Lehndorff is definitely next on the list, after Wilhelmine, and Krockow at the same time. Possibly some Horowski, depending on how things are going. Then MT. So hopefully by then I'll be ready, because academic German is exactly what I need to learn to read!
(My short-term motivation for learning German is of course Fritz and Katte, the reason I'm buckling down is that my long-term motivation is to be able to read academic German when I want to. I'll never have this much short-term motivation again, so if I ever want to be able to develop my German skills to where they should have been when I finished grad school, I have to do it now.)
Wilhelmine: now I'm curious (being familiar only with the German version, of course). We've already seen the English versions censored the Dresden visit in part 1 and SD & Charlotte talking of fistula in EC's anus in part 2- can you tell me another especially notabl example of English bowlederizatiaon?
Well, there's two kinds of bowdlerization that I'm seeing: one where it's really obviously prudishness at work, and one where I'm not really sure what's going on.
So, like, when the Emperor and Empress visit the baths because they only have living daughters and they're hoping for an improvement in her fertility for the sake of an heir, our English translator just says, "They visited the baths! Because of reasons." Literally,
The emperor and empress visited Carlsbad at this time, to take the benefit of the baths and mineral waters.
Whereas the German, page 267 in the Kindle copy, has
Der Kaiser und die Kaiserin begaben sich ungefähr um diese Zeit nach Karlsbad, um dort eine Bade- und Trinkkur zu gebrauchen. Sie hatten nur drei Prinzessinnen; der Erzherzog war im Jahre 1716 gestorben. Man hoffte, daß die Bäder, die als der Fruchtbarkeit sehr zuträglich galten, der Kaiserin zu einem Erzherzog verhelfen und so der Wunsch des gesamten Reiches sich erfüllen würde.
But then there's Wilhelmine's lying-in. And I get that references to her pregnancy have to be cut. But if
Wir schrieben Ende Juni, und im August sollte ich niederkommen.
can be translated
It was now the end of June. I reckoned upon being brought to bed in the month of August.
Then I don't see why everything from Da ich am Ende des Monats niederkommen sollte und wir den siebenten hatten, meinte der König, es sei nun so weit,Er fand mich sehr elend und verabreichte mir fürs erste eine Dosis seiner wunderbaren Pillen, has to be cut. Then, just to show you how aggressive the cutting is, the entire love affair between Grumbkow's niece? and Wilhelmine's brother-in-law is cut on page 279, everything between Der Hof von Ansbach hielt sich noch einige Tage länger bei uns auf and Durch die Abreise des Ansbachschen Hofes wurde diese Sorge wieder von mir genommen, inclusive.
But okay, one is medical and one is a love affair. But what I really don't understand is cutting everything between Der Markgraf mit dem Prinzen, seinem Bruder, nahmen tags darauf Abschied von mir, da sie nach Himmelkron gehen wollten" and Ew. Königliche Hoheit ihm einen Boten senden, muß man sich nach ihm richten.«, inclusive, and then everything between Herr von Voigt machte sich alsbald auf den Weg nach Berlin; and Er war mit der Zusammenstellung sehr zufrieden, und einen Augenblick später verließ er mich on page 283.
That last bit means that you lose Wilhelmine telling her father-in-law she may never see him again, the drama around him wanting to be informed by cannon shots instead of reports, and then the part where that goes wrong because the winds are contrary and the cannons are misplaced, and then he's upset about not finding out, then the part where the baby has to be baptized on the third day, and Wilhelmine picking the godparents.
I mean, there are two references to "Niederkunft," lying in, just as a marker of time, but since we've already seen that translated as "brought to bed," I don't see why we had to lose almost 4 pages because of it, including the decision of which family members got to be godparents.
???
You can look up the full passages, or I can copy-paste them if you want, and tell me if you see why all that was cut, but it seems a bit extreme to me. Love affair, okay; announcing the birth of a child--okay?; baptism and godparents--what?
(Also: does this mean 19th century Germans were less censorious than 19th century Brits and Amerians?
Evidently, but let's not forget why I'm reading the German: because neither the English nor the French edition I was looking at had the fistulas, and you told me the German did. Looking more closely, this 1810 French edition was published in Brunswick, and omits the *entire* trash-talking scene of EC, including the foolish laugh and the "only says yes or no." Brunswick honor at stake here!
So everyone cuts something different, I guess. :D
Btw, cahn, I did find a French version with fistulas, so when we go to tackle it in French, we should be good. :)
Given which nation had to deal with state censorship and which one prides itself on free speech, I find that, shall we say, iiiinnteresting.
Well, I would argue that social customs regarding bodily functions and and political freedom of speech are two totally different things. I'm much more ready to tell you my unfavorable opinions about my current president than about my bowel movements, and that bit of self-censorship has nothing to do with my first amendment rights. ;)
ETA: I forgot to mention, one key scene that got cut from the English translation of Wilhelmine's memoirs that I wanted to share was the one where she gets accused by her father-in-law of faking her pregnancy. Because not marrying into the Hannovers is no guarantee you'll be spared this fate.
