognizable historical elements to work on people vaguely remembering their school lessons while at the same time utterly distorting them. The scene in question, which is set post-Kunersdorf, goes roughly thusly:
Heinrich: ...we're fighting other Germans here. Do you really want the HRE to go?
Fritz: The HRE is a bankrupt institution which has to go. I'm all for German unity, but the Habsburgs have lost their right to lead it by promoting "many blooded" people in their empire along with Germans. It's a shame we've got to fight other Germans in order that a future Empire led by Germans can be founded, but historical destiny must unfold. BTW, you're now an ex Generalissimus, I'm taking command back. Shame we don't get along better, Heinrich.
Heinrich: Is if you'd ever had fraternal feelings in your life. ("Wann hätten Sie je brüderliche Gefühle gehabt" isn't paraphrase but a direct quote.
Fritz: *burns last will*: If I'd died at Kunersdorf, this document would have made you regent, I'd have entrusted it all to you. Good thing I didn't.
Heinrich *looking at the burning document*: You'd known all about shoving a brother aside and destroying him.
Fritz: I am A Great Man Of History, and you're those elements in the army who dare to doubt Great Men And Their Strategies. Watch me chew out my other generals next.
Generals: Your Majesty, we're screwed and should sue for peace.
Fritz: *asks all the famous generals, from Seydlitz to Ziethen, and not one is ready to side with him on continuing the fight*
Fritz: You're all wrong, and I'm right. We'll fight on. History will prove me right.
The Worst Fanboys, Watching: Harry Truman is totally going to write that fanboy letter any time now...
Re: The Adventure of the Time-Traveling Valet - and Heinrich/Grind
Haha, okay, that I could see! That would be awesome: Fritz being "nice" canonically and not involving a 180 from his normal personality.
Was totally thinking of Otto Gebühr and Stalingrad, yes. Ugh. Fucking worst fanboys. I endorse your crackfic idea!
Fritz, FW2, and A Christmas Carol
Uh huh. I don't think Fritz is upset enough about Jena-Auerstedt to reverse his treatment of FW2.
Also, in pasting your summary of FW2 to Rheinsberg this morning, I was reminded that you'd commented on the difference in the English and German wiki treatments of FW2. Did you notice the banner on the English one reading, "This article may require cleanup to meet Wikipedia's quality standards. The specific problem is: tendentious bias towards militaristic evaluation of frederick william"?
Fritz: That's my tendentious bias, thank you very much. Can I interest you in my opinion on my no-good, money-wasting, flute-playing grandfather?
Re: Fritz, FW2, and A Christmas Carol
BTW, while Voltaire writing to Madame Denis he's got a soft spot for Fritz' badmouthed Granddad while proofreading the Histoire de la Maison de Brandenburg is inevitably one of the doctored 1750 - 1753 letters, I can't see any advantage in him inventing that observation post facto, so I'm guessing that observation was one he actually made back in the day. And I do wonder how Fritz reacted...
Re: The Adventure of the Time-Traveling Valet - and Heinrich/Grind
Der Große König: wow and :( I can see how this could have been effective propaganda :(