Frederick the Great discussion post 12

[cahn]

Every time I am amazed and enchanted that this is still going on! Truly DW is the Earthly Paradise!

All the good stuff continues to be archived at rheinsberg :)

Comments

Re: Poniatowski - Et in Borussia Ego: It's Fritztime

[cahn]

LOL. So what is your thought on this? Somewhere in between the two, I expect? I mean, Fritz... does have a tendency to insult everyone. But he did get along with / made a good impression on some people, like Mitchell, so I imagine that Hanbury-Williams was not perhaps the most... diplomatic envoy ever, either/

This also explains at least one reason that P. didn't have a great picture of Fritz, though, lol.

Re: Poniatowski - Et in Borussia Ego: It's Fritztime

[mildred_of_midgard]

Hard to say. Both authors agree Fritz wasn't inclined to interact with foreign diplomats, and he might have been more forthcoming to his only ally during the Seven Years' War than in 1750, when he was insulting every power in Europe (which even ultra-faithful Lehndorff confirms). So Mitchell might have seen Fritz at his best, and everyone agrees that if you see Fritz at his best, you are immediately charmed.

I don't know much about Hanbury-Williams as a person, but if Fritz made a bad first impression by insulting him, it doesn't surprise me if that experience didn't bring out the best in Hanbury-Williams. I imagine he would be, even if not offended personally, offended as a representative of a powerful nation that has just been snubbed. And then he might have hung around in Prussia looking at everything with a jaundiced eye, until Fritz got around to making a better impression.

This also explains at least one reason that P. didn't have a great picture of Fritz, though, lol.

Would not surprise me!

Re: Poniatowski - Et in Borussia Ego: It's Fritztime

[selenak]

Poniatowski: The Chevalier Williams was the best, loveliest, most awesome man I ever met, I crushed on him as a teen and through my 20s, and the King of Prussia was an ass. This is not even a matter of debate. I heart Williams, and not just because he enabled my affair with Catherine, big time. Did I mention the first time I seriously argued with him because I was the Saxon envoy and he was the British one in St. Peterburg, I nearly threw myself off the balcony until he pulled me back?

German Wiki: is much much more detailed about Williams than English wiki and seems to think it was more Fritz' fault in this particular case AND that Williams still put other people's backs up in his own right. ("His government sent him to Vienna next to be more pointed than the previous envoy, Robert Keith. He was so pointed that the Empress was angry and Williams had to leave.")

German Wiki also: Williams had syphilis, with some of his temper outbursts in later years because of it, he was eventually locked up by his family and died of it.

English wiki: has none of this.

Re: Poniatowski - Et in Borussia Ego: It's Fritztime

[mildred_of_midgard]

I seriously need to just start checking German wiki by default, even when it's about an Englishman! I've said this to myself before and still haven't developed the habit.

Thank you.