At least her husband didn't drag her by carriage to another palace while she was in labor?
Wilhelmine bowdlerization
(My short-term motivation for learning German is of course Fritz
and Katte, the reason I'm buckling down is that my long-term motivation is to be able to read academic German when I want to. I'll never have this much short-term motivation again, so if I ever want to be able to develop my German skills to where they should have been when I finished grad school, I have to do it now.)Wilhelmine: now I'm curious (being familiar only with the German version, of course). We've already seen the English versions censored the Dresden visit in part 1 and SD & Charlotte talking of fistula in EC's anus in part 2- can you tell me another especially notabl example of English bowlederizatiaon?
Well, there's two kinds of bowdlerization that I'm seeing: one where it's really obviously prudishness at work, and one where I'm not really sure what's going on.
So, like, when the Emperor and Empress visit the baths because they only have living daughters and they're hoping for an improvement in her fertility for the sake of an heir, our English translator just says, "They visited the baths! Because of reasons." Literally,
The emperor and empress visited Carlsbad at this time, to take the benefit of the baths and mineral waters.
Whereas the German, page 267 in the Kindle copy, has
Der Kaiser und die Kaiserin begaben sich ungefähr um diese Zeit nach Karlsbad, um dort eine Bade- und Trinkkur zu gebrauchen. Sie hatten nur drei Prinzessinnen; der Erzherzog war im Jahre 1716 gestorben. Man hoffte, daß die Bäder, die als der Fruchtbarkeit sehr zuträglich galten, der Kaiserin zu einem Erzherzog verhelfen und so der Wunsch des gesamten Reiches sich erfüllen würde.
But then there's Wilhelmine's lying-in. And I get that references to her pregnancy have to be cut. But if
Wir schrieben Ende Juni, und im August sollte ich niederkommen.
can be translated
It was now the end of June. I reckoned upon being brought to bed in the month of August.
Then I don't see why everything from Da ich am Ende des Monats niederkommen sollte und wir den siebenten hatten, meinte der König, es sei nun so weit,Er fand mich sehr elend und verabreichte mir fürs erste eine Dosis seiner wunderbaren Pillen, has to be cut. Then, just to show you how aggressive the cutting is, the entire love affair between Grumbkow's niece? and Wilhelmine's brother-in-law is cut on page 279, everything between Der Hof von Ansbach hielt sich noch einige Tage länger bei uns auf and Durch die Abreise des Ansbachschen Hofes wurde diese Sorge wieder von mir genommen, inclusive.
But okay, one is medical and one is a love affair. But what I really don't understand is cutting everything between Der Markgraf mit dem Prinzen, seinem Bruder, nahmen tags darauf Abschied von mir, da sie nach Himmelkron gehen wollten" and Ew. Königliche Hoheit ihm einen Boten senden, muß man sich nach ihm richten.«, inclusive, and then everything between Herr von Voigt machte sich alsbald auf den Weg nach Berlin; and Er war mit der Zusammenstellung sehr zufrieden, und einen Augenblick später verließ er mich on page 283.
That last bit means that you lose Wilhelmine telling her father-in-law she may never see him again, the drama around him wanting to be informed by cannon shots instead of reports, and then the part where that goes wrong because the winds are contrary and the cannons are misplaced, and then he's upset about not finding out, then the part where the baby has to be baptized on the third day, and Wilhelmine picking the godparents.
I mean, there are two references to "Niederkunft," lying in, just as a marker of time, but since we've already seen that translated as "brought to bed," I don't see why we had to lose almost 4 pages because of it, including the decision of which family members got to be godparents.
???
You can look up the full passages, or I can copy-paste them if you want, and tell me if you see why all that was cut, but it seems a bit extreme to me. Love affair, okay; announcing the birth of a child--okay?; baptism and godparents--what?
(Also: does this mean 19th century Germans were less censorious than 19th century Brits and Amerians?
Evidently, but let's not forget why I'm reading the German: because neither the English nor the French edition I was looking at had the fistulas, and you told me the German did. Looking more closely, this 1810 French edition was published in Brunswick, and omits the *entire* trash-talking scene of EC, including the foolish laugh and the "only says yes or no." Brunswick honor at stake here!
So everyone cuts something different, I guess. :D
Btw,
Given which nation had to deal with state censorship and which one prides itself on free speech, I find that, shall we say, iiiinnteresting.
Well, I would argue that social customs regarding bodily functions and and political freedom of speech are two totally different things. I'm much more ready to tell you my unfavorable opinions about my current president than about my bowel movements, and that bit of self-censorship has nothing to do with my first amendment rights. ;)
ETA: I forgot to mention, one key scene that got cut from the English translation of Wilhelmine's memoirs that I wanted to share was the one where she gets accused by her father-in-law of faking her pregnancy. Because not marrying into the Hannovers is no guarantee you'll be spared this fate.
At least her husband didn't drag her by carriage to another palace while she was in labor?